Opinion
Iran-Israel linkage harmful
Yoram Ettinger
Published: 09.05.09, 16:34
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1. IT WORKS BOTH WAYS!!!
Daniel Rossi ,   NY, USA   (05.09.09)
Let the world link the Palestinian issue to the Iranian nuke fiasco. We'll play it this way- NO PALESTINIAN STATE TILL IRAN (and the rest of the Arab world)MAKES PEACE WITH ISRAEL. In the meantime, no nukes for Iran.
2. of course they are linked
fred barns ,   atlanta, usa   (05.09.09)
are you people for real? the linkage is real and makes perfect sense to everyone except you nut cases. Obama is our only chance for peace.
3. Yoram, who are you fooling? yourself?
American ,   Bowie, Maryland USA   (05.09.09)
Yoram Ettinger is not an expert in anything, he is just a racist. His diatribe doesn't make a bit of sense from begining to the end. There is 1 problem there are millions of people (call them Palestinians, people from Mars or whatever you want) who are living within the boundaries of what he likes to call greater Israel. One state two state or ten states these people have a right to have their country or be equal citizens in a country with full protection of life and liberty. Anyone doesn't get what the problem is a racist and lives in denial pure and simple. Resolving this issue, won't fix all the problems of middle east but will solve at least 90% of it and 100% of America's problem there.
4.  #2 - "Obama is our only chance for peace."
Cameron ,   USA   (05.09.09)
Really, #2??? I read that kind of damn, fool babble, and truly despair of reality & our species. Ah Lord, some mothers have 'em.
5. Thank you for this wise and realistic
Vardina   (05.09.09)
analysis description of the situation.
6. #3, why?
Danny   (05.09.09)
There are millions of native americans living in the US - they have the right to their own state? What about the people in New Mexico? What about Hispanics? They get their own state? Why is it so "obvious" in Israel but not in any other place on the planet?
7. #2, agreed they are linked
Danny   (05.09.09)
Who do think funds Hizbollah and Hamas and Islamic Jihad to refuse any peace deal with Israel and keep "resisting"? Well spotted.... I assume that's what you meant right?
8. now are you happy obama is in office?
eitan ,   texas, usa   (05.09.09)
9. #3 - You are a clear example of WHY the ME is a fire
William ,   Israel   (05.09.09)
"these people have a right to have their country or be equal citizens in a country with full protection of life and liberty." True for ALL people. So why do these Pals, who are mainly made up from illegal immigrants in the 1930s entitled to whittle away someone else's State for their own, especially after attempting to steal the land and follow a genocidal war on its people? I wonder if you will change your tune with Mexicans in MD given the same "rights" as Pals. "will solve at least 90% of it and 100% of America's problem there." A reason why the West's answer to ME problems always fail. You ignore 1350 years of history and the cultural leanings of many races. Problems in the ME are tribal based and were going on before General Washington was in Philadelphia - and longer before the US ever visited the ME. 90% of the problems in the ME are over power, greed, corruption, deceit, and nepotism. No democracy, no voting, no US pull-out would ever fix that. Tying Israel and Pals to the state of the ME is just a way for the West to pin their shortcomings on someone else while ignoring the atrocities of the Arabs themselves, on non-Arabs, and each other.
10. Never trusted Mrs Clinton
Semsem ,   New York, USA   (05.09.09)
I never trusted Mrs Clinton.
11. 1400 year goal to dominate??
Jacob T. ,   OKC, USA   (05.09.09)
Yoram, Your knowledge of history is as poor as your analysis of the current situation. Where do you come up with this NOTION that Iran has had the goal to dominate ME in past 1400 years? Do you care to show a shred of evidence? A shred of historical FACT? or you only care to DISTORT history and promote hate and war mongering? Just FYI sir, there are 25,000 Iranian Jews living in Iran who are as proud of being Jew as they are of being Iranian. Isn't time for you sir to promote peace and harmony rather than scare and hate. God know ME, Jews, Muslims, Christians need some peace. We all have earned it. Regards, Jacob T.
12. #6 Danny
Jacob T. ,   OKC, USA   (05.09.09)
In fact US government has given the Indian Tribes in US full autonomy, in a way that Native Americans set their own laws, governance, tax levy and tax collection. They do receive full federal protection but they are autonomous nation within the nation. Every dime of revenue they generate, either form land/oil lease, or businesses is used strictly for the [Tribe]. They even have their own [Tribal Automobile Registration]. They provide free education and medical care for their tribal members. And as for the tribes who do not generate enough revenue of their own, Federal subsidies are apportioned. Federal laws are applied to all without discrimination. I thought you needed to know this. Regards
13. #12 yeah and the Palestinians were offered this
Danny   (05.10.09)
in the 80s.... So If Bibi were to suggest that Palestinians should not get their own state but rather have the set-up the native indians have then the world could just move on?
