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Rabbi warns leaders: No more pullouts
Zvi Alush
Published: 02.03.06, 09:28
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29 Talkbacks for this article
1. The evidence is there
D.M.Meyer ,   Jerusalem   (03.02.06)
Based on empirical evidence, that the 4pM's who touched the Land all lost power - Rabin, Netanyahu, Barak & Sharon - the Rabbi is correct!
2. Kol HaKavod
moish goldman ,   Israel   (03.02.06)
Rav Eliyahu is a true Gadol HaTorah and Manhig Yisroel. He is worthy of my standing up for him when he enters a room. May He be blessed with many long years and that he merit to see Moshiach as he is one who has no need to be ashamed in front of the Moshiach!
3. Kook
Michael Steiner ,   EU   (03.02.06)
This guy should be sectioned under the Mental Health Act and taken to a lunatic asylum. In rhetoric and appearance, he's the same as any mad Iranian mulah. #1: what are you: stupid? David Ben Gurion never touched any land and he lost power, too. Seems you have a slight problem with your theory there. Jesus christ, whom am I dealing with here...
4. Rabbis out of control
Matan ,   Israel   (03.02.06)
Government decides politics, Rabbis are not elected to make decisions about land!!
5. #3 Michael
Ez ,   Tel Aviv   (03.02.06)
So now we know all about you. First of all, calling on Jesus Christ is not quite proper. See, you are dealing with Rabbinic leaders. Jews, and Rabbis, for that matter, do not believe in Jesus Christ. Secondly. in the Soviet Union, as well as facist countries, anyone who the government did not like was sentaced to prison or sent to a mental hospital. So really, you are a christian facist, who feels that anyone who says something you disagree with should be hidden away. Who appointed you king of the world?
6. It is suicidal to withdrawl from strategic positons
Ben Temalion ,   Shiloh, MO USA   (03.02.06)
While the unelcted party that leads an illegal gov't to bash skulls of Jews with extreme prejudice, they aer also desicrating the blood on the land won in defensive battleswon, yet spoils not won. The Hamicidal Hamites from their Peninsula continue to be funded, armed and trained including the victims. Expel the pins in your eyes and those who fund arm and train them.
7. Thanks for the laugh
human ,   This world   (03.02.06)
Talkbacks on israeli and arabic media are pretty similar when it comes to religious subjects. Maybe you ARE cousins after all. Hehe ... touched land and lost power ... hehe ... thanks for the laugh .. Cheers, Me
8. One way or another
Richard ,   Paris   (03.02.06)
All prime ministers end up loosing power (at least in democratic countries) , they most get gravelly ill and sooner or later they day (from natural or less natural causes). The same stands for rabbis, whatever they views are on land matters, and for every human being. Rabbis have no more grip on health and power matters than electricians, painters accountants, prostitutes or lawyers.
9. #5:
Michael Steiner   (03.02.06)
"Jesus Christ" is where I live a standard exclamation of surprise, fear and/or exasperation. It carries no religious connotations. Either way, I'm not a Xian, whom I don't particularly like anyway. And if both fascists and communists did what you say, then why am I not a communist according to you but a fascist? But enough frivolity. This "rabi" is an idiot to begin with. That per se is not a problem. Rabis and "rabis" having political opinions is not a problem either. The problem is that the datim are exercising a vastly disproportionate influence in Israel as it is. They hold a privileged position even though 50+ per-cent of Israelis are not religiou at all, and 80+% do not follow this "rabi's" "teachings." So when this elite (comparable to the mad mulahs of Iran or Saudiyah) spews drivel such as the specimen from this article, I have every right to say I think he's insane and should have some goodass counselling to work through his many issues.
10. Many Great leaders have died for peace
Judith ,   haifa, Israel   (03.02.06)
Interestingly enough none of the Leaders were or are deterred by meshuga rabbis who mentally are not living in the 21st century, and find it hard to accept a modern democratic state. Sorry but you rabbis are out of touch with the ever changing reality of the modern world (as all religious fanatics of all faiths). As for Gaza, I don't see that God was very interested in the strip; he did nothing to prevent it from being evacuated of Jewish settlers. Somehow I have a feeling that he won't mind further recessions in the West bank (even if it somehow costs the life of a leader).
