Am Israel Hai !!

Be realistic. Jews are not leaving Israel. Israeli Arabs are not leaving Israel. BOTH sides must learn to live together and make compromises so that there will be peace. One question - if living in Israel is so important for Jews, and I certainly agree it is, why do foreign Orthodox and Haredi not bother? There are so many mitzvot and chumrot, but living in Israel? Nah!!

But there are a lot of practical difficulties involved. Prime among them is the question of who exactly is a Jew. If you ask 10 Jews their opinion, you might get 20 answers.

There is a rotten core of Arabs here that promote extremism, but I think that the overwhelming majority of Israeli Arabs would rather see small changes and stay citizens if only we acted more firmly against the extremists. By contrast, Jews who live abroad, show by their choices that Israel isn't so important to them. If we gave them citizenship and the right to vote we would be handing over the keys to the car to someone sitting in the back seat.

In the US, swearing allegiance to the Constitution is a CONDITION to receive citizenship. Those who refuse don't. Here, it would be enough to demand swearing allegiance to the State of Israel as a JEWISH State, as per Declaration of Independence: those who refuse can look for another place... In the US, acting against the State or treason are ALSO punishable with LOSS OF CITIZENSHIP!

can be very clear. Less than an hour's trip through ghettos like Bat Yam, Kiriat Eliezer, and Ganei Aviv would keep the deportation clerks busy for a while.

As a Jew who immigrated from a non-Jewish country I can tell you this rabbi is way off the mark. My Jewish friends in Britain and in America would not appreciate what they would see as coercion by a foreign state into making them citizens involunatarily and it would leave many of Israel's friends non-plussed about the sudden and unilateral dual-nationality granted on its Jewry (a kind of annexation of a national minority). What would be the Israeli response if Poland, Germany, Iraq, and so on sent citizenship certificates and passports to all the Israeli citizens who had their former national descent? Outcry, rage, Gentiles trying to subvert the Israeli state! So let's not do that to our brethen who for whatever reasons choose legitimately to keep Israel as a holiday destination only.

It's time to attract large amounts of quality people into the "tribe". I am not a religious expert, but I do know that during the time of the Kings, we converted people in the Land. How should this be done without attracting unserious people? We should combine BOTH the rigorous standards of Orthodox conversion with a marketing of Judaism. We should tell people that we're open to them and want them, but it is a hard spiritual journey that they can make only for the right reasons. Also, Orthodox Jews will be the group most likely to do aliyah. Statistics say that 25% of Americans have changed their religious affiliation, and this is just in the USA alone. Converted Jews from poorer countries will come here even more. Overall, I don't see why we can't add millions to the Jewish people and the State of Israel with this change of strategy.

We are all passengers of life. Regardless of our nativity. Some people spend many years of their lives living and working in other countries. Some people settle down in countries where they gone to work and end up getting citizenship rights there. There are millions of Jews doing this too. This Rabbi is a racist. The State of Israel is not governed by holy writ and if it were it would not be racist. Time for this Rabbi to do a conversion programme ....... from racist to human being.

I rather think it's the opposite, that there is a small core of Arabs who are loyal & the overwhelming majority, while they certainly want the benefits of citizenship, are to varying degrees, hostile to the idea of a Jewish state. I base my judgement on the fact that they elect extremist leaders, on various polls taken from time to time, & a general knowledge of Arab culture where loyalty is to religion, clan, family - not some abstract political entity no matter how benign. I think you are projecting Western liberal values onto people who do not share them & essentially, this is a very patronizing attitude as well as a little self-deceiving. I would certainly agree that we should deal harshly with what you call extremists but without fooling ourselves into thinking that they don't represent their followers. On the other hand, sadly, we do have a phenomenon of Jews who take very anti-Israel positions but this phenomenon is not mirrored in Arab society. The rabbi has an interesting idea that deserves debate - we are not so numerous that we can write off the other half of the Jewish people who do not live in Israel. Finding ways to strengthen ties is an excellent goal - perhaps not as full citizens with the right to vote. I would remind you that the idea of all Jews being citizens is implicit in the concept of Aliyah.

will give us certain rights in israel. then those who wish so, can apply for full citizenship. the rabbi is right on with his idea. it will benefit jews worldwide and make israel stronger.

