Do you really see a similarity between Israel and Hamas (the PA and Hamas are now the same) ? There is none ! Israel is a strategic ally and the relationship between the US and Israel is symbiotic. They work together in almost every area and Israel is in many ways the 51st State. IIsrael does not ask the world for money and tell it 'you owe us and it's not fair that you won't give us any more handouts'. Israel is a highly productive hi-tech country that benefits the whole world as against Hamas/PA who are sponges. Please take a look at the following which I just uploaded for you .. http://www.yearinbrazil.com/misc/boycott.txt Mike anglo/american

Don’t Forget Mr. Same that >>> 1) there is no money allowed to enter the Palestinian authority. to do such things 2) the Israelian themselves NOT Mr Haneah don’t make any choice to the young people . 3) Hamas Said that we accept the 1967 borders but Israel refused. 4) We as a Palestinians youth looking forward to get our independent and to live in peace. But Israel must have the same idea. Thanks...

Ok Redmike, that article was totally irrelevant to my talkback. I never said to boycott Israeli products. That's a totally separeate issue. My point is not arguing that Israel is not high tech, productive, large econmy, etc. And if so, why do you continue to take and take from us ? Where do american people get money from Israeli tax dollars ? I don't think ever. And we convert loans that we give Israel into grants that are never paid back. Yet, in African/Third world countries we take the loans, and send collections agencies to collect the loan + interest. Why do we GIVE our dollars to you ? What do you do for us ? I don't mean to sound anti-semitic, and i'm not against Jews or Judaism..... That's not the point. I'm making the point to you, that why don't you let the Palestinans live in peace. Why doesn't Israel draw back to the 1967 borders. Let them be a sovreign nation, so they can collect tax dollars, build a proper infrastucture (that is not controlled by the Israellis). Maybe then, we can start to have some semblance of a peace process. Please stick to the facts, I never called for a boycott of Israeli products. I simply asked you to turn the question of giving money and collecting tax dollars..... And ask, what do you do for the money and gifts that you receive from us ? Think about it my friend.

So Hamas issues a "warning" to the international community - despite the declaration of its leaders that they will never recognize Israel. There may be a new government in Gaza, but they still won't do what is required for EVERYONE to live together in peace. With Palestinian leadership like that, it's quite clear that only the Israelis want genuine peace. From Hamas, we hear little more than the usual hate, which the international community would do well to avoid rewarding.

Direct aid to Israel by the US gov. = also indirect aid by the US gov. to its local armament industry, Boeing, etc. Think about it my friend.

Reality check, Ummah

Ehud Barak offered Arafat the 67 borders and East Jerusalem in exchange for peace and recognition, twice even! Arafat refused (twice) and insisted on the Right of Return, which is perhaps the most bupkiss right in the world. Being a refugee is not inherited, but for palestinians, it is. Why? oh who knows. What you don't get is that the palestinians do not want their own state, they want Israel. Everything for them is geared towards this goal. They have never deviated, they have never decided otherwise. They may disagree on the 'how' but the 'what' is clear for all to see. If Israel had an aneurism and gave the Palestinians everything, guess what would happen next? Everything will be awesome when Israel returns to the 48 borders. And even if that happened, there would be a push to simply wipe the jewish state from ALL maps. The US benefits tremendously from Israel, and in fact the world at large. ALOT ALOT ALOT of IT (but not only this) is developed in Israel. Oh and the US gives alot of money to alot of countries, just like Israel. Israel doesn't even receive the most. It's just everyone likes to whine about Israel ad infinitum. Shabbat Shalom

Did you know there are no Muslims countries in the top 25 of foreign aid donors, why? The USA is #1 by far. If the USA had a magic wand we would end poverty every where in the world today but many countries would be back in poverty the next day because of their corrupt systems. should we apologize for the USA giving money to encourage countries to stop drug trade, encourage democratic institutions, stopping slave trade, provide economic development, food aid, etc. Yes the USA government uses our hard earn tax dollars to make the world a better place in lack of a magic wand because a better world means a better America. Yes Israel gets about 2.5 billion a year and Palestines were getting $400 million but lets remember Iraq is getting 7 billion, Afghan 1 billion, Egypt 750 million, Sudan 575 million, Jordan 368 million, Pakistan 224 million just to name a few Muslim countries. Remember the rest of the world also gives to the Middle East while few give to Israel. I don't care how Israel spends their money . But I see a real need for them to defend themselves and I guess if you clicked onto the link then you are aware of all the contributions Israel has accomplished to make the world a better place.