14. #11, I know quite a few Iranian Jews who
Danny   (05.10.09)
are proud of being Jewish and Iranian. They all live in Israel.
15. #11, dude learn to read
Danny   (05.10.09)
Where did Yoram say that Iran has been trying to "dominate the ME" for the last 1,400 years?
16. #12
Gabriel ,   Brazil   (05.10.09)
And so does the PA receives the taxes paid by the so-called palestinians and uses it as they wish. They can use them to pay for their public servants, schools, etc. Even suicide bombers. They receive full protection by the IDF, and the PA police (or hamas police, in Gaza). PA law applies in Judea and Samaria, and I believe (though this is purely speculation) that Sharia law applies in Gaza, though the IDF might intervene if anything done in Judea, Samaria and Gaza endangers the people living outside these regions. So tell me, what's the problem?
17. No. 11-12 a few points for consideration
Shaul ,   New Zealand   (05.10.09)
no. 11: actually, Jacob, I would suggest that you are the one with poor knowledge of history. The Shi'ite-Sunni schism, which began nearly 1400 years ago, has been all about regional political dominance. As Iran is the center and power base of the Shi'ites, it is perfectly fair to say that it has been involved in a 1400 year struggle for regional dominance. Please contrast the few "loyal" Iranian Jews to the hundreds of thousands who have escaped. This reminds me of the "good old" Soviet days, when the government would constantly parade the few "loyal" Jews in order to discredit and draw attention away from the millions of Jews who were trying to emigrate to Israel and US. In fact, there has been a long tradition of members of Jewish community collaborating against their fellow Jews. Starting from the Hellenizers and Roman collaborators, to Spanish inquisition (do a search on Paolo of Burgos, the Jewish-convert archbishop of Burgos, who became one of the most vicious persecutor of Jews), all the way to the WWII, continuing well until today (Chomsky, Finkelstein, Pappe, etc.) Unfortunately, thanks to prevailing ignorance of history, there are still many today, such as yourself, who buy into this old canard. Finally, your heartfelt call for promotion of peace and harmony is based on the assumption that it is the Jews that obstruct peace. According to your views, once the Jews stop being "warmongers" everything will come up flowers. This assumption simply ignores the reality: it is the Arabs who have been rejecting any compromise that would enable the Jews to live in peace and harmony in the ME. no. 12 Are you suggesting that the Palestinian Arabs would be satisfied with the type of arrangement that you mention (autonomy, tax collection, tax-free liquor and cigarette sales, casinos, etc.)? Are you aware that every Israeli government has been offering the Arabs FAR more than that: not just autonomy, but full sovereignty? The only things asked in return were a recognition of a Jewish state and a cessation of hostilities. Are you aware that every offer has been flatly rejected by the Arabs and met with more bloodshed? Dear Jacob. Contrary to ehat you state in your posts, the fly in the ointment is not the Israeli "warmongering", but, rather, Arab rejection of any and all forms of accommodation with a Jewish state. As an experiment, try to post your call for peace and harmony with Israel on a pro-Arab web site. Perhaps suggest that a solution lies in a system of US-style Indian reservations for the Arabs and see what responses you will get. As another worthwhile experiment, try researching history a bit before forming your assumptions.
18. Despite criticism, great analysis...
Aaron ,   SF, USA   (05.10.09)
...as to why the linkage really is, extremely risky.
19. Iran is Islam and Islam is Iran
Afghan   (05.10.09)
"Iran's megalomania and its drive to obtain nuclear capabilities are a derivative of its 1,400 year old goal to dominate the Persian Gulf and the Muslim World." It were the Persian scholars who shaped the Islamic literary structure for Arabs were merely nomadic people that knew very little about writing or literacy. Islam without Iran wouldnt have been what it is today or has been since its birth 1400 years ago.
20. Jacob (#11), meet some Persian Jews
John K ,   Philadelphia, USA   (05.10.09)
It really scares me that people out there like Jacob think the Jews in Iran are just fine being there, all proud and such of being Jewish and Iranian. From real experience (it's a useful tool, Jacob), they are proud of being PERSIAN, not Iranian. And Persians should be proud, but the last 40 years those in charge have been trashing the reputation of a great people, not enhancing or glorifying it. If you ask a Persian Jew in the US, you'll find out that those who speak out about the regime are jailed and DISAPPEAR, especially minorities. Your arguments might be more compelling if you first verified the "facts" you throw out to back up your opinion.
21. Call their bluff
L. King ,   Canada   (05.10.09)
The Arab elites are almost as worried about Iran as the Jews. Western Saudi Arabia is Sunni. The minority in the East are Shiite - that's the side next to Iran where the oil is. Israeli always need to have a nuanced and detailed understanding of its neighbours so as not to fall into the trap of treating them as a monolithic opposition.