This has to be followed by the internetional decision to strip the Jews from the citisenship of their "native" countries! So no more "German Jews",. no more "British Jews", all are only JEWS, and are FOREIGNS in these countries!

Its always fun to see Rabbis whine about "goys" and other non-Jewish citizens while they themselves haven't done a thing to help Israel. First of all defining who is a Jew is hard.. Like the saying goes, 2 Jews, 3 opinions.. Also many of these "goys" serve in IDF and have died defending Israel.. Should they also be stripped of the citizenship even after their death? Maybe Rabbi can take their place and go and defend Israel against terrorists? I love how these "religious" people whine about "goys" and other things without watching what they do to Israel.. Having 10 children per family while not working and not serving in IDF. Maybe that's a bigger problem? Where does it say in Torah that not working and not serving in the army is ok?

As an American Jew, while I might very much care for the Jewish state and have a close attachment to my spiritual homeland I cannot in good conscience take citizenship to a state where I do not live or pay taxes in. Perhaps something the equivalent of a “green card” or residency could be given to all Jews.

I have always advocated that citizenship be granted to Jews only. Only Jews are the entitled custodians of the land no one else. I do recognize there are righteous gentiles in Israel who are not only loyal but tie their destiny with us. As the Rabbi said they are to be granted "ger toshav" residency which is an equivalent of permanent residency as in other countries yet without citizenship. Right to vote only applies to local municipalities for betterment of their relevant community. As to granting citizenship to Jews abroad not all would take up that option however those that want it should have a right to it. Voting to be allowed in Israeli consulates abroad for such citizens as well as all other Israelis abroad not just consulate staff. Strict adherence to Jewish law with regards to who is a Jew.

Jews in Israel and outside trying to undermine it. From your PM downwards.

Most Galut Jews, especially younger ones, are not interested in Israel nor in becoming an Israeli citizen. Many non-Jews from third world countries would do anything to move here, even convert. We certainly don't need them. Also, what about 300,000 non-Jewish Russians? They are also a problem. Kol hakavod that many are good citizens and loyal soldiers, but that still doesn't make them Jewish. And if you haven't noticed yet: many of them are young, have a Jewish father or grandfather, but don't want to convert to Judaism. They are a demographic threat, too.

First of all 300.000 non Jewish Russians? Not all of them are Russians, many are from France, Argentine and US.. Some of them have Jewish fathers while many are reform Jews that Rabbinate does not recognize as Jewish. Also why are they a problem? Are they less Jewish because some of them have Jewish fathers? Or are they less Jewish because they converted through reform movement? The conversion process in Israel is horrible, only few pass and those in charge of conversion try to put obstacles in converts way. Thats needs to be changed.. Many of these "non-Jews" want to become observant Jews, but not Haredim. Also its fun that you considered "non-Jews" a problem while you don't mention how many "real" Jews undermine Israel.. Who would you rather have? A "non-Jew" whose father is Jewish , but who works and serves in the IDF or a "real" Jew whose mother is Jewish but who burns Israeli flags and have 10 children while he does not work? Again Haredim and other "real" Jews should look at themselves and see what they do to Israel. When the time comes to serve they claim that they are religious, when the time comes to work they claim that they are religious. But at the same time they have dozens of children who need to be fed and who feeds them? Their fathers? Nope, its Israeli workers who work their hard to pay big taxes that are later given to Haredim. When Israel is at war who defends the country? Haredim? Nope they sit home because other Israelis including "goys" fight for them, but when soldiers die do they get thank you from Haredim? Nope, instead Haredim claim that those who were killed did not follow Halacha, were homosexuals etc.. So again Haredim and others should stop blaming a small minority of people of whom many consider themselves to be Jewish, but should see whats wrong with themselves.

