First of all, like you admitted, this is consistent with Zionism. Secondly, why are you insisting this is strictly a religious issue? Thirdly, you can just go home to Berkely, upper east Manhattan, or DC. Fourthly, and clearly above your capacity to understand: This land IS Israel. The soldiers are following the mandate of the IDF to serve and preserve ISRAEL and not whacko leftist agenda like your own.

What about the draft refusers from the Left? What about the Leftists that refuse to serve in the West bank? Any answers, Stern?

Good article mon general.The big problem is do the rabbes really support the laws of the land? I think not,but like you hope that they step foward to clarify the matter. This matter MUST get cleared up very quickly otherwise we shall start destroying ourselves from within.

http://hartman.org.il/Opinion_C_View_Eng.asp?Article_Id=397 Religious Zionist soldiers must swear allegiance to army, State, or stay out of IDF (16/11/2009) By Donniel Hartman As Prime Minister Netanyahu and his government move forward in their conversations with the Palestinian Authority and attempt to build a foreign policy in sync with President Obama's, our government and its operational arms, primarily the army, will, and increasingly are finding themselves at odds with certain segments of Israeli society, especially members of the settler community who live in Judea and Samaria, and, in particular, those from the religious national right.

sad to say, but "rabbi" doesn't mean "leader" any more than "politician" means "statesman".

Elazar Stern is correct, the Rabbis must speak out - against using the IDF as a political tool. If expelling Jews from their homes is legal, then the police should be given the job of expelling them, not the army!

That's what it boils down to. For the Jew, the choice is clear. Torah.

stern is the guy to talk ! Stern - the one who worked hard and backed kicking Jews out of their homes in gush katif. He is going to tell the rabbi what to say!! The importance of doing the right thing is what we should focus on not the importance of taking illegal and immoral orders. The Rabbis should speak out in a clear fashion and tell this Stern jerk he is going to hell for kicking Jews off their land and destroying their homes. Wake up! If Israel doesn't get rid of these traitors our Country will be lost

Stern is under the delusion that rabbis think with a single mind. Too bad he doesn't spend any time within religious circles. Any one who does, knows that it's almost impossible to get 2 rabbis to agree on anything. But that aside, these soldiers are obviously thinking for themsleves. It doesn't require a rabbi to explain that the IDF wasn't established as a political weapon to be used against a particular segment of the Israeli population. Poor Goldstone missed an opportunity. He could have prepared a truly accurate report documenting the deliberate IDF attacks on civilian populations, namely the Jews of Gush Katif, Amona and Homesh. More power to these soldiers for using their brains.The days of blindly following military orders with impunity ended at Nuremberg,.

have turned their backs on Judaism

Imagine if the chaplains in the American army came out and stated that any American soldier who showed mercy/humanity to the 'enemy' would be internally dammed to 'hell' and also handed out 'hate booklets' encouraging American soldiers to disregard the international laws of war aimed at protecting innocent civilians?! The media would have a field day and these 'extreme chaplains' would be ousted ASAP, not to mention that an inquiry would be set up to find out how racist religious extremists infiltrated the American army! Long story short: The IDF is under the influence of rabid rightwing rabbis/Yesha council/Post (lets-grab-what-we-still-can) Zionism/etc. Or to put it another way: The Israeli army has been compromised by religious nutters. Basically there are two elements here: 1) Your basic secular Israeli who wants to live in peace and is not xenophobic. 2) Your extreme religiously racist zealot who will ignore any International/Israeli law that infringes on his or her religious mindset/brainwashing. The sad reality is that these 'religious nutters' have a huge influence/representation within the current (and past) Israeli Govs. That coupled with the fact that the Israeli security forces, likewise, have been infected does not bode well for Israel. I hope that Israel stems the religious racist influence within its society, at least to the extent that such a bigoted ideology does not have an influence on domestic or foreign policy. Out of interest what is the Hebrew equivalent for the word 'Jihadi'?

to visit universites, since they might hear leftist professors encouraging them not to serve in the west bank or against Gaza... What nonsense! (and anti-religious bias...)

Stop using our soldiers against their brothers.Evacuation must never be done by soldiers. This is the police job. Soldiers must fight the enemy- not brothers ! It's a great pity that our finest boys will be in jail. They are irreplaceable!!!

