Jewish Scene
Poland's Jewish leaders envision skyscraper in Warsaw Ghetto
Associated Press
Published: 02.11.07, 09:01
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
128 Talkbacks for this article
1. is transparent glass kosher?
(11.02.07)
Talmudic teaching is transparent only when lions sleeps on the trees.
2. What is wrong with these people???
Antonio ,   Haifa   (11.02.07)
Don't revive the Jewish "life" in that country... GET THE HELL OUT!!!
3. BETTER TO BUILD IN iSRAEL!
Petra ,   usa   (11.02.07)
4. Re #2
Dan ,   Australia   (11.03.07)
What is wrong with you??? That is where they are born. That is where they have roots. Who are you to tell them where to live? They can live where they want.
5. Symbolic Conquering
Christy ,   Boston, US   (11.03.07)
I view the plans as Symbolic Conquering on the part of Polish Jews. Nazi Germany is defeated & the Polish Jews are building because they can. Perhaps some of the Polish Jewish Community needs to do this to help heal psychic wounds they still bear. It could very well be an 'Up Yours' to all the anti-Semites in Poland via a building.
6. Reviving Jewish life without Jews
(11.03.07)
Neat trick, indeed.
7. Re 2
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.03.07)
and why's that? what is wrong with 'that' country?
8. Mysterious Nazis.
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.03.07)
I hear Nazis did this, Nazis did that, but I don't really know who those mysterious N a z i s were . Where did they come from? Mars? Dark side of the Moon? Hmm....
9. re 3
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.03.07)
Petra, I can see that you can read and write, but can you, ACTUALLY, understand written content? The whole point of building this skyscraper is to revive Jewish life in Poland. Which, of course, would help a lot if the building was built in Israel. Were you even able to finish elementary school? Can you show, on the real map, where Poand and Israel are? Can you find the U.S. on the map? Now, very hardcore question: what is five times two?
10. is anybody working there?!?!?
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.03.07)
don't tell me, sorry moderators, that my last entries were not politically correct. They were. You're taking your time? You 're drunk? wake up, dude!
11. #3 So move there, you hypocrite
Miriam   (11.03.07)
12. Greg # 8
charles ,   petach tikva   (11.03.07)
Were you sarcastic ? or are you making a big laugh of what those nazis did ? Before telling someone to read or ask if she finished elemantary school , look at a mirror .
13. Charles, #12
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.03.07)
Of course I was sarkastic. The process of falsifying and re-writting the history reached, already, ridiculous level. Tell me, Charles, how many people these days really know WHO the Nazis were? Due to antiPolish, Jewish propaganda, I will bet my last penny that most peeps will say: Poland produced them. I would never make fun of what happened to people during the WWII, regardless of my personal opinion on the subject, whatever it could be. Petra is sick with her hate towards Poles, so sick, that her posts reached level of ridiculousness long time ago. That being said, have a good day, Charles. Write, you people, more antiPolish, completely not true, ridiculous posts, share your propaganda twisted 'knowledge' and then be surprised that certain persons are antisemitic.
14. Re # 6
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.03.07)
Yeah, there are no Jews. Latinos are building synagouges in Poland these days.
15. RE14, Greg, American Jew's money are building the building.
AK   (11.03.07)
There are 5000 to 6000 Jews in the entire Poland. Given that the average couple has 1 1/2 children in Poland, that number is still not likely to increase. So, how many Jews are in Warsaw? The last thing the community needs is a skyscraper. Polish Jewish community will not revive. Heck, Poles don't want it to revive; they prefer empty, museum like synagogues for tourists, like Spaniards.
16. Greg, anti-Polish feelings aong the Jews didn't just happen.
AK   (11.03.07)
History of the Jews in Poland was far from happy and while the Poles do not hold an exclusivity on anti-Semitism, Poles have shown very little understanding for the Jewish suffering during and after the war. Everybody knows who the Nazis were (although the Austrians managed to glide under the radar thanks to the cold war propaganda) but don't forget that the Jews continued to be killed in Poland after the war, without the Nazis, without the Germans. Not all Poles are anti-Semitic, but quite a few still are, and the claim of Polish victimhood at the hands of the Jews is silly.