11. #1, #3, #5
Michael ,   Tel Aviv   (03.02.06)
@1: If you have empirical evidence consisting of 4 observations, noone will buy it! Furthermore, it is in the nature of democratic leaders to lose their power after a certain period. In this case you may speak of empirical evidence. @3: You cannot send anyone having strange ideas to a loony bin, but I guess you didn't mean it literally anyway. @5: take a dictionary and look for "idiom", look at Michael Steiner's residence and try to combine it. Maybe it helps. Calling people "facists" is very strong; the only thing you will achieve with using it for everyone who does not agree with you (or orthodox ideas) is a present to the real facists. I guess in your logic I am also one of them.
12. !
thr ,   prs   (03.02.06)
Imprison this criminal inciting violence.
13. Seperate shul & state
Peter ,   Amsterdam, NL   (03.02.06)
It's been said before...one of Ben Gurion's mistakes in 1948 was giving in to pressure from the religious establishment to give them exclusive right to marriage & burial cermonies and funding for yeshivas(paid by the secular taxpayer). 'Tseniut"(modesty) isn't in the books of chief rabbis it seems. Calling it meshugah is putting it mildly. See what Shas does at the elections.
14. more evidence (to #11)
A statistician ,   Beit Shemesh   (03.02.06)
let me add some more evidence: A) gonen "m & m's" segev betrayed Isarel and went to JAIL. B) Aryeh "Rabin gov't" Deri betrayed Israel and went to JAIl. C) Omri Sharon - we'll see what his corrupt bagatz buddies do. So you are either DEAD or in JAIL. now the data set has SEVEN elements and not FOUR. i invite other readers to think of more examples - i'm sure there are plenty.
15. He didn't incite violence or threaten anybody
Chaya ,   Israel   (03.02.06)
All he said was "The Land" would take care of anyone who leaves parts of the Land of Israel. IF these so-called 'palestinians' were really interested in peace, believe me, the rabbis would be the first ones to sign the agreement. But I wouldn't want an agreement signed even if it meant peace, because this land doesn't belong to anyone but the Jewish people. Others can live here but only under Israeli rule and not as citizens. Otherwise, they can go to Jordan or the Sinai and set up a country there. And I'M not religious!
16. The Rabbi has the right
Aviel Ben-Eliyahu ,   Gothenburg, Sweden   (03.02.06)
If we have free speech and democracy, I can't see why so many of you (Michael, Matan) protest the idea that he expressed his opinion. Fine, you can disagree with it, even consider him an idiot (only an idiot would consider such an esteemed rabbi an idiot btw) but to call for seperation between "shul and state", as if the rabbi is in a position of political power, is ridiculous. And Matan, who said that he was elected? Who said that he "decided" on matters of land. He doesn't, but he expresses his daat torah. If you unfortunatley don't accept the torah, that is your right according to the state of Israel, but stop hate those who do.
17. Michael Steiner , EU
Samie ,   Chicago, USA   (03.02.06)
I have visited and read what Michael Steiner has to say for some time. There is only one conclusion a person can come to that he is a zero on an Intellectual level. and what he calls everyone else a parasite who must have his brain infected by The HIV bug. There is never anything honest; sincere; reliable in his political views. or worthy of discourse
18. More evidence to 14 (to the contrary)
JS   (03.02.06)
Menachem Begin--got depressed, resigns and dies. Rabbi Meir Kahana-- assassinated Yitschak Shamir-- lies demented in a nursing home. Shalhevet Pass-- gets shot in the head at age of 9 months. Eldad Abir-- shot and killed yesterday driving near his home in Shomron. And many others.... What were their sins? Sounds like "your" god (the one that does what you like) gets a little confused... maybe he is dead, too. Sounds to me that Rabbi Eliyahu is losing it...
