For the Army

I might be wrong, but isn't one of the basics of religion supposed to be something about being truthful? how religious are these yeshiva students in the first place or is it all according to 'comfort zones'?

What ever next? get a job serve in the IDF pay taxes ......

I do not understand why it is not mentioned. Such strange ban in modern times, for men over 22 yrs of age, demands an explanation. Tali Farkash is guilty of sloppy journalism! Surely this ultra-orthodox yeshiva does not expect its men to ride donkeys still?

Ridiculous extremism that goes beyond common sense is just plain foolish! Why the ban!?!

Aside from the fact that truthfulness is a Torah value, these young men violated the rules of an organization they CHOSE to join thereby accepting their rules and regulations explicitly. End of Story. One possible point they make is whether the Yeshiva makes exceptions. THAT would be unacceptable and a violation of the Yeshiva's implicit obligations under their own guidelines. However, this would in no way excuse the choice these students made to violate the rules. it doesn't matter why - at all! - the Yeshiva has this rule. It doesn't matter if the young men, having reached a certain age, might OTHERWISE be expected to get licenses. THEY CHOSE TO LEARN THERE AND MUST OBEY THE RULES AS, OF COURSE, THE YESHIVA ITSELF MUST. If the Yeshiva can be shown to make exceptions for certain 'favored' students it must be forced to also expel those students - not to accept the others that knowingly violated the rules.

I was drafted-the holders of the drivers licenses are apparently ready also---PS Are we sure some of these yeshivas aren't just Taliban schools? There are just too many similarities!

Hopefully they will see how crazy this is and find a place to study that embraces the 21st century. I'm sure that HUC, Machon Schecter, the Conservative Yeshiva and Pardes would welcome them - even with driver's licenses.

That is a standard rule in "prestigious yeshivot" and the students broke the rule. How the information was obtained is a matter of other authorities, but it should not stand between the dean and the students.

The reason they are not allowed drivers' licenses is because: If they are not defending Israel by joining the army they are supposed to be defending Israel by learning in the yeshiva. Experience has shown that those with licenses are too quick to skip yeshiva for frequent trips here and there. Every single boy signed a paper agreeing to not get a drivers license. They deserved to get kicked out.

The idea that learning and traveling in a car are completely unassociated in any way shape or form gives the reason for this away. Rewards. Little pieces of candy for the good and obedient students. Want a good wife from the selection behind the machiza? Want to go see areas outside walking distance? Want to be allowed to work and have money? Want that big contract? Want to stay in business? Want to live in peace? I remember my situation of oppression well. Attacks, damage, break ins and cheated business deals were on my mind. A dati told me, the mn made events were "from G-d" if you want all these attacks and bad dealings to go away, see the Rabbi and do as he says and everything will be good then. Of course my suspicions were confirmed. So evident to me why these drivers licenses are being withheld and severe punishment is being handed out for having what every other citizen is allowed to have. Manipulation using rewards which were really theirs all along and simply taken away by the leaders. False doctrine. This is not Torah and it is not my Judaism.

WHAT DONATION TO THE YESHIVA BUYS YOU THE RIGHT TO DRIVE?

Dont you think banning an adult from driving, an activity that has zero halachic implications if it is not done on shabbat or yom tov, and then LYING (SINCE YOU LIKE THE CAP LOCK KEY) to access the database of the transportation ministry is worthy of at least some scrutiny? Are you a thinking person, or an automaton who sees thinks only one way or the other?

that in order to FORCE them to study more Torah, you imprison them by making them less mobile. Isn't the mitzvah and the joy of Torah study enhanced when one can simply drive away from the yeshiva, but does not because he wants more Torah study? And on one's free time (one assumes that even a yeshiva studen't should have a few free hours in the course of a week) one should be able to travel and see Hashem's georgeous Land of Israel - the very inheritence they are learning to love while in the yeshiva? And isn't the challenge to teach these students that they are there out of love for Hashem and his Torah? I think your position on this and this rule is very, very misguided - and based on a premise that the mitzvah of Torah study in the yeshiva is enhance when it is based on the inability to leave. I can't think of logic more twisted up than that.

I think you need it badly.

Thank you, Shalom. I wonder what the secular madmen here have to say about that now. Apparently, the yeshiva thinks that if one is so holy that one should not go to the army, then one must indeed dedicate themselves to Torah truly, and not waste time or money on things like a drivers' license, which a single yeshiva boy absolutely doesn't need. If they are so much into being outside and not studying Torah, then perhaps they should indeed be in the Army? I suppose that's what the yeshiva thinks. I'd expect the secular commenters here to completely agree and support this, rather than oppose it.

This is perfectly logical for such licentious behavior. It is also an indication of the sick society that needs to completely control the thoughts of its participants. This is the ultimate "other directed". A student is told what to wear, what to eat, when to do everything from studying to eating, etc.

Thank you Daniel. Baruch - people love to complain about bochurim "warming benches" in yeshiva rather than learning so here is a way of the yeshivas showing it isn't acceptable behavior. "You want to be outside - go outside, go do the army, go where you want but don't expect the yeshiva to pay for your being here" If as you say it is merely "enjoying Hashem's world" during off-periods, it would be ok but its not, and the Rosh Yeshiva knows this.

22 years old is old enough to do a full 3 years so they can start immediately. The rule should be if you are expelled from yeshiva you immediately lose your exemption. They can even use their driving skills in the tank corps

You are an American and you should allow your mature son the freedom of speech and of decision making. He was "created equal" and it is a right guaranteed by our constitution. But before all that, you should answer to your peers: how come you didn't think about it ahead of time and sent your son to study there?

sadly, this fits a pattern. the same roshei yeshivot also forbid their students to learn a trade which might enable them to earn a living. equally frum yeshiva bochers outside of eretz yisrael don't rely on tzadakah to support themselves and their families, and their rabbis help them choose occupations that are compatible with their studies. there is much more to this than just drivers' licenses - "im ayn kemach ayn torah".

A gross violation of the mitzvah to teach it to your children regardless of whether they use transportation. The Rabbi kicking them out should get the same for his lack of understanding of the requirement on his part to really teach Torah. Will he be keeping all the money? Will he return donations of those who disagree? But Yeshivas don't teach Moses spoken/written Torah do they?

Ultra Orthodox are turning into the Taliban

I learned in both Lubavitcher Yeshiva & Yeshiva Mesivta Tiferes Yerushalayim (Feinstein Yeshiva) & the vast majority of yeshiva bochurim had driver licenses. This is total BS & reminscent of ayatollahs & has no basis in halacha!!!!

Chasva Chalilah, maybe even national service?

The boys - breaking their agreement to not get a drivers license? Or the Yeshiva leaders, breaking the 10 Commandments and LYING to the state about who they are to obtain the information? Easy for me to see... This Yeshiva.. not so prestigious after all! Certainly not observant, not worthy, and I would not send my child there. As to why the rule, who cares! Different organizations have all the strangest stipulations for membership, the boys broke their agreement and should be expelled. The "Rabbis" broke the Torah's laws and should be expelled, banned from any honors, and shunned until they appropriately apologies to the boys and the community at large.