Opinion
The nastiest tax of all
Ariel Rubinstein
Published: 23.05.13, 10:38
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53 Talkbacks for this article
1. Cigs ruin the health and cost us all money
Ilan   (05.23.13)
Even fit he tax was 3x it wouldn't cover the costs to the health system paying for treatment to the victims.
2. Tax cigarettes even more
yael ,   haifa   (05.23.13)
Wake up and get with the times! Most of the Western world is increasing its taxes on cigarettes, and cigarettes are much cheaper in Israel than in many places in he West. This article is misleading and plagued by faulty logic- it is an established fact that the cost of smoking-related illnesses IS a massive burden on the hospital system, and that we are paying for that with our taxes. To suggest that most smokers die early from such illnesses and hence we are saving money from their early deaths is outrageous and grossly misleading. Lapid should raise the taxes highers still, the point is to stop people from smoking, yes Arabs and soldiers too, and the government is trying to do it by showing them that it is a habit too expensive to afford. This article is ridiculous, factually incorrect and out of touch with a huge body or research which exists on the subject
3. Maybe people should smoke less.
Avner ,   Tel Aviv   (05.23.13)
I cant handle the second hand smoke in public places anymore in Israel. Non smokers cant enjoy a cup of coffee while sitting in the outdoors of a coffee shop because they are smoking areas. People here smoke anyway where it's illegal to smoke.
4. Nice spinning of statistics Mr.Rubinstein:that's why we have
tom ,   tel aviv   (05.23.13)
them in the first place. Still smoking is an absolutely voluntary action not necessitated by any aspect of normative living. Actually it is the perfect target for taxes as witnessed all over the world. An idea for future, high-tech -world taxes: doing genetic testing of every citizen and taxing these having potentially expensive to cure illnesses...eh?
5. ha ha ha ha
(05.23.13)
This guy is a genius for coming up with this argument. ha ha ha ha I have an idea: let's make cigarettes free to make it easier for foreign workers and Arabs! But wait, then Ariel Rubinstein will accuse us of causing cancer in this vulnerable group. ha ha ha ha
6. The author's figures and calculations
Sagi   (05.23.13)
are indubitably correct as is the theme of his argument, but just as Lapid is incorrect in overtaxing the poor, the lower decile, the author is incorrect in standing up for the smoker's rights. This lower decile has been overtaxing society far too long now. Overtaxing by causing environmental suffering to individuals and causing medical harm to themselves which necessitates enormous medical expenditures on otherwise preventable conditions and illnesses. The equation of high taxes on the unfortunate people who smoke themselves into illness in order to pay for the future medical attention required is absurd to say the least. The time has arrived for Israel to be a world leader and to impose a total ban on cigarettes and tobacco, import, manufacture and use. By doing so we would indeed become "a light unto the nations".
7. If I was in charge - I'd burn down all tobacco fields
Barbara ,   Haifa Israel   (05.23.13)
Never smoked in my life (67) and don't need to. If society and civilization don't have the spine to burn down all tobacco (cancer) fields, then, yes, put an outrageous tax or price on cigarettes and tobacco - so that the weak and financially poor do not buy.
8. Ridiculous Article
EGGM ,   Petah Tikva, Israel   (05.23.13)
This article is so ridiculous that I don't know where to start. Firstly, the author alleges that the excise increase was targeting Arabs specifically, and implies that Lapid has something against Arabs and soldiers. In fact, he raised the tax because it's one of those steps that would bring a lot of money and wouldn't meet with major public protest. It might also convince light smokers to quit smokers. Secondly, the author alleges that smoking saves the country money. That is plain false. Research in Israel has shown that with all its ill effects, smoking costs NIS 8 billion a year in healthcare and related costs. In addition, the suggestion that if people die younger they're less of a burden on society and that's a good thing, brings back dark times in the history of the Jewish people. It's sad that some of us have descended so low when attacking a politician. Personally I'm not a Lapid supporter, but this is definitely one thing he did right.