19. #10 Judith
Marcel ,   Florida   (03.02.06)
What Peace ? Are you so easily decieved to be sold a bag of peace which upon opening is full of blood and death ? The Rabbi has something you don't,two eyes wied open.
20. Rabbi warns leaders no more pull outs
leah amdur ,   Jerusalem Israel   (03.02.06)
The goyim and talmidim of the goyim, alias the g-dfree apikorsim aruv rav/amelekim become very unhinged whenever they are threatened by the rabbis. They are terrified by they realise that there is a G-d of Israel. I am a nurse and I have seen many people die. When they die they suddenly all think of G-d, even the g-dless ones
21. something New..
keren ,   sao paulo   (03.02.06)
I can not understand why Israel doesn't try something NEW. Accordigly to new polls amongst Palestinians,93% of them wish ,first than all,to have their life's condition improved for the new government...Those wishes come first than any other wish, such as keeping criminal assaults against Israel,keeping peace talks,truces and etc...So,why Israel doen't make a direct deal with them and INSTEAD of giving up more Land,help them in their wishes,as improving their lifes,giving them good schools for their children(with a commit for them not being tought against Jews,of course),giving them hospitals,universities,helping them to learn how to make them ends meet,etc. That would cost much less for Israel than disengagements and other expenses related to it,and instead would bring a Love mood that would influence everybody,from ortodox religious to secular Jews and to Palestinians. Why don't change the parameters? Isn't about time yet??
22. answer to keren
uryfred ,   Israel   (03.02.06)
more than 25% of israel's population and more than 34% in israeli minors (below 18) are living under poverty line. totally separating from our neighbours and taking care of OUR OWN poors ist the most urgent thing to do.
23. to Uryfred #22
keren ,   sao paulo   (03.02.06)
So,fight for it! It is really incredible that in Israel something like that is happening! Money is being thrown out wrongly! Government is getting weak,confused,it seems to me. Israel should take the reins of its Destiny back to its own hands and proudfully lead the Destiny of its People. Something wrong is going on there.You Yisraelis,in my opinion,are getting spoiled for wrong values. We,Jewish people,have the most valorous Ethics ,and so we should get tied (or re-tied) to it again.
24. Why Rabin, Barak, etc are hated and forgotten.
Yariv ,   Tel Aviv   (03.02.06)
You wouldn't sell Rabin/Barak Oslo plan to a stupid dude. They are hated by everyone. The same for Sharon. Already most people are making jokes about the fat vegetable.
25. to keren#23
uryfred ,   Israel   (03.02.06)
So right you are! Some of us are fighting, in democratic ways, for the ethical values you mentioned: On March 28th we will have elections for the Knesset. How about your contribution? We need educated energetic young people, do you intend to "make alyia"?
26. G_D DOESN'T LIKE PULLOUTS
Arik Silverman ,   Milwauikee USA   (03.02.06)
38:9 And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother. 38:10 And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also.
27. to Uryfred #25
keren ,   sao paulo   (03.02.06)
Yes,one day I intent to make alyia;but untill then,I wish you a very good result comming up from the elections on 28th march!
28. Steiner
Hilda ,   USA   (03.03.06)
If anyone is a Kook it is you.. On second thought. You must be a rich kook . Whoever is paying you to revile the Atate of Israel must be getting his money's worth which of course keeps you writing. Of one thing I am certian. A Jew you are not.
29. MAKES TORAH UP AS HE GOES ALONG...
Daniel ,   New York   (03.03.06)
Who does this Rabbi Eliyahu think he is? He has declared that holding onto every inch of Eretz Yisroel is more important than anything else, including saving lives. This is against Torah and against everything the Gedolim have said throughout history. You can argue whether withdrawals will save lives or not, but you cannot make territory the supreme value of Torah never to be outweighed by other considerations. It seems like his Torah views are geared to fit an extreme political view, and he just makes things up to fit these views. This is wrong and against Hashem. it is a Chillul Hashem to misinterpret in such a blatant way.
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