17. Everytime an article on Jews&Poland appears-usual suspects
Alan ,   SA   (11.03.07)
and observers of Y NET who are of Polish Heritage/Citizenship write in disputing role of MANY Poles wicked treatment of Jews during(and some AFTER the War). Jews DONT hate Poles today I hope but no way can ANYONE deny facts during the War . We all know Auschwitz ,Treblinka,Sobibor etc were GERMAN NAZI initiatives.Millions of Poles were murdered too! BUT many Poles joined in the Spirit of things(Zeitgeist) at that time as far as JEWS were concerned. This is the generally accepted story based on the testimony of our people who did survive . "Jhid,you survived?" was the frequent greeting after those few few poor unfortunates returned to their homes.Move on!
18. Re: 16, AK
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.03.07)
"History of the Jews in Poland was far from happy" Rabbi Moses Isserles described Poland as "Paradis Judaeorum". So I guess they must have been very happy there. "Poles have shown very little understanding for the Jewish suffering during and after the war" Get your facts straight. Poles showed huge compasion as a nation toward Jews and they helped out Jews A LOT. Home Army (AK, same as your nick) contantlly executed Polish collaborators and traitors. How much of understanding did Jews show for Poles when they were welcoming Soviet invaders with flowers on 17 September 1939, and then went on a killing spree? "Everybody knows who the Nazis were" So? Who were they? "don't forget that the Jews continued to be killed in Poland after the war" Did you bother to look WHO ruled the country then? Jakub Berman. Does the name sound familiar? Yes, he was a Jew, same as 80% of secret police sadists and militia-men. "Not all Poles are anti-Semitic, but quite a few still are" Of course, and guess WHO produces those antisemites? Who constantly gives new facts NOT to like them? "claim of Polish victimhood at the hands of the Jews is silly" Read more about Jews taking an active part in killing Poles and helping Soviet invaders. It's not silly. These are facts. Jews have Polish blood on their hands.
19. HOW MANY TIMES CAN ............................
Avrohom Bilgrei ,   ZION   (11.04.07)
A MAN TURN HIS HEAD AND PRETEND THAT HE JUST DOESN'T SEE ? IT'S A REAL OLD SONG !
20. Greg
AK   (11.04.07)
‘Rabbi Moses Isserles described Poland as "Paradis Judaeorum". So I guess they must have been very happy there.’ And here they keep telling us that it is under Islam that the Jews were actually experiencing paradise. Well, looks like Jews lived in paradise around the world, according to various claims. The truth is that neither Poland nor Muslim lands were a paradise for the Jews, except during very specific and very brief times. But certainly, during the Middle Ages after the entire Jewish communities were slaughtered in Western Europe during the Crusades and then during the successive expulsion from every country of Western Europe, being alive in Poland surely must have felt like a paradise to those Jews who came to Poland. But that 'paradise' was of limited duration and only relative to the horrors left behind. Keep in mind that during those times Jews were brought into Poland not because of charity but because Polish kings wanted to develop the country and the cities. Because they were useful to the crown, they were protected by it and by the nobles and hated by the population at large. 'Get your facts straight. Poles showed huge compassion as a nation toward Jews and they helped out Jews A LOT. Home Army (AK, same as your nick) constantly executed Polish collaborators and traitors. ' Jewish survivors relate being hunted down and shot at by the AK (my initials). Read the memoirs of the survivors, some even in the AK. Not that many Jews survived the war in Poland and even fewer in the AK. The majority of survivors actually survived the war in the Soviet Union, which accounts for quite undeserved gratitude many Jews had felt, and some still do, towards the Soviet Union after the war. To say that the Poles helped Jews a LOT during the war is an outright lie. There were very brave Poles who saved Jews and they had to watch out for their neighbors not to betray them and the Jews to Germans. Those people did a LOT, the rest did not. Please read the book by Samuel Willenberg ‘Uprising in Tremblinka’ (which came out in both Hebrew and Polish) and which gives the first-hand account of a Jewish survivor in Poland. Now, Willenberg describes how his father, living on Aryan papers, pretended to be mute to hide his not-entirely Polish accent. Do you think he worried that the Germans can tell his accent, or his neighbors? Poland has a sorry distinction of having anti-Jewish pogroms after the war and those were not the doing of Jewish communists or Jewish security operatives. How many Jews were in Poland after the war? They must have all served in the communist security apparatus, if your numbers of 80% of the security agents are true. 'How much of understanding did Jews show for Poles when they were welcoming Soviet invaders with flowers on 17 September 1939, and then went on a killing spree?' Jews went on a killing spree? Prove it. Perhaps anti Jewish pogroms in the pre-war Poland and instituting a desk-ghetto at Polish Universities in 1938, copying the Nazis had something to do with the attraction some found in communism. But considering the numbers of Jews serving and dying as soldiers of the Polish Army in September 1939, your statement is an insult. Besides, it will still not explain or excuse Jedwabne and similar cases. Of the Jews who survived the war, how many remain in Poland now? People always vote with their feet. It is obvious that Poland ceased being "Paradis Judaeorum" a long time ago.