9. #6:Really smart idea.That way we'd have one more "illegal"
tom ,   tel aviv   (05.23.13)
trade for the cops to chase: the cigarette-smugglers. Next would be alcohol, then somewhere along the line...Big Mac.Right? Then we could change the name of Israel to New Sweden. "Light" indeed :-(
10. ciggaretes
caleb ,   israel   (05.23.13)
I have heard that in England the NHS will not treat a lung cancer patient who smokes until he/she stops smoking. I see this as a very logical step for public finances and the attempt to improve the health of people.
11. stop whining--raise the tax more!
bob ,   potomac md   (05.23.13)
Bill Mahrer would call this article "liberal bullsh-t" smokers inevitably incur higher medical costs than non-smokers--let the smokers pay the users tax. And due to the dangers of second-hand smoke to those in proximity to them--let the tax be a penalty for being a public nuisance.
12. excise taxes
nadav ,   tlv   (05.23.13)
I love how the talkbackers here complain about smokers and their alleged burden on society, but does anyone wonder why there is no excise taxes fatty, salty, and expecially sugary foods, like cakes and candy? Obesity is the NUMBER 1 health hazard far outpacing cigarette smokers and alcohol drinkers! Following the logic of the government, a candy bar should cost as much as a pack of cigarettes! Then maybe we wouldn't need to see obese kids waddling to the doctor's office- at our expense!!
13. The author asks why don't we tax ice-cream..
Shachar ,   Eilat   (05.23.13)
I think he has a good point. Ice-cream, fatty foods and dangerous pastimes should carry heavy taxes. Gov't should be encouraging a healthier society and those who create a burden through poor choices should be paying for those choices.
14. Sagi #6
Eaglebeak ,   Left Coast, USA   (05.23.13)
We tried it with alcohol and it didn't work. It created crime. We didn't learn and we have now done it with drugs. It creates crime. The war on drugs is not to eliminate them but to keep the price high and make money for people in the government that profit from it. It's not a war but a business. Don't you have enough people in your jails to support that are a danger to others? Why pay to put and support people in jails that are really only a danger to themselves? Israel has serious problems to face without creating all the problems you would have by a total ban on cigarettes.
15. second hand smoke? How about second hand stink?
Ali Baba ,   tel aviv   (05.23.13)
Israelis still havent figured out what deodorant is for or how to use it and that goes for women too. Smokers cost a lot less to the medical care system than fat stupid israeli potheads who eat more shit than anyone else in the world (save americans). The israeli diet consists mainly of dairy and trans fats and carbohydrates. When governments in the west thought like lapid and placed ridiculous taxes on tobacco products people turned to black market smokes and stolen tobacco products from the mob. which was great for the smokers and the mob but not so great for the government and the extra security/losses for the tobacco manufacturer.
16. Shachar #13
Eaglebeak ,   Left Coast, USA   (05.23.13)
I guess if you really enjoy living in a police state that's a good idea. What are you going to do when big brother decides YOU are a burden?
17. Not quire right Shachar
david ,   jerusalem   (05.23.13)
Fast foods are dangerous only if eaten in obscene quantities. Rational quantities of such foods included in a healthy diet and a good exercise regime poses no health risks, thus health costs, whatsoever. Smoking, on the other hand, always poses a risk no matter what the quantity, you cannot counter the ill effects of smoking.
18. Second hand smoke
Dennis ,   Nj usa   (05.23.13)
I was recently diagnosed with bladder cancer. The three urologists I consulted prior to bladder removal surgery all asked me one question: did I ever smoke. I never have, but lived and worked in Israel where my office mates chain-smoked like chimneys. So much so that the first thing I dd when I came home at night was take a shower to get the smoke smell off my body, out of my hair,etc.i agree with the talkbacker above about Israel starting a total ban on cigarettes and cigars. My medical costs were born, by the way, by US medical insurers, not by Israeli society. I paid the ultimate cost, with subsequent chemo, etc.
19. The point is making the healthier choices cheaper
Shachar ,   Eilat   (05.23.13)
and the unhealthy choices more expensive. Everyone can still choose as they please but more will choose the healthy option and society will become healthier as a whole. And that is what every gov't should be aiming for.
