Opinion
And the winner is…Turkey
Manfred Gerstenfeld
Published: 02.03.11, 18:22
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54 Talkbacks for this article
1. Er ... not necessarily
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (03.02.11)
Read here: http://www.tabletmag.com/news-and-politics/60298/democratic-state/
2. Having written 19 books is quite a feat
Israeli 2   (03.02.11)
but this article is a non issue. It is a moot point, a moot subject. Israel is always on top and Israeli leaders thus far behave better than ever.
3. A rather exaggerated vision of the Turks
Cameron ,   USA   (03.02.11)
Despite Turkish nostalgia for the Ottoman centuries, I find it rather hard to believe either the Arabs, or Persians, allowing the Turks to once again seriously inflence ME events, or somehow set regional agenda.
4. FUTURE OF TURKEY !
Orao. ,   Srbia.   (03.02.11)
TURKEY WILL EMBARK ON MILITARY ADVENTURES, WHEN THE WAR IN MIDEAST COMENSES. TURKEY WILL BE DEFEATED ON ALL FRONTS, AND CRIPPLED OF SOME OF ITS TERRITORY. AFTERWARDS IN THE GREAT AND TERRIBLE DAY OF YEHOWAH, TURKEY WILL BE RUN OVER BY GOG AND MAGOG. Orao.Srbia.
5. and the winner is
moron ,   galut   (03.02.11)
turkey-persia-and soon egypt and we hope israel too--all the other states in that region are just tribes with flags as mubarak has said
6. israeli leaders behave well?
יעקב ,   תל אביב   (03.02.11)
but theyre some of the crappiest in the world..
7. A non-Western perspective
Israel Israeli ,   Tel Aviv   (03.02.11)
Gerstenfeld views the issues from a Western perspective. Both Iran and Turkey have great and ancient cultures, and both feel (justifiably) that the West prevented their advancement in the 20th century. Turkey did its best to be part of Europe but was shunned while Iran was the victim of Anglo-American meddling in its internal politics. In both cases, the reason was the West's obsession (fortified by generous payouts) with Arab supremacy in the Middle-East. Ahmadinejad is an expendable tool. Whether or not he is crazy is irrelevant. During his rule, Iran became powerful, admired in the Muslim world for defeating Obama, controls Iraq and will probably control Saudi Arabia. The Iranian-Turkey alliance forms a powerful block that is impervious to economic sanctions, and has natural friendship with all of Central Asia. I believe that eventually the Iran-Turkey alliance will be a super-power that rivals the Americans. The Indians will be happy to join because they will be protected from the American client-state Pakistan, and the Chinese will be happy to join to ensure their energy supply.
8. Turkey proved itself as the comeback kid
turkman ,   istanbul   (03.02.11)
we shall rule the middle east again jews and arabs will enjoy being part of our subjects and belong to our rising empire
9. And the loser is ... "Israel"
Levo ,   Turkey   (03.02.11)
While I agree with the undeniable premise of the article that Turkey is coming out as a big winner out of the Arab revolutionary mess at the same time Israel is likely to be the biggest loser! Having lost the region's most powerful country; Turkey after having murdered its unarmed citizens needlessly most Turks secular and pious could no longer care less for Israel. At the same time the 82 Million newly liberated 'Jew-loving' Egyptian citizenry is likely to add to Israel's insecurities and inherent paranoid state.
10. Dream on as Turkey forges ahead!
Levo ,   Turkey   (03.02.11)
Thought as a Serbian you still would have some work to fully clense your hands of Bosnian blood before touching the keyboard? Irrespective of your position Turkey is one of the most promising countries in the World with a stable robust economy and the World's 7th largest Armed Forces to kick the back ends of the likes of you!
11. To: No. 8
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (03.02.11)
Keep drinking the Kool Aid. Turkey has become a vassal state of the Islamic Republic of Iran, thus succeeding in alienating Arabs and Jews.
12. #11 Oh ya thanks for reminding me that Iran and Pakistan and
turkman ,   istanbul   (03.02.11)
part of India shall also subscribe to our doctrine Its a a new Dawn
13. Levo and Turkoman
David Israel ,   New York, USA   (03.02.11)
One difference between Israel and Turkey is that Turks talk a lot and act seldom while Israelis talk seldom and acct when it is necessary. The Turkish journalist Emin Colasan wrote about this subject many times in his old column in Hurriyet and recently in Sozcu. I don't see Israel being afraid of Turkey at all. iyi geceler.
14. NR 10.
Orao.   (03.02.11)
YOU WILL WITNESS THE END OF THE MONGOLIAN CONQUEST IN THE MIDEAST. Orao.
15. NR 12.
Orao-   (03.02.11)
YOU WILL EVEN SE IRAN KICK YOU ASSES. Orao.
16. #10: LEVO the Turkey
Israeli 2   (03.02.11)
You wrote that you have a stable robust economy and the World's 7th largest Armed Forces. I very much doubt that. Even if in your wildest imagination this is so, Israel's economy is a hundred times better than yours and Israel's Armed Forces are the world's best. Your behinds will be in Timbaktu before you will have a chance to say: Israeli Masters!