21. re: 15
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.04.07)
"American Jew's money are building the building" if this is really an American Jewry money, that means that they finally feel guilty for doing NOTHING during the WWII to help their murdered people in Eastern Europe. Action of guilty consciousness. AK, tell me, how even dare you to judge a nation of Poland? You, and you alike, are seating in comfy chairs and write all this bullshit judging facts from your own point of view. What do you know about the realities of living in torn apart, burning and terrorized country during WWII, where anybody could be shot on the spot, be caught in countless 'lapankas' (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%81apanka) and sent to a death camp or to Germany as a slave (like my grandparents)? What do you know?!
22. Re: 17, Alan
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.04.07)
"Jews DONT hate Poles today" No, they don't. They LOVE Poles and this forum is a living proof.
23. Polish pride - to Greg #18
Peter ,   Poland   (11.04.07)
Yeahh, Greg. My family was sheltering a Jewish boy in they farm during the war. I discovered that fact by a chance long after the war. This was their most guarded secret. They were still, despite 30 years past, shit scared of their neighbours because the boy was a witness to the crimes of the neighbours on other Jews. So, tell me more about our national “compasion as a nation toward the Jews”…
24. Greg , # 18
Charles ,   petach tikva   (11.04.07)
Did this Berman instigate the murder of Jews ? did he order them ? did he participate ? Or was it simply done by Polish antisemite gangs ? You don't need "facts" to be antisemite , some are it without any reason , without even knowing one . Listen , we had already many discussions regarding this subject , there were , and still are , antisemite poles . There were and are good Poles too of course .
25. Re: 23
Greg ,   LA, USA   (11.04.07)
Sorry dude, but all you achieved was my laughter at your sorry and poor provocation. Try harder next time. No, to na razie, Piotrek.
26. Charles
Konrad ,   Wroclaw, Poland   (11.04.07)
I don't deny that after war there were Polish antisemite gangs or rather just "gangs" that killed people (Poles, Jews altogether, but the latter may have been considered "easier targets") for their belongings. However they were just criminals, not polish Einstatzgruppen as many of you would like to see them nowadays. After the war in the eastern parts of Poland AK did kill Jews. But they killed them not for their ethnicity but support for the communist regime - and yes - they killed polish commies too. Oh, and abut Jakub Berman - he along with with Hilary Minc (also Jew) and Boleslaw Bierut (this one was Pole) practically run communist Poland in the 1944-1956 Stalinist period (you do the math).
27. Konrad
charles ,   petach tikva   (11.04.07)
who said that those murderers after the war were "einzatsgruppen" ? They were mostly acting against Jews , look at the pogroms . Jakub Berman was responsible for the secret services , yes , but he acted also against Jews . A traitor to everyone . Why was he not condemned by the end of stalinism ? Hilary Minc was # 3 , responsible for industry , later for economic affairs . Not responsible for persecutions i think
28. Some Poles are discovering they have Jewish roots and trying
(11.04.07)
29. Greg , re-writer of history
leon ,   Grand Rapids USA   (11.04.07)
I was born in Poland. I lived there. I still read Polish papers on-line. Take if from me, Polish Jew-hatred is alive and well. Listen to Radio Marja sometime if you can understand Polish. and if you don't , then don't make uninformed comments.
30. Re 25, Greg, attidude like yours gives goodPoles a bad name.
AK   (11.04.07)
Next talkbacks
Back to article