20. Another slanderous, garbagey, tabloidesque article
Jake   (05.23.13)
If Lapid had wanted to target Arabs for tax hikes, he would have gone straight for the elephat in the room: the non-paymenet of municipal tax (Arnona) by 4 out of 5 Arab citizens of Israel. The fraudulent use of the 'race card' is getting a old...
21. Israelis Smoke Too Much
J ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (05.23.13)
And often in place where it's forbidden: literally 'in your face.' Let them pay for their ostentation.
22. It affects the poor,,,not the rich
Jayjay ,   Israel   (05.23.13)
Yair is a political hack without any qualifications. All he is doing is helpin his rich elite buddies, and making it harder for the poor.,
23. The "Rich" should be made to smoke more, if by force!
tom ,   tel aviv   (05.23.13)
24. To: No. 1
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (05.24.13)
How about levying an obesity tax? Given the myriad health problems that accrue to obese individuals, it's quite likely a far bigger burden on the health care system.
25. Discrimination
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (05.23.13)
I know in the United States, someone with a substance abuse problem -- drugs or alcohol -- can go on disability and go to a residential program to help them over their substance issues. Smokers, on the other hand, while labeled "addicts," cannot. I think that is fundamentally unfair. Someone can smoke one, ten or even one hundred cigarettes and get behind the wheel of his car and poses no threat to anyone. The same cannot be said for someone who has a few drinks, or is flying high on cocaine, heroin or methamphetamine (and a whole host of other drugs). In New York, a pack of cigarettes costs as much as two drinks in an upscale bar. It seems to me that there is far more to be gained by taxing alcohol, and legal drugs such as Oxycontin or Vicodin, than by taxing cigarettes -- and people who need help quitting nicotine should have the same access to residential treatment centers as other substance abusers.
26. To: No. 6
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (05.23.13)
Something along the lines you suggest was tried in the United States with respect to alcohol. It was called "Prohibition." It was eventually repealed ... why? The smuggling problem so taxed the resources of law enforcement, they had no choice. Of course, the years of Prohibition made the Mafia grow and thrive. You cannot legislate people's health. The best you can do is to help people stop abusing alcohol, drugs and cigarettes. Those programs all cost money, too. And here's another thought: one of the worst problems in American society today is obesity. That is the cause of a whole host of medical problems, which ends up costing everyone. Should society impose an additional tax on obese people because of the added burden to the taxpayer covering health care issues such as heart disease, diabetes, high blood pressure and so forth? Should we ban high-calorie, high-fat snack foods and steak and potatoes, too? Or assess an additional 15% tax on morbidly obese people who buy these commodities but not on others? Where will it end?
27. To: No. 10
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (05.24.13)
Shall we deny medical care to alcoholics, substance abusers and the morbidly obese until they (i) stop drinking, (ii) stop abusing drugs and (iii) get their weight under control?
28. Stupid move ,...
split ,   US   (05.23.13)
Don't count your tax money yet the smugglers and the infrastructure related to then can hardly wait to share it with you. They and the smokers are a creative bunch of people much more creative than the government. To fight the border smugglers, distribution gangs, crooked smoke shop owners, illegal street vendors intrusive laws affecting everyone will follow. Not much will end up in government coffers and a lot will be spend to enforce the laws - The final product, more crime due to competing gangs, no one will stop smoking and you will end up paying for it and a police state ,... By the way, statistically the poor and uneducated are the majority among smokers ,...
29. Unjust tax on cigarettes
Josh ,   Hod Hasharon   (05.24.13)
So poorer Israelis smoke more than the rich. If they have so much money to spend on fags every month, they should receive less help from the state. As far as I am concerned Lapid should have doubled the tax. Silly article!
30. To: No. 28
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (05.24.13)
Let me guess. Statistically, you're a smoker. I'm betting that you're also a drinker. You're just living on the backs of the American taxpayer, aren't you? Hey, split, how many Poles does it take to change a light bulb?
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