All of the tax dollars given by the US EU to the PA over the years has been enough for each of the PA Arabs to buy their own private villa. Instead, our tax dollars have been and are used for the war against Jews and global jihad against the free world's infidels. There are strings attached to US money to Israel. With this money Israel is not allowed to purchase military weapons from their own country of Israel. All purchases of military weapons must be purchased from America. Besides this, Israel provides America with vital information and also valuable high technology - Jews are amazing inventors.

All of the tax dollars given by the US EU to the PA over the years has been enough for each of the PA Arabs to buy their own private villa. Instead, our tax dollars have been and are used for the war against Jews and GLOBAL JIHAD against the free world's infidels. Many Americans are deeply distressed and disgusted our tax dollars to the PA/PLO finance terrorism and mass murder of Jews. There are strings attached to US money to Israel. With this money Israel is not allowed to purchase military weapons from their own country of Israel. All purchases of military weapons must be purchased from America - America gets back every dollar that goes to Israel. Besides this, Israel provides America with vital information and also valuable high technology - Jews are amazing inventors.

the article was only to demonstrate that there is no comparison between Israel and Hamas. The theme of this talk is whether or not Hamas should get hand outs and your question to me was 'why should Israel get aid?' and it's talking apples and oranges. As regards to the 67 borders the chances of peace and withdrawal are zero for the foreseeable future. Hamas is sworn to Israel's destruction so why would Israel give them land ? Hamas doesn't want land and says that the land belongs to G*d. Hopefully things will change in the region but it will not be soon. The Palestinians had one leadership that bled them dry and now has one that wants to rule the world :-( And they still indoctrinate their children with violence and hatred - very sad. Israel would love to be at peace with the Palestinians and to help them move into the 21st century but you can't offer your hand to someone that wants to cut it off ! Mike

The poison of asps is under their tongue. The will meet their Just end. Their day is coming.

Thank you wonderful, merciful G-D - You are our Hero forever! And thank you Israel for being a channel of G-D's blessings! ISRAEL FOREVER !

Juan As an American and Israeli tax payer I understand what you are saying. But you seem to have missed the most important part of the article that you are responding to: "Haniyeh made clear Hamas was willing "in this stage" to accept a state in the Gaza Strip, the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem. But Hamas remains committed to establishment of a Muslim state in all of British-mandated Palestine, including what is now Israel." The '67 boarders are not going to buy us peace just a delay while Hamas tries to build more military might in order to take the rest of Israel. As it is you have Iran and Hamas trying to rebuild the Ottoman empire in their political retoric why should we give them a chance to make it real? They are already announcing their plans to use America "humanitarian aide" to fund attacks on Israel. This from your generous government's attempts to help those who are starving because their leaders r prefer guns and fighting to food and peace. As it is this last cease fire has only resulted in 450+ missile attacks and more than a dozen attempts at bombing innocent people. If they would decide that they want peace the whole world would start giving them aide and Israel would be happy to give them peace - they were offered everything except the right of return by Bill Clinton and Arafat answered by starting the second intifada.

First Redmike thanks for the link it is great and informative. I once looked at the history of the Nobel Prize winners, While the Jewish people only make up 0.5% of the world population appox.12.5 mil vs 1.4 bil Muslims there are only 3-4 Muslim Nobel winners none for medicine or science in the 100+ years it has existed. While Jewish people have dozens in science and medicine. Juan, first almost no cash is given to Israel. Much of the aid comes in the form of a) loan guarantee's which allows Israel to get a lower interest rate. Israel has never missed a payment and no laons have ever been forgiven. b) When checks are written to Israel there is a stipulation that only 26% of the money can be spent in Israel. The 76% left is spent here in the U.S.. This provides jobs in 48 states. c) After the the 67 war Israel captured a hugh amount of USSR weapons that Israel turned over to the US because many had never been seen before. During the cold war Israel provided the CIA with info using thier informants in Russia. The night vision targeting on the Apache Attack Helicoptor is Israeli. At least 2 US missle systems have Israeli guidance systems making them more accurate. The new drone surveillance planes being used now in Iraq and Afganistan by the US military are Isareli made and designed just to name a few things, I could go on but I think you see the point. There is plenty of payback by Israel.

