Opinion
Tip of the iceberg
Ze'ev Winstok
Published: 11.09.07, 07:34
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
20 Talkbacks for this article
1. come again?
KATHERINE ,   TEL AVIV   (09.11.07)
Amazing how you can write about draft dodging and neo nazism in the same sentence as if these two issues are one. I am raising four children and as much as I love this country, I would rather they spend three years doing something more worthwhile for this country than wasting three years of their lives doing army service. There are many ways to serve your country. Enlisting in the army isn't the only one. It'hasn't proved to be the most productive way anyhow. I'd love to see them work on something like re-educating the young generation on tolerance. Bigotry has claimed more lives than any other war.
2. nazis
tony ,   paris   (09.11.07)
is'nt it amazing that the writer of this article,did not once mention the fact that ,MOST,if not all these NAZIS scum,do in fact come from the generation that made ALIYA with the 1 million supposed JEWS from RUSSIA,,These scum,are not even Jewish,,,,,and also the Israeli authority is partially to blame,,As they knew of this vile groupe,,They knew of their existence,but turned a blind eye,;;as they did not want the rest of the world to know how serious the problem actually was; Certain memebers of the gouverment preferred to say;"WE ARE A DEMOCRATIC COUNTRY,AND WE VALUE FREEDOM OF SPEECH AND IDEAS. What utter total Rubish,,If these,Nazis scum,are preaching hate and racism,this is where their freedom of speach should stop,There is a border between freedom of speach,and incitement to hatred ,and Out right antisemitism... So Please could someone tell this "SOCIAL WORKER",and "PROMENANT LECTURER",that these Nazis are not the cause of Violent families,or sexual abuse;these ae renegades of the old USSR,who fled Russia and neighboring states ,just so that they can come to Israel and get all the free benifits that immigrants get,when they come to Israel. THese dispicable thugs should be sent back to Russia,where they can vent their hate on all who are foreign,cause the Russian government does'nt really seem to be doing much about it either.
3. Thanks, Ze'ev - you've revealed yet another reason
Sharon ,   Haifa, formerly USA   (09.11.07)
Israel should stay Israel and not become the socially apathetic and alienating US it so worships. We are lucky we see unfortunate outcomes before they happen across the Atlantic, but we need to take the stars out of our eyes and prevent them. I must add, however, that a major component of IsraBluff was a failure to truly protect the country - governments are so focused on violence, they don't always address the equally devastating consequences of passive aggression. As far as the fabric of our culture goes, dredging the FSU for statistical bodies was equivalent to the US having armed Osama Bin Laden during the Soviet heydey.
4. "Tip of the iceberg"
Lou ,   Tel Aviv   (09.11.07)
How can Ynet print such an article, comparing neo-nazis to draft dogers! Such a comparison is ridiculous. The government should deport them at once, and with their families, and the Law of Return should be altered immediately. We are the laughing stock of the world in every respect. It appears that all the Prime Minister is doing is to please the President of the United States and Abbas Mazan.
5. the first order of business
Cathy   (09.11.07)
after getting rid of useless O, is getting rid of the academic leftists who created the problem in the first place
6. Shock?
David ,   Israel   (09.11.07)
How out of touch are your editors? Shock? Over this? Only an idiot wouldn't see this as a logical and expected result to a law of return that allows people with only the most tenuous of connections to Judaism and Jewry to become citizens.
7. Why are you trying to water down this scandal?
Jake T ,   Alaska   (09.11.07)
The social problems that this writer lists on his column exist everywhere and they cannot be easily solved. Adolescence will always be difficult, budgets will always be insufficient to pay for every need. And what was that about draft dodging? Let's not simplify the issue. Some don't want to serve for purely selfish reasons. Others do not want to serve because the IDF is not living up to its purpose of defending Jews, and it's attacking them instead. Some people have legitimate objections to that. So let's not lose focus on this very serious issue affecting Israeli society: the hatred against religious Jews. That there are Nazis in Israel has made screaming headlines worldwide. But the truth is that religious Jews in Israel have been the subject of hatred for many decades. Had there been respect for Judaism in Israel, and for the Jews who practice it, these Nazis would have remained in the closet. What emboldened them was the contempt and hatred for Judaism shown by the government and other Jewish institutions, and by Israelis themselves. Just read the comments that appear regularly against the Haredis and the settlers on this and other websites. They show pure hatred.
