SInce the fence was begun suicide attacks have all but stopped. This is itself a great advantage. The suicide attacks were carried out "on the cheap" using young, usually mentally unstable civilians. Now any attack must be carefully planned and carried out by competent trained personnel. This is a great benefit and not to be ignored. Unfortunately, it is not enough. No one strategy is ever enough. "Hands off" is not a strategy. Keep the fence - just do a lot of additional hard thinking to solve the other problems the fence can't solve.

The Armored Corps, which is the backbone of the IDF and Israel's military deterrence, once had traditions of competence, following the rules, keeping prepared and generally being as humanly perfect as its tanks were technologically perfect. The victories of the 6-day War and the feats of Force Tzvika and the other heroes who held the Golan in the opening days of the Yom Kippur War are all legendary. What has happened? Why are tankists disobeying basic rules of tank warfare and getting away with it? Why are their officers not held responsible? If the officers in Kerem Shalom had been doing their job and upholding the old Armor standards, there could have been no kidnapping and we would not now be involved in military action which will probably cost lives and will probably also embroil us with the international community. Find out who is responsible - all the way up the chain of command - and make them pay the price. The soldiers in Gaza are already paying. What has happened?

The problem in my opinion is the idea that Israel could retreat behind a fence and hunker down like France in 1940 is absurd and can't work. But has a defensive measure it's certainly valid. But, you can't forget the offense. That too has too be part of the doctrine.

Facts, logic, and truth. Too late as usual. Reality here is difficult, but Israelis--leaders and populace--must stop going in for cheap slogans and quick-fixes if we're to survive. The fence was a nonsense idea from the beginning. Two small Middle Eastern countries with a lot of enemies nearby and a precarious security situation--Jordan and Kuwait. Do you see them building fences around themselves?

Like so many Israeli columnists, there is no lack of criticism of policies designed to, in fact, make Israel more secure. But, again I ask, what are the alternatives. The good (retired) general has some points. Many have been saying much the same thing...the fence was out of date before it is even finished. (No matter it has proven itself in the area of suicide bombers). Perhaps the fact that it still isn't finished, has something to do with continuing Arab violence (and retaliation). I had my misgivings about it from the beginning, but remember the outcry about Israeli moves against Arab towns and cities to thwart attacks of every kind. Bottom line: what other barriers can Israel realistically construct? Are there any? To say that the fence was some sort of political maneuver...seems nonsensical. Israel has made other mistakes which had the support of most, such as the disengagement. It may not be the fence at fault, but human error (why was the tank not guarded?).

Stop blaming unknown ministers1 Don't be too smart now. When is your idol Peres admit in public that he is responsible for death of many, mamy Jews and ready to go to jail?

He prefers Israel to invest in SHin bet ...well they will spend during a year 10 Bn of shekel in the Shin bet then the situation will remain exactly the same. Whereas Israel may be loosing time and money during the construction of the wall but when it will be finished, just small operations ( and not mass murder in disco or market ) will hardly occur ( and intelligence says that this action was prepared for a longh time). the benefits will be huge because , in 2-3 years they can invest those missing 10 Bn of shekel in the shin bet with a wall that can protect Israel . Israel's security will be simply more effective in a very short term. sorry for my english

in the west bank they aren't able to dig tunnels due to the hard terrain. So the fence is and will be effective in the west bank.

The continued terrorist attacks, the rain of kassams, and this new, tragic development of kidnappings is only a small taste of what's to come. Yet, although the security fence has been proven to be useless and actually damaging to Israel, Olmert still promotes this pipe-dream of a policy. Does he take into considerations the need for Israeli security? Not at all. All Olmert cares about is riding his "realignment" horse to the finish, no matter what the consequences.

THERE IS TECHNOLOGY FOR DETECTING TUNNELS. IT NEEDS TO BE USED!

the article seems like like the wanderings of a lost or perhaps senile person. It is pointless for me to try and correct the obvious irrational thinking behind the article as to do so would only be to lend the article some credence. If someone were to say, 'the moon looks yellow tonight because I had cornflakes for breakfast' then one would just dismiss the speaker as having lost it. Did anyone read this rot before publishing it ? The statistics for the fence speak for themselves! I wish the author many long 'quiet' 'years in retirement!