All the money even if you don't know or believe it came back to your pocket, or your nation's pocket. We get 1 milion 2 buy an airplain but we want 20 so we use your one million to buy one and buy 19 with our own money (It's not 1 ofcourse, it's 20 or something like that, but that's the main Idea). every piece of money that you "gave" us came back to you by one way or another. Not only that but do you think the the life of Americans=money ? Because I think that a life of an Israeli=money (to the nation... he pays taxes and he might just start a start-up) and now hear this - your airplain all the electorinics, aye mighty ours that's why when you have bad weather or a technical problem you can land or keep flying and now to the aircrafts all your guiding system, missiles or aircraft, ours. Manuvering ? ours. The simulators you learn to fly in ? Ours. The reason why your army isn't shit ? We. The reason why the USSR didn't kick your ass ? Ohh, because ours pilots with our technology took down every USSR aircraft even when russian pilots were in it ! We proved the West > East with out pilots and technology. The American huge companies who make billions or more ? All of them have a reaserch center here because if they won't they will loose to a company that has one. Now where does all the money those company made goes too ? Ohh, right, to your health, security and more by ur goverment. Ohh and most impornatnly, does Israel need to US ? No, before the US we has France and after France the USSR wanted to be our alley. Israel is the US frontline and EU frontline, PA ? They are the people who seek your death. Therefore saying that we are how did you say ? Ohh right "Hypocrites" is well, think about it your self while you live on what we gave you. Have a nice day.

What a stupid analogy. Being what you are - you obviously have no idea of the contribution, or if you do - ignore it - that Israel adds to the relationship with the US. Its a very, very deep relationship and certainly NOT all one way as you have said. I suppose grasping the 'big picture' to you is a trip to the movies? Its regrettable that you have called someone else in the forum a 'hypocrite' - You are not smart enough to be one yourself.

Whats he gonna do send over a bunch of stinkbombs? Our "native Canadians" our the same way, always have there hand out.. They want more and more, and when they think the've been given enough they misbehave. I suggest,, you have yourselves to blame,, the pals are a primitave people, and should be treated as such. There is no reasoning with them, and look who they pray too?? They would have more luck praying to the easter bunny and the tooth fairy. Israel has to set some new rules.. these ilitarates need to be put in there place. If you hit now, and hard it will buy you about 20 years. Unfortunatly your brave leaders will buy you about 20 mins.

Haniyeh is 'subtly' letting the world know that this summer war will be started by Gazan terrorists. He is then going to try and connect the world's ignoring of their demands, and blame that on their decision to go to war. Nonsense. They have been planning this war since last summer. Just like Arafat's 'spontaneous' intifada.

These fools from Hamas don't realize that is exactly what Israel is hoping for. The best thing that could happen is for the monkees from Hamas to do away with the ceasefire thereby giving Israel a free hand to wipe them out, a move that would be supported by the rest of the free world. All the monkees from Hamas can do is beat their chests like the apes they are.

The pals are just like our indians. Since we won Canada hundreds of years ago, we have been been held hostage by the indians. Enough is enough,, Israel, you were givin all this land, it is a bit of an insult to give it away to people that were never ment to live there. At this stage in history you have to have faith,, now more than ever. Not in an idiot like olmert and co, but faith in the one and only GOD

