Jewish Scene  Uri Orbach
Taken out of context
Uri Orbach
Published: 11.04.07, 16:19
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19 Talkbacks for this article
1. MONEY MAKES THE WORLD GO AROUND...lalala
Danielle   (04.11.07)
2. Who cares what you eat and what you don't eat?
Talula ,   Israel   (04.11.07)
Do you honestly think anyone cares? This is Israel, people cash in on anything there. Sucker if you're taken in by it. Each to their own. You eat what you want to eat on Pesach and I will eat what I want to eat. So simple!
3. Here is the propblem
Avi ,   Israel   (04.11.07)
The world Jewish comunity is getting smaller and smaller, year in year out. We are now down to about 18 million people, and you are worried about eating kitniyot or not? kosher plastic spoons? kosher bleach???? You carry on with this nonsese and in few generations time there will be only one Jewish family left in the whole world, probably somewhere in mea shearim while the rest of us "used to be Jewish" will just live our lives with happiness as..........well as people.
4. Excellent Article! Avi (#3): excellent post!
Paqid 16 Netzarim ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (04.11.07)
5. You are all nuts!
Michel ,   Doha   (04.11.07)
Do you really think God cares about what s in your stomach? He cares what is in your hearts!
6. Unnecessary kashrut certification
Meira ,   Israel   (04.11.07)
Well done Uri Orbach! Its about time we halachlicy observant Jews spoke out about the commercialisation and misuse of kashrut certification. I also discovered "kosher Lepesach" on my bag of plastic spoons, but only after I had got them home, otherwise I would have done without them.
7. Correct & Incorrect, dumb dumb
Abraham ,   Houston, TX   (04.12.07)
I will skip commenting on the emotional responses as it does no one any good. Informed responses are always more interesting. Uri Orbach, in this article decided that research is not a journalistic excercise. On certain plastics powder is used to keep the different layers from adhering to each other (plastic plates...). You can go on and on. I was once at a lecture from someone from the OU. They where ased to give a hechsher on WATER and summarily refused as it does not need one. A competing brand got another hechsher and the company came back again. There are many things that happen behind the scene that we all don't know about, research, however, can clear many things up. Some companies have a policy of only buying certified item. Since it is a Non-Jewish buying agent that doesn't know better, he/she will insist on a certification for acid.. What can you do.
8. It's the same thing in the states
J K ,   NYC, USA   (04.12.07)
You see the bleach and the paper plates with kosher certification. Thats good because I wouldnt want to mix them up with pork-friend paper plates and the shrimp based cleaning solution. What a crock. It's about kashrut AND money.
9. Check out www.machonshilo.org
Ariel ,   Judean Hills   (04.12.07)
Nice article, but how did you miss Rav Bar-Hayim's work on this subject this year? It was even extensively covered by Ynet. He and Machon Shilo have a no-nonsense, halachic approach to correct this worrisome, sad trend.
10. Once again, poor research
RW ,   Jerusalem   (04.12.07)
"When it’s an actual issue of Jewish law, I don’t look for leniencies" Unless of course we're talking about judging people favourably. The reason you see this has nothing to do with evil kashrus organizations trying to make more money. In fact, it has NOTHING to do with them. It's called marketing. The company making this product knows that an uneducated consumer will more likely buy something with a kashrus certificate even if it doesn't need it. So, they get one. B'Datz simply makes sure that nothing treif happens concerning the production of the plasticware and gives it to them. Now, you might say, "What could be treif in plasticware?" Answer: Possibly many things. Take foil for example, that DOES need one since it's known many companies will use a coating with geletin in it on foil. Of course, most people don't know this and will happily criticize B'Datz before researching. Point in being. Keep your mouth closed before speaking of things you know not of and speaking (or typing) loshon horah.
11. group loyalty
mordechai ,   jerusalem   (04.12.07)
This fantastic article only begins to scrape at what is a terrible phenomina. Groups, whether religous or secular do whatever they can to maintain the loyalty of their adhearants. Perhaps the kosher organization has to give out a certain number of jobs to each member of their board. If there are not enough food products to supervise in order to keep all the employees they will search for other products.
