Opinion
Determining our own future
Natalie Menaged
Published: 21.01.13, 11:15
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25 Talkbacks for this article
1. Democracy and Israel
Bertram ,   London, UK   (01.21.13)
I fully understand the position of the writer as someone who has recently made aliyah and agree with much of what she has said. Compared with almost any other country in the region and many elsewhere Israel is indeed a beacon of democracy. Does that mean that supporters of Israel should keep quite during the election season? My answer is a resounding 'no'. The argument will always be that Israel is constantly fighting for its survival; therefore it is legitimate to squash criticism since it will undermine the ‘war effort’. This is a dishonest argument and one that has historically been employed by dictatorships e.g. the Soviet Union and its ‘war’ against, Islamist states and their struggle against Western infidels. Accordingly, anyone who really loves Israel has an obligation to speak up when the government of the country is perceived to be acting in ways which undermine Israel’s very existence as a democracy. Such criticism may come from the left, the right, the centre, from both religious and secular standpoints, from other countries, etc. If censorship, self-imposed or not, is to become the order of the day then all arguments for Israel are lost.
2. #1 couldn't have said it better
Jordan ,   Detroit   (01.21.13)
I'm a dr. in Mi, but majored in Foreign affairs and Political science. My father and his entire side is Israeli. I love Israel. Love visiting, love staying in touch, love keeping up to date with everything Israel....including politics. Clearly democracy involves representation of the people through elections, and no one will ever deny that, but that doesn't mean that if you live abroad that you are not allowed to have an opinion and lobby for it. I have done work with AIPAC, FIDF, Magen David Adom, and many other US based organizations whose sole purpose is to aid and raise awareness for Israel in the states....and they work amazingly. AIPAC specifically is a lobby in OUR GOV'T. I think to say that non-citizens, or whoever, shouldn't try to address their opinion is short-sighted...heck, Israel has been doing it to the states for decades.
3. Obama and the E.U. are not friends at all.
Chaim ,   Israel   (01.21.13)
Fellow Jews, let's be honest. Obama and the E.U. are not friends at all. Deep down inside, we all know it. Obama and the E.U. would be just as happy if Israel disappeared tomorrow. They're doing all they can to make this occur. While most Americans and many Europeans are friends of Israel, Obama and E.U. leaders are anything but our friends. Their criticism is not only destructive. Their intentions are evil.
4. TO CHAIM, AT NR. 3.
SJOERD VAN DER VELDE ,   HOORN NH, HOLLAND   (01.21.13)
SOMEONE HAS EVER SAID, THAT COUNTRIES DO NOT HAVE FRIENDS/FRIENDSHIPS, BUT (OWN/NATIONAL) INTERESTS (AT FIRST), YES OR NO WITH OTHER COUNTRIES.
5. Unconditional support is not being given
Mark ,   Cleveland USA   (01.21.13)
American support for Israel is not , and should not be unconditional. American politicians have been afraid of the Jewish and Evangelical Christian vote in the US, which has stuck with Israel unconditionally. Israel's recent rejection of any peace process is slowly turning opinion around. Jews outside of Israel, and Americans do not want to support an Israeli government that is responsible for causing a war with the Arab world and endangering Jews and Americans everywhere, which will undoubtedly be the case when Bibi gets reelected.
6. Israel's Future is in her People And GOD is Sovereign King
Tova ,   Canada   (01.21.13)
I agree with this article. Having been to Israel a number of times. Democracy is appreicated by Israel. The people of Israel will openly voice their opinions for or against decisions made by the Israeli government. The citizens of Israel are also soilders who protect her people. In America, Canada, Europe. people will voice their opinions for against their country, but very few will fight for their country. Democracy is dying in the west. Israel is not perfect we all know that. However, no nation on earth has to fight to survive. In America, Canada, England etc. democracy is lazy, people do whatever they want without regard for their neighbour. In Israel demoracy doesn't have a a day off. Israel stands on guard to watch over her people.
7. Israel rides America like a Donkey, abusing the wealth...
Steve Benassi ,   Silver Bay, MN USA   (01.21.13)
...weapons, and political cover of the United States.
8. #3 Chaim
ltrail ,   United States   (01.21.13)
Your perception of Obama and the E.U. , are right on the mark. Fortunately for Israel, the G-d of Israel is her Friend and Protector.
9. # 2 AIPAC is an U.S. Lobby
Rod ,   Fargo N.Dakota   (01.21.13)
Unlike some of the Arab Lobbies who receive money from Arab Countries.AIPAC raises it's money from U.S. citizens
10. A pile of self-prizing PR crap ,...
split ,   US   (01.21.13)
Pathetic - Reminds me those warn out attempts to glorify communism in Soviet block in '50's and 60's designed to impress uneducated masses,...
11. #10, I agree
Beauchard ,   Amsterdam   (01.21.13)
It is also insulting to Israelis. If my family asks me for an opinion I should keep my mouth shut. According to this article they are too stupid/weak to make up their own mind after hearing my opinion.