George Bush must be trembling Haniyeh has said that Hamas will reasses its options if the economic sanctions are not met. What exactly does he think that Hamas can do which is going to harm the west so badly that they are going to be scared into lifting the sanctions .. maybe he is threatening to end the palestian unity government thats not united anyway. Haniyeh obviously doesnt watch the news much otherwise he would have seen that men like Bush and Cheyney dont like being threatened if they dont change their policy. Especialy when he also says straight out we will defy the demands you are making ( recognise Israel )

didn't have a deep relationship. What I said was simply a response the question by redmik of why can't palestine stopy taking gifts. Whereas Israel takes many gifts from the US in the form of public and private contributions. It's not like Israel doesn't take $ from the US. You can paint the picture any way you like, the FACTremains is that you do take loans, lower % loans than any other nation. Nations that can't pay back, very poor nations. Yet we relieve much of your debt. Prove me all your facts that Israel never missed a payment, or has never been forgiven a debt. I think you will have a hard time with that. Anyone can make up facts and figures. You will never have peace with your Palestinian neighbors until you view them as human beings. The fact remains that while you may want to label the entire population as terrorists, that less than 1% of Palestinians commit suicide bomibgs. Yet Israel continues to punish the entire popluation. Ruthlessly. They can't even defend themselves, execept in the form of rock throwing or suicide bombings. Give peace a chance. Let them build their land. Stop building illegal settlements (by UN and Internation Law). Let them have the money that you have collected from them (yes in taxes, that you don't give back to them). See what would happen if Israel recognized the right of Palestine to exist......

I find this an insult from#48 #51, it's very ironic to throw indians and compare them being treated the way they been treated the last 200 years, I'm pro-Israel and I stand with them. I know from God's Holy word, they are being robbed from God's promised land to them. Indians have been pushed into reservations and robbed of their inherent right to live abroad also.

I have a simple question, why do you believe me about the low interest loans, and not believe me about payments never being missed and loans NEVER forgiven? THE U.S. HAS NEVER FORGIVEN ANY LOANS FOR ISRAEL. That is a fact!!! I can't help it if you don't want to believe. Prove me wrong!! But you want to believe the low % loans so you can attack Israel. very interesting. Israel has NEVER MISSED a PAYMENT. Sorry but that is the truth. 1) Israel has already accepted the two state solution, where have you been? 2)The UN resolution about settlements is a non-binding Resolution under Article (6) of the UN Charter. International Law understands the difference between and aggressor and a defender. A defender ( One Who Is Attacked and Defends Their Country) against 10 or 12 countries can keep the land they seize. That is the International Law, my friend. Now take a deep breath and count to 10.

Simply show me your evidence of this. The fact that you just say it, doesn't make me a believer. (show me some documented evidence) from a NON biased site to either side. just some simple facts. Israel accepted the two state solution with some pretty hefty pre agreement stipulations, including not even considering the right of return. Palestine made enormous concessions to the Oslo Accord(This is what i assume you are speaking to) And your UN resolution argument is very vague. If Israel accepted the two -state solution, then why has it not unilaterlly disengaged from the states proposed (west bank, gaza (yes i know they got out of there) and the portions of East Jerusalem)) deemed to be the Captial of the Proposed State of Palestine. Also, then why has not safe passage even been considered between the Gaza Strip and the West Bank ? Why is it that more and more settlemetns keep popping up ? And making the Palestinians live between pockets of land, which they can't even pass to get to work, school or medical appts ? Why are they forced to move thru checkpoints ?Tell me that..... The entire population is treated like prisoners...... It's complete apartheid and racism. Now i'm counting to ten..... Don't worry, i'm a calm person, i don't get worked up. Send me the facts, prove me wrong, i will apologize to the facts which i have mispreceived....

While the onus is on you to disprove the facts you don't believe, my source was Mitchell G. Bard his book " Myth and Facts A Guide To The Middle East " p.238-241 The UN Resolution argument was clear and concise.( not vague as you have stated ) Resolutions Under Article 6 of the UN Charter are not binding or law. Under Article 7 they are binding. Now you have admitted you were wrong , and Israel has accepted the two state solution. The right of return is a non-starter, because it would detroy Israel another way ( using demograghics ) so it not a serious offer by the Arabs. Also the checkpionts and the problems they cause the Pals is self inflicted. If they stop the terrorism the the checkpoints would be lifted. It Is entirely in the hands of the Pals. They control that situation.!!! Israel did disengage from Gaza and it is used as a base for daily rocket attacks. Why should Israel now withdrawl from the West Bank.?