Dr. Hisdai is trying to uncover the false reality that Olmert is promoting, the same false reality that you and so many other people have bought into. This is the misconception that the fence provides security! Yes, it does stop a large proportion of suicide bombers, but the concept of security is so much more than that. Security means the absence of threat, the feeling of freedom and the quality of life we Israelis are lacking because of terrorism. The only way to achieve a real security is by ending terrorism completely, not hiding behind a wall and pretending it will just go away. Attaining this security is no small task and it can only be done with a mix of military deterrence and attacking the root of terrorism which lies in the fundamentalist Islamic education that has been inculcated in the PA for decades. This will take a long time and above all, a lot of patience, but one thing is for sure. Olmert's plans for Israel's future will not bring security, as he is selling the Israeli public a quick fix. Olmert is promoting a defensive policy and uses the fence to justify it. Will this end the hate education that perpetuates terrorism? Will this deter terrorists and make them think twice about their murderous deeds? No. In the terrorists' eyes, they are winning the battle and Israel is running to hide behind a big, cement wall.

There was sound judgement in building the fence, and it has proven to be effective. Other measures must be taken against missles and tunnels. The only 100% sure way is if the Arabs actually struggle for peace instead of against it. You miss these points entirely. Separation is the best thing. What the Kenesset must now do is look at ways to immediately separate electricity, water, and trade from the Arabs in Gaza and let them get it all themselves or with Egypt's help. I dont think an airport in Gaza is wise, nor large ships, but small cargo ships yes. The remaining trade can go through Egypt, not just walking crossings. israel doesnt need the money and headaches of transporting Arab goods from Gaza at this present time. If Arabs in Gaza choose to use this economic freedom to obtain large weapons instead of growing the economy, then Gaza needs to be razed into another desert and its population moved to Sinai. If on the other hand, Gaza is used for economic growth, then Israel can re-evaluate trade with the Arabs in another 5-50 years based on what the Arabs do.

How true.Politicians take note.

it is not about an olive tree or fage tree it is about what in the hearts ,,it is an arabic saying so it is not the economy or the water and electricity it is something else in my heart and in yours

This horse of fear and worry displayed by a certain politician whose dance with these elements has destroyed several important institutions. This person is now a senior government minister. >>> Who is this person? Haim Ramon is my guess. Why the gentlemen wouldn’t tell us the name? Cowardice? I don’t think so. Author need to understand, readers don’t know who he is talking about. Even people like me who know personalities and Israeli politics have a hard time. It shows author is not very thoughtful. <<< This politician has been searching for a new horse to ride upon, and found it in the idea of a fence. He sold it to his party, where it's potential to be a great solution that would bring great political reward – and that party began making threats, assisted by the Sharon government. >>> Very simplistic. The idea of the fence was debated endlessly in Israel. Israeli public overwhelmingly support it. Not blindly but knowingly.<<< Such an analysis would have made clear that the benefits of the fence are extremely limited. It may stop potential suicide bombers, but it can't stop operations over or under the wall. >>> Nobody claimed the fence is 100% effective in stopping terror. Nothing is. Israeli public NEVER assumed it is 100% effective, they are too smart..<<< Even its ability to stop terrorists from completing their missions is limited by time; as long as Palestinians retain their desire to strike us, it is only a question of time until they find a way to get around the barrier. >>> True, but this is the reason a plumber has many tools in his toolbox. You need many tools to fix a problem. There is not one tool, which can fix everything<<< Against this temporary and limited advantage is the cost, which currently stands at about NIS 10 billion.>>> Once again this terminology “ limited” Why wouldn’t you call Shin Bet operations “ limited”? After all Shin Bet is not 1005 effective either...<<< Somebody must investigate if there isn't a better use for this money. >>> I believe this has been investigated by economists and the government, human life doesn’t have a price tag<<>> As I said previously, Those are two different “tools” You need them both. Plus there is not a price for human life. There are many considerations, not just economical. The bottom line the fence is going to be a border between Israel and Their “State” since we are sick and tired of “ Palestinians”.<<<