12. Correction to No. 1
Bertram ,   London, UK   (01.21.13)
Line 10 should have read '...the Soviet Union and its 'war' against capitalism and imperialism, and Islamist states and their struggle against Western infidels.'
13. 9 - AIPAC raises it's money from U.S. citizens
split ,   US   (01.21.13)
AIPAC means Jewish Federations of North America (JFNA) or 154 tax exempt/parasitic organisations with offices in over 300 Jewish communities, practically in every boonie town in US and Canada a 5-th column that represents foreign interest. Every penny donated to them it's one penny less on government coffers that must be replased by additional taxes imposed on struggling US taxpayer.
14. 11 - It is also insulting to Israelis ,...
split ,   US   (01.21.13)
Maybe not or at least some of them ;) ,...
15. democracy
john ,   toronto   (01.22.13)
The state with all its failings still is a democracy and it should be appreciated.
16. #13 Better then raising it from foreign citizens and Govts
Rod ,   Fargo N.Dakota   (01.22.13)
Because it is a lobby, contributions to AIPAC are not tax deductible.It's not a Pac the PAC in Aipac stands for Public Affairs Committee.On the other hand The Council on American-Islamic Relations, as well as the offshoot CAIR Foundation, was included earlier this month on a massive list of 275,000 organizations that the IRS said were losing their tax-exempt status because they did not file required annual reports. Now you have proven to be a Terrorist apologist and white washer
17. Excellent article.
Luiz F Haddad ,   Niteroi, Brazil   (01.22.13)
The article above is excellent. We, true friends of Israel around the world, do admire her continued Democracy, since the begining, despite of several aggressions from bad neighbors. But it is important, not caring "right", "left" or "center", that blind radicalisms are defeated. The Jewish State must be always strong, through her military and moral forces. God bless Israeli brothers and sisters.
18. To # 10 You are 100% correct
Stan ,   Israel   (01.22.13)
If I were to list here some of the Inequality in Israel, or answer Right Wing views, Y-Net will not print it.
19. 16 - contributions to AIPAC are not tax deductible
split ,   US   (01.22.13)
But contributions to those154 organisations I have mentioned sustaining AIPAC, are so what's your problem - Either you're a liar or an ignorant, pick one!
20. your opinion at ynet
Boris ,   Edina   (01.23.13)
I understand and appreciate your entusiastic article at ynet, but as a person who lived in both US and Israel I would like to make a life slightly easier for all israelis and people who plan to move to Israel. 1st: Israel is surrounded not by all 50 friendly US states, but by very unfriendly arab states. 2nd: Arab states have (historically) higher birth rate and Israel will, eventually, be surrounded by Arabs who have legal rights to live in Israel. 3rd: there is no way Israel can completely kick Arabs out of Israel. 4th: Israelis have eventually to learn to live with Arabs. 5th: America has more than enough of its own problems, so it may not always be able to help Israell If you think about these issues, maybe you will focus your energy not on results of elections, but on what will happen to the next generation of Israelis if things go wrong (1,2.3,4.5). Be athzlaha!
21. #20. Israelis are growing majority; incl. Judea/Samaria.
Chaim ,   Israel   (01.23.13)
You make some good points. However, why spoil it with the "Arab demographic bomb" hoax? Jews are a growing majority in Israel, including Judea and Samaria. Countless credible American and Israeli studies prove this. P.A. census data on the "Palestinian" population of Judea and Samaria is wildly inaccurate and politically motivated to demoralize Israel.
22. #20 boris
solomon ,   bklyn   (01.23.13)
Although I have also lived in both countries, one need not do the same to note a “minor problem” in your thesis; The arabs who are not now in Israel do not have any legal rights to enter Israel. When people attack and attack (how many times?!) they cannot insist on any rights to be given by the people they want to destroy. Especially when they say they do not accept Israel and want to kill all the Jews. What planet do you live on?
23. #13 split - bogus
solomon ,   bklyn   (01.23.13)
"Every penny donated to them it's one penny less on government coffers that must be replased by additional taxes imposed on struggling US taxpayer. " You assume that they would donate to the US. And if you are speaking of the fact that they would pay less taxes to the US, remember that taxes are a percentage of the total, not the total itself. Your post is your typical crap.
24.  23 - #13 split - bogus
split ,   US   (01.24.13)
Why don't you google Jewish Federations of North America or any organisation affiliated with them like 'Israel Terror Relief Fund' and dozens of other's not affiliated on the top of those 154, like 'Pizza for IDF Soldiers' for instance and read instead of running your mouth. All contributions to those organisations are tax deductible, Lion share of AIPAC donations comes from those organisations and as I have said, every god damn penny donated to them it's one penny less in government coffers that must be replaced by additional taxes imposed on overworked struggling US taxpayer including the one that just lost his house, to fill the gap. We're talking about billions, pal ,...
25. #24 split - bogus
solomon ,   bklyn   (01.28.13)
"Lion share of AIPAC donations comes from those organisations " Kindly post the article where this is stated. (you have a good imagination.)
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