Hello, I live in Brazil, where all supermarkets sell non Kosher food , people go dressed the way they want, the bus traveling on Shabbat, and there is a strong Orthodox community . No Orthodox rabbi here asked to close supermarkets, stone someone dress nastily, or protested against a bus on Shabbat. They simply close their eyes to these "abominations". I believe that if the religious in Israel behave in the same way, they will gain the respect of all and certainty will live in a more peaceful society.

what's the big deal?

Compare the situations. Sorry. There is no comparison. The existence of a Tiv Tam might be annoying but no one will stand up on the street and force them to eat pork. No one will force people into the shop, or demand that people shop only at their shop. Residents of the neighborhood could simply opt not to shop at Tiv Tam. Where as the Harredim are aggressive and demanding. They spray acid on women who dress immodestly. They vandalize shops they don't approve of. Don't insult us. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence can make the comparison.

are not words contained in the Haredi lexicon, au contraire, imposition and dogma are the main ingredients of their code. Please do not expect anything else other than measured reciprocation.

The posts which talk about "the haredim" as a monolithic group are a good example of the kind of stereotyping which is so common among a large sector (not all) of the secular community in Israel. Anyone who knows even the most basic concepts of Jewish history knows how abhorrent pork is to traditional Jews. This is akin to opening up a massage parlor in the neighborhood. Yet, here are so many ready to get rid of the tiny group of observant Jews in the midst of the metropolis of Tel Aviv. How sad.

Many of the things that Haredim do to preserve their lifestyle: the stoning, the fighting, etc. are obviously not right. However, this is Israel and the fact that a supermarket opened that ostentatiously sells extremely unkosher products right across the street from a Haredi neighborhood is not right. The fact that there is so much animosity towards religiousness in Tel Aviv is terrible. This is Israel, not Poland! I think Tali definitely has it right with this article. We can't expect the ultra-Orthodox to respect us if we don't respect them.

Can you imagine the "tolerant" Saudi Muslims allowing a pork store in Saudi Arabia? I'm not so sure that treif is a requirement of democracy. So why does Israel have to blatantly throw away the Torah? Guess we still haven't learned the lessons of the 1st and 2nd Temples.

They don't want to be Jews anyway. They just wanted to come to Israel for the benefits bascket. Israel does not need them. Send them back to whatever pigsty they came from.

The argument is so poor. I was expecting something more intelligent coming from this writer... try again!

It's called capitalism. Tiv Tam did not open a store in a haredi community to get rich from them, or piss them off. They opened it to service everyone who lives in that area. And as there are MORE seculars in that neighbourhood, it makes sense. They don't have to go there. And if they can't walk past a supermarket without having a fit, then they need to get help. They chose to move to a predominately secular neighbourhood - therefore, they cannot dictate what stores are allowed to open there. Tiv Tam wouldn't open a store in Beni Brak for instance, if that was the case, then it would be different. But it's not. So all your moaning and whinging about respecting lifestyles is a waste of time. And for someone who couldn't even get her picture published in a Haredi newspaper because she's a woman, I'd have thought you'd have greater things to conquer than moaning about a Tiv Tam store. How sad you really are grasping at straws.

Tali Farkas has an apparent bias towards the religious community as her tone in the article condones their disrespect of democracy and modern values. The religious have no place in the world of 2008 and while I may sound 'bias' or 'intolerant' there are a few facts one being that there is no physical evidence for god. The religious live in a fantasy world where a book was written 3,000 years ago by people whose cognitive reality matches that of a 4 year old child today, hardly holy or respectable. The fact that all wars in our history have been over religious intolerance simply sheds light unto the fact that we need to abolish religious dogma and the religions themselves. We cast away the heap of scrap known as the religions of antiquity, is it any less insane to say that I 'devote my life to apollo, than to hashem' ? no both are insane

Of course its not comfortable for observant Jews to see hazeri (pork products) sold openly in the Jewish country after 1000's of years cultural taboo, to put it mildly. It is also painful for committed Jews in the Jewish State to see how the special mitzvah of the Sabbath is trampled on everywhere, despite legislation protecting every worker's right to a day off. Imagine what it was like in antiquity with no "day off" once a week and no annual holidays as are now the norm. Of course slaves have no free time at all. Another Jewish religious innovation, was the requirement of servants to be allowed to rest on shabbat too. Dont focus on the loony fringe who are obsessed with "modesty" look at the real achievements of Torah Mi Sinai. Moses gave us rules of living which were light years in advance of the surrounding peoples, and much of this is still valuable today.