17. To: No. 12
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (03.02.11)
1. Iran is having difficulty what with internal dissension, which grows increasingly vocal and more organized with each passing day. 2. Pakistan? Dream on. In the event you haven't noticed, there is an extraordinary amount of internal strife in Pakistan, competing objectives and that pesky problem of tribal affiliation being far stronger than the identity as a "Pakistani" in the Kush. 3. The other part of India probably won't go along. That would be the far larger part of India, by the way. Whatever it is you are smoking, you really should stop. I understand that the penalties for drug use are quite harsh in your nasty country.
18. To: No. 10
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (03.02.11)
1. Robust economy? You must be on drugs. 2. Seventh largest UNTESTED armed forces. Israel can kick your ass in a matter of hours. Do not delude yourself.
19. The state of Turkish economy
David Israel ,   New York, USA   (03.03.11)
I am taking this from Hurriyet columnist Mehmet Yilmaz's artickle of 3/2/2011: The poorest 10% of Turkish population gets only 2.1 % of the entire gross oincomethe wealthiest 10% used to be 30.9 % but improved to 32.2. The gap between the poor and the rich is on average 8.5 times. The number of pooor in big cities increased 5.8%, in the countryside 9%According to TUIK (The statistics bureau) 12 million Turks are in the border of poverty and 10 million are below povertyu. 1 third of Turkey is poor. 60.5% of Turks can only afford to have meet one a month. If Levo and Turkoman are proud of this economy then I have no more to say.
20. funny :)
Baris ,   Ankara   (03.03.11)
It is funny that both Turkish and Jewish guys here are talking about military power, who can kick whose back side etc. :) It is funny where in fact both states are technologically and military wise "allies" if you like. They share nearly all intelligence and technology between each other. They need each other more than any other state in the region. A possibility of a war between the two is less than the possiblity of war between US an Israel :)
21. Sarah B. shut up anf go to sleep yo giving me
Dave   (03.03.11)
a headach. Grown woman with little girl mentality, go to bed! now!
22. On Turks and Persians
John G ,   Thessaloniki Greece   (03.03.11)
Dear newly rediscovered 3000 year old Jewish/Israeli friends. Fret neither about Turkey or Iran. Xerxes and Darius tried to control the region as their modern day counterparts aspire to do today. But they would be wise to remember that after Thermopylae came Alexander...
23. 18
anton ,   istanbul turkey   (03.03.11)
and how does israel do it sarah B :) with all the foregin help still israel is nothin but i wanna hear it from you enlighten us how can you kick our asses?
24. Only among losers could turkey be a "winner."
Bunnie Meyer ,   Los Angeles, CA USA   (03.03.11)
25. this talkback looks like kindergarden now
selim ,   uk   (03.03.11)
israel without is father or son USA is nothing in ME. Without nuclear arsenal they are nothing. They are same as north korea with democratic elections. People similar. They both live in a denial state. Turks were same but thanks to Erdogan we broke this nationalist resistance in Turkey.
26. Baris from Ankara - great post
David Israel ,   New York, USA   (03.03.11)
You made good sense for all of us. I also like your name Salom.
27. Selim from UK
David Israel ,   New York   (03.03.11)
Thanks to Erdogan today you have about 2000 political prisoners in Silivri Jail ranging from journalists like Miustafa Balbay and Tuncay Ozkan to medical doctors such as organ transplant pioneer Mehmet Haberal. They are kept in jail over 1 year with no charges. Turkey is the second among countriews that have cases open against them in the human rights court (AIHM). No such thing like Silivri (or in the past the Umraniye Jail) has ever happened in Israel and can not happen because in Israel democracy is real, people are conciencipous about it and wil protect it, while in Turkey democracy (in the immortal words of Erdogan) is just a bus not an objective. He will get off the bus when he gets to his stop and we all know what this stop is. Iyi geceler Selim Sleep tight.
28. To: No. 21
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (03.03.11)
I have a much better idea. Why don't you just swan off down the lane and post your puerile thoughts on Al Jazeera where you just might find someone that takes your pithy comments seriously? A substantive thought or two from you might be appreciated, but you don't ever counter talkbacks with anything substantive, do you?
29. To: No. 25
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (03.03.11)
Well, Israel did manage to defeat the Arabs in six wars. The nuclear arsenal, while there, has yet to be used. Somehow, however, while the Arab and Moslem states have been sinking deeper and deeper into the mire, Israel has grown and thrived and become a major economic and technological force. Turkey is backpedaling so quickly, it's amazing you haven't spun out of control -- although that is coming. The Turkish economy is in the toilet, you have lost your drydocking business, because it is now cheaper to drydock commercial cargo tonnage in Eastern Europe or the Far East. You will very shortly lose all those lucrative NATO bases, and you will not be admitted to the European Union. Turkey is well on its way to going back to be "the sick man of Europe." Sooner or later, the Kurds will have had enough and the rash of protests that is sweeping through the Arab and Islamic world will come to Turkey, too. Probably sooner.
30. Hard to Believe!
Devin ,   San Diego, CA   (03.03.11)
I see you are also in denial, it is happening in front of our eyes...
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