12. What misdirection and deception!
Galit ,   NYC   (04.12.07)
The author plays his part in the charade to offer a crumb to Judaism when the real intentions of the editor is to defame and degrade Judaism and the Jewish people, the author should be ashamed of himself to accept money for this but like orthodox educated Rabbis who served in Conservative Houses of Worpship, are you any worse.
13. Kashrut certification
chaim ,   miami beach usa   (04.12.07)
This beginning is just in jest. During the holidays we read from the torah the subject of Asser Tasser which translates into the obligation of tithes (giving a portion of your gainful bounty to charity). It is also known as Asser Bishvul Stisaser meaning that if you share your bounty with the downtrodden you will not only be rewarded with a personal feeling of thankfulness that you have such abilities of caring and sharing, but it is also interpreted as if you do share you will be rewarded with even a greater wealth. Today the same wording is also interpreted as Asser not to mean the giving of charity but make the product forbidden without having any rabbinical supervision so that you can attach to the exact same product your Kashrut label and become rich which Tisasher is also known as getting rich, which you receive from the graft you demand from the manufacturer for you totally unnecessary, untruthful, certification that somehow this product is more kosher then same product manufactured by the same company and is unlabeled. But getting back to the halachic understanding of Kashrut. Any observant Jew is known to have two (2) sets of dishes in his home, one for meat products and the other for dairy products, and never (intentionally) cook or serve any meat product in a dairy implement or vice versa, yet any person that has any other item then his natural teeth in his mouth, does not give it a moment thought is my manufactured teeth or bridge in my mouth Milichig or Flayshig (Meat or Dairy). Can you just imagine the cornering of the dental market if the Rabbis actually become knowledgeable in manufacturing of false or other dental implants and publicizing their prohibition against the use of any other dental product that does not have their seal of approval Wow what a humongous gold mine that would become
14. "Kasher lePesach" mineral water
Raffaele Ladu ,   Verona, Italy   (04.12.07)
There is also another issue: whenever I go from Italy to Israel, I see that most grocers and supermarkets sell an Italian brand of mineral water labeled either "Kasher" or "Kasher lePesach". The court that allowed the maker to use their seal of approval probably disregarded the plain fact that if one managed to bottle non-kasher mineral water, he would be jailed in either country; and if one dared sell it, he would nonetheless be jailed either in Italy or in Israel. Therefore, such a label is not only pointless but also offensive.
15. Religion is Collective Obsessive Compulsive Disorder
Eyal ,   Rehovot   (04.12.07)
Good article and he says something quite interesting and true about the general evolution of religious doctrine and ritual. "if this is not exactly how the prohibition on kitniyot for Ashkenazim came about: First it was kitniyot, then anything that looked like kitniyot, and then anything derived from kitniyot, and soon it will be anything that has more than three of the letters in kitniyot." Religion is nothing but collective Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, pulling us towards more and more rules and more elaborate rituals, playing on our evolved hazard-precaution cognitive systems, all as a way to turn our minds from the need to deal with our daily problems, anxieties, fears, etc. What a waste of energy it all is.
16. just a thought
mordechai ,   jerusalem   (04.12.07)
A theory on Kitniyot not based on anything read or heard from a rabbinic authority: In central Europe , wheat and rice were grown next to each other, not so in Northern Africa. It could be that our European forefathers were concerned that when gathered, a small trace would be mixed in .
17. Do Not Add To Or Take Away
David ,   Israel   (04.13.07)
18. which is more important -what we say or what we eat?
johanna ,   tsfat   (04.15.07)
there are too many stringencies on eating and not enough concerns or even following of halacha on what we say. if the rabbis who originally ruled about kitynot were alive today,they would say due to modern farming, packaging etc the rules don't apply anymore.
19. #3 - your math is a bit odd...
David ,   Israel   (05.17.07)
At the end of world war 2 there were only 12 million Jews left in the world, and you assert we're down to 18 million? You have an interesting notion of subtraction.
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