Aren't the IDF supposed to protect and defend Israeli Citizens? I fail to see how using the IDF to evict Israeli citizens from Israeli land protects those citizens. It was a political decision that should not be left to the IDF to enforce. Far from being a childish move, I thought the soldiers showed backbone, love for Israel and its citizens when they refused to evict. It took mature people with backbone and conviction to take the action they did, knowing they'd face unpleasant consequences for their actions. To me, the childish part is on the side of the government expecting those who protect Israeli citizens to be the ones to evict Israeli citizens. In the US, if an order had been given to evict US citizens from a parcel of land, and the US Citizens weren't terrorists trying to overthrow the US, I'd expect our military to do the same thing. -- With support from the armed citizens the government was trying to oust. There would probably be at least a minor 'civil disturbance' if US Soldiers were ordered to keep doing this to US Citizens. Most soldiers would side with the citizens.

B"H The very fact that this guy, Stern, was allowed to rise to be a general and a manpower director and a chief educational officer and a commander of the officers’ school, tells the long and sorrow tale of how, after 60 years of statehood, the IDF became an army, without any Jewish soul left to it. It is unthinkable that a force so much removed from anything Jewish will defend the Jewish people. It will defend the hand that feeds its hungry mouth, the Government of Israel, the GOI as it likes to call itself in English. As it is, the IDF cannot be trusted with the defense of the Jewish people. It can be expected that it will continue to be the only regular army in the world that attacks Jews with the same skill it attacks Israel’s enemies, without a second, Jewish, thought allowed to survive within its ranks: a terrifying monster, an army just like any other army. As the IDF seized to be a Jewish army long ago it is the case to shout loud and clear: Jews, stand up for your Jewish right to have a Jewish army! I remember when my mother first visited Israel in the early '70s, she was deeply moved by the "Jew in uniform" at the airport, a long desired dream of a Holocaust survivor that she was. How far those days seem to be! Since then that same "Jew in uniform" was brainwashed to raise his hand against his own people, against his own mother, father, brother and sister. The sterns and the haluts and the baraks are destroying a once in a 2000 years, historic, Jewish opportunity of survival: the IDF. As things stand Jews, on the Land of Israel, look upon the IDF with suspicion, fearing the next pogrom, the next destruction of a shul, a beit midrash, a mikve, a Jewish home.

I WISH that Israel would become a democratic state. I only know several democratic states and they're all located in Switzerland. The governments of the Cantons of Switzerland reguarly pass legislation to the general public for their direct vote rather than impose the governing elites' will on the people. I am sure that if Israel would ask its citizens rather than dictate to them then things would be a lot better and you would not find soldiers having to resort to banners to let their feelings be known.

Democratic states have armed forces .However the armed forces are not democratic institutions that debate issues of policy,they carry out the orders of the politicians whether they like it or not ie they are contractors.You seem to have picked a poor example ,or that you just dont get it.

Yes ,state or torah.....thats the question.In a democracy its state and torah is a private matter and serarated from state.

Yeah right.

Israel has already begun destroying herself from within. It is those people who have advised all who would listen that the Israeli government must acquiese to rebbinic rule. That leads to the problem that rabbi A and rabbi B don't begin to agree on anything. That problem is aggravated by the fact that Torah Judaism is not taught and rabbis today are politicians in their own right looking out for their interests no different than the politicians vieing for power. Soldiers are taught that orders are to be obeyed; not questioned. For those who bring up illegal orders, the question becomes who deems the order illegal? The religious radical? Note; no common soldier was ever prosecuted for following "illegal orders". Only those who gave the order were held liable. If the order for insubordination were given by religious orders, then they who gave the order should be proscecuted. If it was a rebellion by the common soldier, then those soldiers should be held liable. Armies are run in a manner where orders are followed - period. Otherwise, it is not an army, rather a rabble and should be disbanded.

you seem to think you are quite knowledgeable on many subjects, have you ever been here, or served in the US army, or the IDF? You are very wrong about your assumptions, and it is a fact that the IDF is in fact under the influence of Labor party Kibbutzniks. These units made up of ultra religious, are very small, and have very little say in anything, although for the most part are good patriotic soldiers. Israels society is for the most part, secular and far too liberal if you ask me, not at all as you have described. I would love to know how it is you came to believe you are such an expert on these matters. The IDF has not been compromised or infected, this is just dumb. As for your last question, lets start with the basics, the Hebrew word for Hebrew is Ivrite, not Hebrew. These talkbacks are full of people who think they know so much about Israel, but obviously know nothing at all, and should just keep quiet, I doubt you even know what's going on in Fairport where ever that is, let alone here in Israel.