First of all let me say that I will check out this book. I do believe, that if i'm arguing something, that yes, the onus is on me to disprove a fact. However, I can find other facts that disprove your fact. Which is correct. I think people believe what they want to believe. The gov't only tells us very little of what is true or not. I read something on wrmea.com which completely contradicts what you tell me. To your fact about whether or not i'm right about Israel accepting the two state solution, i don't remembver saying that Israel didn't accept it. As far as checkpoints go, end the occupation and the checkpoints, the wall. It all goes back to the illegal occupation. End the occupation, then maybe we can have peace. Think about it, no military occupation maybe will be no terrorism. Do not use Gaza as ending occupation. Israel controls the entire infrastucture in gaz, the border, the water, airspace, immigration/emmigration. This is still occupation. So not a good example. The simple (but hardest) solution here is peace. peace is harder than war. In order for Palis resistance Israel has to "End the occupation" for peace. You can't occupy and entire population and expect 0 resistance.

It is always good to have healthy debate. While I;m sure you can find facts that contradict mine would they be from a well researched source. But you are correct people tend to believe what they want. Since the Arabs could have had a country in 1948, but they chose war. After the Six Day War Israel was ready to trade land for peace and the famous 3 NO"S were issued by the Arab League. In 1973 they missed another chance. Now they want to go back and use resolutions that they rejected at the time. You can't do that in poker if you drop out and saw you could have won you can't come 10 or 20 or 30 years later and say i want to play that old hand and I won so pay me. Terrorist attacks have been conducted against Israel since 1949. Gaza is a good example because it illustrates land will be used as a base to attack Israel. I must say that I believe the Pals and rest of the Arab world want to destroy Israel. Hamas's Charter still calls for the destruction of Israel. Hamas has stated repeadedly they will not reconize Israel or honor past agreements. I would like to see peace, but the Pals won't or cannot stop the terrorism. Even the UN passed a resolution stating that murder bombing is against International Law and there is no good reason for it ,including occupation.

Respectfully, I appreciate the open dialogue. And you are correct, the Palestinians could have had a country in 1948/49 if they had adopted resolution 181. However, they didn't want to accept this becuase they had done nothing to have the Jewsish population come in and take over any of their land. That was a conscious decision they made, becuase they didn't want to be forced off of half of their land. Additionally, I believe this was the move need by Ben Gurion and the Zionists to take over the rest of the land including Jerusalem. Because there were no borders established, they could settle any of the land the pleased. Now 1967 was a different issue all together. After 1967 all the Pali population came under occupation. Now according to internation Law, after the 1967 conclict is resolved, under international law, refugees are entitled to return to their homes once the battlefield conflict has died down. This was not the case. Israel, as a member nation of the United Nations has this responsibiliity. They have never agreed to it. As well as the right of return. Again, International Law states: that the Palestinians have the right of return. I know this is a double edged sword, and a difficult subject to argue. But honestly, the rights of the Palestinians have been completly violated for 60 years. That is all what i'm saying. We need to think about the most possible ways to solve this confilct thru peace. I think once the Israelies realize that they have to also recognize Palestine, then we can continue to debate Hamas' charter and recognition of Israel. Since we are on the subject of the UN. Also, UN res. 242 states for the withdrawal from Westbank, Gaza and the establishment of East Jerusalem as the capital of the state of Palestine. Also, the settlements are illegal according to international law. In fact, there is a stipulation with the money Israel receives from the US (getting back to that) that no more settlements will be built. Yet some how Israel gets away with that and the building of the wall. (Which is on Palestinian land for the most part). It's a two way street. Also, many Zionists, Americans, Westerners see the Arabs as inhuman. This also has to change. Because statistically, I think very few Arabs/Muslims are terrorists. You have to establish a dialog and reach out to the population. Forget once and for all the negative propogonda about the Arabs. They also have to stop negatively depicting the Jewish population. Thank you for listening and not attacking my person. Shalom/Salaam