22. -11 congrats the most inacurate comment on the internet
payman ,   Shiraz, NY   (05.10.09)
I used to live in Iran and am a jew growing up I was constantly harrassed and threaten without even the prospect of the iranian government having my welfare in mind. If the kids who beat me up and harassed me called the cops after they did I would be thrown in jail. I lived in Iran and I hate the country. It single handedly is the reason the whole region is so fucked up. Anyone ANYONE who does not see that is truly blind and I pray has hashems mercy in the next world
23. Ridiculous article
herb stone ,   jerusalem   (05.10.09)
Iran is not megalomaniacal - If anything, Israel's fears are megalomanical. As the Jewish mystics said, all people (and all countries) have yetzer ha tov, and yetzer ha ra. All we need to do is not make a big deal about yetzer ha ra (in ourselves and others), and it will gradually dissipate. And nurture yetzer ha tov (in ourselves and others), and it will grow. Instead, all Israel sees - EVERYWHERE - is yetzer ha ra. Oy!!
24. #11-Jacob T.
Jonathan ,   Israel   (05.10.09)
Actually Jacob, the historic FACTS stated in the article are accurate, and I'm convinced that if you ever decide to read about Persian history, even prior to the their acceptance of Islam, you will understand that from a historical standpoint, these accounts are accurate. Until then, you would be doing everyone a favor by keeping your "war mongering" and fictive history to yourself......what a douchebag!
25. Iran is present at our borders : The terrorist movements ...
Robert Bernier ,   Tel Aviv   (05.10.09)
Iran is present at our borders : The terrorist movements Hizbullah and Hamas are both Iranian satellites. We should fight and beat to the ground the Hizbullah first and then Hamas, so that when we will have to deal with Iran the north front and the south front are pacified. Hamas continue to insist they are never going to recognize Israel and never going to make peace. So what is there to talk about with them? It is evident that negotiating with Hamas and Iran cannot lead anywhere. Hizbullah's strengthening in Lebanon means that Israel's mortal enemy, Iran, has a stronger presence on Israel's northern border. Israeli ex-Ambassador to the UN Danny Gillerman explained, "Weapons are flowing to Hizbullah, Lebanon is being torn apart and is bleeding... Iran is on our northern border, and, to some extent, on our southern border as well." The civilization of Islamic Iran : http://xrl.us/biz87
26. there's no point to
ghostq   (05.10.09)
blame USA the finall decision belongs to Israel, who responsible to her own destiny. true history repeat itself but, again it's Israel decision.
27. Iran-Israel Linkage with Palestinians? Total & absolute crap
(05.10.09)
Where did Rahm get this stupidity? Its idiotic.
28. entertaining article
ralf ,   germany   (05.10.09)
mr.ettinger is an expert of ME and American affairs!!
29. Peace is possible...Please listen
Issa Dadoush ,   Houston USA   (05.10.09)
The author appears to live in a fantasy and does not recognize the realities on the ground. Fact: 11.5 million people live in the region between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea. The total population in the area is about 52% Jewish and 48% Arab. Fact: 74 percent of Palestinians and 78 percent of Israelis are willing to accept a two-state solution. We as Americans can no longer afford war after war to support failed attempts to stabilize the region. Palestinians, Israelis, and yes Americans have paid a high price for failed attempts to consider the human side of the struggle for peaceful life. I believe that a historic, hard won but lasting peace is within our grasp by seizing the opportunity opened up by Annapolis built on: a two-state solution based on 1967 borders, a democratic state of Israel, secure from attack, recognized by - and at peace with - all its neighbors, alongside a peaceful, democratic and territorially viable state of Palestine that accepts Israel as its friend and partner, and with Jerusalem the capital for both. Pray for Israel and Palestine. Let us give hope to the next generation of Israelis and Palestinians. War is not the answer... Issa Dadoush
30. To: #11. Iranian history
Historian ,   USA   (05.10.09)
It is yuo who are ignorant. Iran, even before Islam, was an expansionist stae. Remember Persian conquest of Asia Minor and wars with ancient Greeks? Sassanian Iran fought Eastern Roman Empire for centuries, trying to capture Constantinople. How abour islamic Iran fighting the Ottomans? Nader Shah and the sack of Delhi? Muhammed Qajar and the sack of Tbilisi in 1795? They captured Bahraini islands and intimidate Bahrain with being just a "19th province of Iran" ( Kuwait was the 19th province of Iraq, BTW :-) They incite Shia minorities in Oman, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Pakistan; the traditional targets of Persian expansionism. Please, before jumping into a fray and arguing on behalf of the " eternally peaceful Iran", learn history.
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