See if you can get your head around this, Tali. Opening a store: Legal Attacking women because of their dress: Illegal Option of visiting the store: Legal Throwing rocks at cars for driving on public streets: Illegal Freedom to choose: Legal Forcing women to sit in the back of public buses: Illegal Defacing public property: Illegal Religious coercion: Illegal Burning garbage on public streets: Illegal It has nothing to do with tolerance. But nice try. Oh...and the list could go on.

My dear that is why Brazil is not Israel. You see thats why you can expect another Haloucast everywhere around the world except Israel, and thats why Isreal is called the land of theJews. Try to understand what makes Israel a nation and you will understand why these orthodox jews want what they want.

Why should the haredim be forced to tolerate a store that violates the Torah in their midst? Why would a chain store stock products that are so offensive to those in a neighborhood where they are not going to be bought? I hesitate to be boring and tedious but if these were actual blacks, instead of just people of various colors who wear black, they would have sooooo many people of the liberal persuasion on their side. How is it that so many Jewish people can be sympathetic to American blacks even with their known gangs as in LA but have no sympathy for their own landesmen? Remember what "Abraham" Lincoln said: A house divided against itself cannot stand.

There needs to be more tolerance on both sides because both sides are wrong. I live in Tel Aviv and I like it here but I do wish there was more Judaism here. I've tried going to temple and I feel out of place but I still respect the Docim because they are Jews and if we don't stand with each other this country will fall apart, its already happening. If we keep fighting each other and pushing each other out of our lives, someone is going to come along and push us all off this land. I respect the Orthodox even if I don't feel they respect me because we are in this mess called the Jewish People together and only together can make a better future in Israel. It starts with being the bigger man. Respect your brother and then maybe he will respect you too.

While I agree that the seculars of Tel Aviv should respect the Haredi community in their mists, I do not view this store as a provocation. Maybe it is my American mentality, but if you do not like it do not go there. I know I personally would never shop in a store in Israel that sells pork. I am sure there are others in the area who are not Haredi that feel the same way. They should advocate a boycott of that store until they move, or change their policy.

Arielush, You said "They (Chareidim) spray acid on women who dress immodestly". I was just wondering if you had any actual evidence for that statement or is that something "Anyone with an ounce of intelligence" just knows?

Selling pork is equal to democracy? Sounds about right. Israelis, especially leftists, wouldn't know democracy if it hit them in the face. Let me know when Tiv Tamm opens up an store selling pork in an Arab neighbor. Bet Talula decrys the store's lack of sensitivity to the clientele! Hyprocrits!

"How could they not be upset?" Here's how: Realize that they don't have to buy there, and that they have NO right to try to control what is. Easier for water to run uphill. The Ultra-Orthodox (as well as the rest of the religious crew) are control freaks with anal personality traits: compulsive, ritualistic, magical and other hocus pocus like Gematriya. As long as they keep their nonsense to themselves, "No harm, no foul". When they (or anyone else) extends his beliefs into the personal space of the other, they've earned the drubbing they richly deserve.

Because I have a beard I was often asked why I didn't move to Jerusalem instead. Or if in a conversation I ever showed any basic knowledge of basic Judaism - ditto. Gee, Tel-Avivians really know how to make you feel welcome. No, thanks, never again. PS Tali is so pretty, let's have more photos of her with each article. Don't worry we love you for your mind also.

I have never EVER seen anything pro-the charedim in the media (and by the way, I'm not charedi). Things should be viewed more objectively!

a supermarket does not force anyone to go inside, let alone buy there. there are plenty of haredi people who are strong enough not to eat in non-kosher restaurants and not to shop in other non-kosher stores. that is their choice. it seems like a very bad business decision to locate a non-kosher supermarket in a haredi neighbourhood. a smarter businessman might choose a different location or a different product, but that's their choice. so long as a supermarket obeys the law, trying to keep them out is discrimination, pure and simple.

That's my girl.

Let's close all pubs in jerusalem on shabat...

The Haredim imposed their lifestyle on us in Jerusalem. Who is forcing that small group of Haredim to shop in Tiv Taam? They can continue to shop where they have always shopped. Live and let live, you know?

As a kosher Reformed Jew in America I find the bigotry, discriminatory and theocratic dictatorship ruling Israel to be an abomination!

They both love to hate their fellow religious jews just because their lifestyle doesnt agree with them. How narrow minded! And no Tatura, I am not Haradi or even religious.....i just have an open mind!