...And that is to say nothing of the geographic twists, the international damage, the ruined view and blow to nature, and mainly the terrible hatred heaped on to already strong anti-Israel hatred on the Palestinian side of the fence. >>>We suffer “international damage” for so many years, dear “historian”... Do you think they going to like Jews regardless? They hate us, it is given. Why not to do what we know we have to do? Arabs like only dead Jews or somebody like Chomsky, who helps them to achieve this goal. Now you talk about “ blow to the nature” So now we are talking about “ nature” and how we hart environment? I am speechless. You haven’t mentioned ONCE Israeli citizens who were murdered in cold blood; children elderly, blown up discos and Passover Seders... now “ the nature what bothers you? You are heartless and misguided individual, not sensitive to humanity. Typical leftist who cares more about being true to his “progressive” religion, than humanity. Shame on you!.<<< But the fence was an illusion, and the country bought it happily. The "Council for Peace and Security" of IDF officers, distinguished more for their military ranks and past achievements than for their analytical prowess, came up with the moronic phrase "saying goodbye," and the country celebrated this fantastic solution. >>> I see “ moronic “ in you instead. I have seen lots of stupidity both in the military and in academia. You can have many skills but still remain stupid, doctor general, ask Ehud Barak and Yossi Beilin<<< The fences' success around Gaza was one of the most important proofs for the fences effectiveness. Now, this proof has blown up in our faces. >>> Not true. No suicide bombing came from Gaza. No fence can protect from missiles. Tunnel only comes from desperation. Exception, not the rule. As I said before, this is just one “ tool” read on<<< The failure at Kerem Shalom revealed one of the results of this addiction to magic solutions. Building the fence was accompanied by the phrase "Us here, them there.'" That is to say: let's set a border, we will no longer concerned about them, and they will no longer be concerned about . >>> Magic solution was your Oslo Trojan horse agreements, ask President of Israel Moshe Katsav. People like you who brought this disaster are responsible for this bloodshed in the first place. Talking about “magic solutions”... Plus the idea of the fence came from the left in the first place. Sharon resisted in the beginning... Ramon came from the heart of the hearts of Labor, genius.<<< Turns out that this sweet deception influenced more than the IDF. The Security Fence became a flash point for military operations, and pushed off basic professional principles. They are indeed there – and therefore, there is no need to look back or plan for their attacks. >>> The whole idea of the fence is to protect citizens of Israel from dangerous results of failed Oslo concepts, supported by loonies like you.<<<

Part two should came right after part one. Thanks.

Was this the culture of the Nazis?

the wretched fence should be demolished.thosewho want it should be deported to where they came from.

The Nazis deported and murdered Jews not Arabs. In fact many Arabs admired and colloborated with Nazis. As for the idea of deporting and murdering populations, study what happened to the Christian Armenians and Greeks at the hands of the Ottoman Caliphate 25 years before the Nazis

The author is a wolf is sheep's closing, and the article a right-wing agenda hidden in tones of supposed moderation. The "extremely limited" benefit of the fence is in the the untold hundreds of suicide-bomber victims who were caught and arrested because of the fence. Anyone that does not believe that the fence improved Israel's security dramatically not only suffers from selective memory, but from selective hearing. Security analysts in all branches of the security apparatus attest to the fence's contribution to the overall security. And as to the cost? How many billions have been invested in far-flung settlement and their protection? The author is mistaken if he believes that Kerem Shalom destroyed the basis for the Gaza disengagement. Disengagement was meant to do two things: make Israel safer while simulatenously ending the worst of the occupation, in effect 94% of it, leaving the other 6 for negotiation. The first objective is obvious and achieved. Israel is measurably safer than it was. The second objective is morally required. Ending the occupation is not a concession to the Palestinians, it is a partial return to the moral foundations of Israel and Zionism never to rule another people. Recent and not so recent history has proven that the security argument for remaining in the territories holds no water. We are simply not safer when we rule the lives of people who do not want to be ruled. Ending most of the occupation unilaterally is in recognition of the immoral and impractical nature of occupation itself, as well as the recognition of the impossibility of a negotiated settlement in the near future. Kfar Shalom shows us that disengagement is not the end of the conflict. But living in this area of the world Israel has learned to make hard choices in the past. There is no practical who would not prefer altercations at the border and kassams to suicide bombings. It is at the border that soldiers can put up a fight, with the right intelligence and protocol, and not when we send them to patrol Gaza and the West Bank. It is now the Israeli right, and this author, who are playing the game of fear for cheap political gain. The murder and burial of Eliyahu Asheri is only the most recent example of the cynical exploitation of a grieving family for political goals, an action that should have us all disgusted. During a military action to save the soldier Israel must be united, not petty. Can anyone truly bring themselves to believe that things would have been better, that the kidnapping would not have occured, that the kassams would not have fallen, had Likud or, God-forbid, the National Union-Mafdal had been in power? It is these political hacks that are attempting to topple the government during a military operation on the backs of the very victims of Hamas.