8. This Neo-Nazi scourge MUST be stamped out now!
David ,   Karmiel, Israel   (09.11.07)
I hear people saying this is a "fringe" group. Oh yes, that’s what they said about the National Socialist Party of Adolph Hitler in the 1920"s! This has nothing to do with bad behavior and lack of knowing what is right and what is wrong in the behavioral standards of people. This is hatred of the Jewish People, Secular, Religious, Straight, Gay and anything else you want to throw into the basket. The fact that they attack foreign workers is another point proving their hatred for anything that does not conform to their Nazi or Neo-Nazi ways. I fail to understand why the media blackout their faces. Sure, we the people of Israel, Jew and Gentile, who believe in the State of Israel, should be allowed to see the faces of those who hate us even if some of them are minors. The crimes they are alleged to have committed are adult hate crimes and thus their identities must be known. Once tried and found guilty, they must be imprisoned here and not deported. Let them go to prison with other Jews. Maybe there they will me convicts who lost parents or grandparents in the Holocaust and these “good” prisoners will be happy to help them to correct their Nazi ways! Many points have been made about the Russian Aliyah. I live in Karmiel, one of the towns mentioned by the police where it is suspected that Neo-Nazis have organized. I personally know a number of Russian young people, some of them my neighbors, who have served in the IDF in combat units with distinction. One has just to look at number of decorations awarded to our Russian soldiers at the recent medals ceremony. They, like others, have paid a heavy price and some the ultimate price for our country and we should be proud of them. Complacency is the Israeli way but it must stop here and now! This evil in our midst must be dealt with ruthlessness as must other areas of organized crime. The people of this country, so used to saying "All will be OK" must now realise that all is not OK and DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT! The Law of Return in its present format has outlived its usefulness. The law must be changed to allow Jews and the descendents of Jews entry into this country only if they express acceptance of the Zionist Ideal and, when they are awarded citizenship after a number of years as a resident, they should have to take an Oath of Allegiance to the State of Israel. Nowhere else in the world does some arrive at the airport and be given Citizenship on a plate. The Jewish Agency must also intensify its screening of potential New Immigrants, particularly if the only reason for their immigration is the Law of Return. Israel cannot become a safe haven for every miscreant looking for a place to run away.
9. Nazis
Peter ,   Germany   (09.11.07)
Everything you're talking about reminds on the situation here in Germany. The number of nazis is on the rise because the state is dissipating into globalization. There is no longer any responsibility for anything, every word is broken and the only answer of politics is to impose ever more restrictions on the citizens. So the nazis and other extremists fill the gaps. Aliya to Israel is possible for every idiot with a bogus certificate about jewishness of grandma, aliay to Israel isn't unfortunately possible for anybody who'd only like to become a decent Israeli (without an adequate gradma).
10. Social work my ass: Break out the baseball bats
Dani ,   Tel Aviv   (09.11.07)
Cut the touchy-feely b.s. You don't "understand" Nazis; you beat the stuffing out of them.
11. about Rabin
rami   (09.11.07)
And about Rabin, which was insulted, and had to endure a smear compaign depicting him as a nazi, by the so called religious camp, he certain didn't deserve it, and this is one of the main reason's for this hatred, which divide religious and secular, but this hate existe even between the religious themself
12. To #1
ex-idf ,   Israel   (09.11.07)
Where do you live? Have you noticed that we are under constant attack? Your sons should be honored to protect his country and family. They dont want to serve? Let them sit in Jail for 3 years. I applaud the comparison of neo-nazis and draft dodgers. Both are equally dangerous to the country and need to be dealt with severely.