Are we seriously discussing removing citizenship (or at least voting rights) from at least 25% of the population of this country?! And giving voting rights in this country to screeching right-wing armchair Jews in Florida? Woo... I must have been having a bad dream!

would be to strip all rabbis who think this way, of their citizenship

Reich Citizenship Law, September 15, 1935 The Reichstag has unanimously enacted the following law, which is promulgated herewith: § 1 A subject of the State is a person who enjoys the protection of the German Reich and who in consequence has specific obligations towards it. The status of subject of the State is acquired in accordance with the provisions of the Reich and State Citizenship Law. § 2 A Reich citizen is a subject of the State who is of German or related blood, who proves by his conduct that he is willing and fit faithfully to serve the German people and Reich. Reich citizenship is acquired through the granting of a Reich Citizenship Certificate. The Reich citizen is the sole bearer of full political rights in accordance with the Law. § 3 The Reich Minister of the Interior, in coordination with the Deputy of the Führer will issue the Legal and Administrative orders required to implement and complete this Law. Nuremberg, September 15, 1935, at the Reich Party Congress of Freedom The Führer and Reich Chancellor Adolf Hitler The Reich Minister of the Interior Frick

I am a NY Jew and I don't want your damned citizenship. I don't want the citienship of any country, Jewish, Christian or otherwise which has relinquished any sense of social justice in preference to bigotry and a paranoid search for "security" that excludes any peoples outside of themselves.

...."swearing allegiance to the jewish state is a CONDITION to receive citizenship. .. those who refuse can look for another place".

Since the begginings of the Sionist enterprise,ALL pioneers declared that they didn't want to damage the lives of those few already living in Israel-Palestine by then.They wished the best for arabs,from Ben Gurion to Ahad Ha'Am passing through many,many others. The problem is that arabs -THEY!-have never accepted us! Have you read our history?Have you read how opressed Jews from all over the world struggled to come(to flee) to the ONLY refuge we had,the only one that the powers of the world alowed us to have after so much fight. Jews helped brits to enter in this Land;they fought along the brits.Many Jews gave their blood and lives to secure a refuge to all Jews. It is the arabs who are greedy and don't want us to fullfil our destiny in our ancestral land. What do you think we should be doing?Should we quit this and return to the hands of gentile countries who do what they wish to us when we are not convienient anymore? Think about.Read the impressing history of ours. No Jew in this world have the right to criticize Israel. Shame,shame on you miriam! History is yet to teach you ,very soon ,how shamefull wrong you are.

John: Jews are not the 5th column, even if there are some countries which believe noone may hold multiple citizenship (e.g. Germany / Netherlands) It is equally preposterous to suggest stripping citizenship and representational rights on all matters from long-term residents. Most of matters considered by Knesset are not primarily "Jewish" and there is no earthly reason why non-Jewish minorities should ot be represented. The rabbi's suggestion is not very helpful because too simplistic and counterproductive. What makes sense is to establish a new level of "constitutional law" on which only Jews may vote, for some issues only those who are Israeli and resident, for other issues, all Israelis whether resident or not, and for broadest issues Israelis and Jews worldwide where there would have to be some new category of "Israeli affiliate" to avoid precisely the sort of retaliation you describe. But these laws would have to be on clearly JEWISH issues.

The utmost I could understand is that all those who are... "actively supporting or contacting an organization which is actively engaged in the attempt to destroy the state of Israel"... ... "will face the threat of losing their citizenship and will after that have to leave the country – given there is legal evidence supporting the accusations and it was checked by the Supreme Court." So that losing citizenship and leaving the country is clearly connected to hostile ACTIONS of the accused and his active support of the enemy. It could have a DETERRING effect, I think. Finally there could be a MANDATORY "civil national service" for all those who don't join the Army. They could clean the streets, support the elderly and handicaped persons, repair playgrounds for children, plant new trees etc. etc. Who doesn't comply loses every state social support or pays a fine. So that ALL citizens (also the Israeli Arabs and the Haredim) would actively support by their actions the well-being of the society – from which they benefit. Also the Israeli Arabs have to support actively the Israeli society, from which they are a part. But you can't revoke civil rights only based on religious conviction or because "one is an Arab".