13. Where the violence comes from
JPS ,   Efrat   (09.11.07)
Part, though certainly not all, of the blame can go on the shoulders of those who lead the country. As an example to the young, the MKs who feed at the pork trough, break the laws as if they own them, and show no respect for authority other than their own have given our wayward youth green light. I won't let my kids watch the Knesset channel, lest they get any ideas that yelling, screaming and insulting are the way to gain respect. Not every youth can expect a cushy job for being a Likud, Labor, Shas, or Kadima boot licker for years. Because these are the most up front models for them to follow, well, if our standards for MKs are so low, why should we expect more from our youth?
14. Draft-doging similar to Israeli neo-nazism
Amir ,   Beer Sheva   (09.11.07)
Draft-diging is very similar to Neo-Nazism in Israel. These people learnt from their parents that they shouldn't serve in IDF and avoid it by all means. Wealthy Tel Aviv kids (like Olmert sons) can call a person in IDF and get excemption. Poor kids do not have this choice and the begin to hate the State even more than wealthy draft-dogers. Finally they become Nazis (while wealthy kids move abroad to hate Israel and make money).
15. police ignored attacks
m   (09.11.07)
I remember a few month ago reading (not on YNET) about 2 kipa wearing boys being badly beaten by neo-natzis in Tel Aviv. When they went to the police they were ignored. The article also brought complains from elderly Russian Jews being harassed by the neo-nazis and the police ignoring it. It's logica it will develop like a cancer.
16. #15 - Police ignored it - That should be investigated
Michelle ,   Vancouver   (09.11.07)
The website pogrom.org.il has recorded many incidents that have happened over the years and we have to assume that this latest incident does not come as a surprise to anyone. Why was it swept under the carpet until now? What were the motivations of those who did not want to pursue those leads?
17. Why so much hypocritical outrage?
Carl ,   Indianapolis, USA   (09.11.07)
Religious Jews have been suffering from verbal abuse and physical attacks as a matter of course in Israel. They are hated, they are despised, they are attacked. When settlers were attacked by police and IDF, that was OK too. But now, all of a sudden, there is this self-righteous outrage on the part of the secular Jews just because the perpetrators remind them of THEIR vulnerability. That's right. They came for the religious first, and you did nothing. Then they came for any Jew... and that means you, the smug secular Jews of Israel.
18. Filling the Pages for Content - Sick of Rhetoric
ys ,   Israel   (09.11.07)
Really, REALLY sick of all the spinmeisters and opionated lecturers - especially the blow holes from the Left who do NOTHING ELSE BUT blow out hot air - day in and day out. They're all so lofty, don't you know? They're the elitist, they've been e d u c a y t e d in the best of schools (lol) and have papers hanging on their walls giving them even more importance (lol). But in the real world they're a bunch of wusses and pussies who yell from armchairs and behind desks into cables and cellphones about the *situation*. But next week they'll be the very same to curse out the *settlers* and to emphasize the importance of granting amnesty to arab murderers and lynchers, fortifying their bank accounts with more kickbacks and fortifying their egos with more boosts of a *job well done* in speaking out against injustice* in *our society* and the *evils* that exist amongst us all. Thanks for saving our souls oh high and might opinion makers of the internet. G-d only knows where we'd be without you.
19. #17 - You Said It Brother. Right ON.
j.sherri ,   Israel   (09.11.07)
20. well well well
gidon ,   israel   (09.11.07)
this is the fault of the self rightous zionistic idiots. that think its clever to open the doors of israel to any person whose aunts dog is jewish. then they are surprised by this . this is just the begining of the ramifications of the idios who sit around thinking of stupid illogical ideas to solve very complex problems
Back to article