Opinion
'Racism' or extinction
Dan Calic
Published: 08.06.13, 12:32
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1. Racism or Extinction by Dan Calic
Gennaro Pasquale ,   Oyster Bay, NY, USA   (06.08.13)
The rights of Arab citizens should be compared to other citizens, not to other countries. Arab citizens of Israel are barred from most of the land held under racist Jewish National Fund rules which prohibits leasing to non-Jews. Arab villages get less government aid for housing and education. Original Israeli sin was that Jews became a majority when the indigenous Palestinian fled or were expelled. The occupation and Zionism itself are Israeli's sins today. There has never been an Inquisition or holocaust or expulsion of Jews in any Arab or Muslim ruled country.
2. # 1 The word SIN first used in the Torah Islam is sin
BUILD BABY BUILD!!!! ,   United States   (06.08.13)
and an affront to all that's holy. Rights of Arabs? Which Arab nation has 'equal rights' for any of her citizens, especially women? You're a lunatic. You Muslims are murder...
3. #1.
Beary White ,   Norway   (06.08.13)
You are paid by the author to start the discussion?? Referring your talkback: "There has never been an Inquisition or holocaust or expulsion of Jews in any Arab or Muslim ruled country. " So, pissqual, You do not deserve to be discussed, cause even some islamic followers are enlightened, for sure, you are not among them. Sorry mustafa, you are talking nonsens, BS, crap and reveals your brain is not working.
4. Dan, what is a Dane? A Swiss? A Frenchman?
(06.08.13)
Enlight us please!
5. 1
Ron ,   oc us   (06.08.13)
Got your facts wrong. Jews were expelled from Arab countries after 1948: approximately 800,000 thousand of them. There are very few Jews in Arab countries. However, Arab national aspirations are elsewhere and Israel should encourage them to leave Israel. There will be little Arab loyalty to the Jewish state.
6. #1 Pasquale.
Lazerbenabba ,   London, England   (06.08.13)
It would be very easy to itemise and contradict all and every statement that you have made but it is clear that your comments are from an entrenched racist agenda of your own. The history of Israel and its journey to statehood is there for all to see but you and your ilk will never let logic and truth get in the way of your manifest hatred and racism toward Jews. However I can not resist contradicting you on one glaring modern example of the holocaust and mass expulsion of Jews from Arab, Muslim countries; upon the UN declaration of the formation Israel, almost all Arab countries expropriated land, property and possessions from their Jews causing many to flee due to the various progroms that occurred with the endemic and continuing a policy of extreme prejudice. There have been minor exceptions for short periods of time but that is all they were ; very, very short.
7. Turkey was close
Zechariah   (06.08.13)
Most Eastern European Jews could of escaped to Turkey an. Islamic Land that has committed genocide against the Armenians and then gone onto other Islamic lands.
8. To #1
zii ,   Helsinki, Finland   (06.08.13)
Actually the Jewish National Fund leases to non-jews these days so that claim is baseless. Israelis shouldn't be blamed for the fleeing of arab refugees that happened before most current Israelis were even born. Do you also think Czech or polish citizens of today should be blamed for evicting Germans around the same time? You might wanna look up what happened in arab countries during the Israeli war of independence. 900 000 jews fled from arab lands. Thats even more then the 700 000 arabs who fled from Israel. Just like the arabs, they left in varying conditions, some just ran away, some were expelled. I know in arab countries, most recently Egypt, they've started denying the existence of a large jewish community in the countries and call it a lie. Majority of Israel's jewish population are decendants of those jewish refugees. I always thought only brainwashed people in the arab world would buy the claim that there weren't jews in arab lands, but aparently I was wrong. You seem to be a westener who believes everything arabs made up.
9. Truth sets free, but hurts
Carlos ,   Dominican Republic   (06.08.13)
This is a very accurate description of the broad picture: arab citizens wouldn't admit it in public but prefer to live with the rights and the freedom that Israel gives them instead of the one offered by their arab neighbors. It's a fair comparison. Now, If everytime the human rights situation in Israel is being discussed, (or protested) we bring 1948 back then things won't improve. The past cannot be changed ! A good step forward is to accept the common ground between both groups and work together against the challenges. My humble two cents.
10. Jews...the forgotten "indigenous" people ...
Serge ,   NY USA   (06.08.13)
There's the "myth" on the Arabs being the sole "indigenous" people in the area known today as Israel and before that as "Palestine". In fact, Jews continued to live in Israel throughout history, regardless of which regime was in power. The Jewish Virtual Library estimates that in 1517, well before the Zionist movement existed, there were only around 300,000 people living in Eretz Yisrael, where 5,000 of them were Jewish. According to the Ottoman Turkish Census of 1893, there were 371,959 Muslims, 42,689 Christians, and about 9,000 Jews living in Israel. These statistics demonstrate that Jews were living in the Land of Israel well before Zionism and the Balfour Declaration. Muslims were never the sole inhabitants of the land like the Native Americans were in the United States. Another myth to be debunked is on the so call benevolent arab/Islamic rule over the Jewish population along the centuries By now, it should be very well known on the conditions that jews on general were living in Muslims lands as "dhimmis". Dhimmis were excluded from public office and armed service, and were forbidden to bear arms. They were not allowed to ride horses or camels, to build synagogues or churches taller than mosques, to construct houses higher than those of Muslims or to drink wine in public. They were not allowed to pray or mourn in loud voices-as that might offend the Muslims. The dhimmi had to show public deference toward Muslims-always yielding them the center of the road. The dhimmi was not allowed to give evidence in court against a Muslim, and his oath was unacceptable in an Islamic court. To defend himself, the dhimmi would have to purchase Muslim witnesses at great expense. This left the dhimmi with little legal recourse when harmed by a Muslim. Dhimmis were also forced to wear distinctive clothing. In the ninth century, for example, Baghdad's Caliph al-Mutawakkil designated a yellow badge for Jews, setting a precedent that would be followed centuries later in Nazi Germany. The situation of Jews in Arab lands reached a low point in the 19th century. Jews in most of North Africa (including Algeria, Tunisia, Egypt, Libya and Morocco) were forced to live in ghettos. In Morocco, which contained the largest Jewish community in the Islamic Diaspora, Jews were made to walk barefoot or wear shoes of straw when outside the ghetto. Even Muslim children participated in the degradation of Jews, by throwing stones at them or harassing them in other ways. The frequency of anti-Jewish violence increased, and many Jews were executed on charges of apostasy. Ritual murder accusations against the Jews became commonplace in the Ottoman Empire. Other than that here are some dates on pogroms against jews in Arab lands: 1834 - Safed; 1840 - Damascus; 1853 and 1875 - Aleppo. On the 20th century: the ethnic cleansing of Hebron (1920), the closure and expelling of the Jewish community in Jerusalem by the Jordanians in 1948 and from 1948 to the 70's the ethnic cleansing of more than 1 million jews in the Arab countries. So much for benevolence ....
11. On JNF and non jews
Serge ,   NY USA   (06.08.13)
Jewish National Fund to allow land sales to non-Jews for limited time JPost.com Staff 08/06/2013 The Jewish National Fund has agreed to sell land in Israel to non-Jews for a limited time, the organization announced on Monday morning, ahead of a High Court discussion on three petitions calling on the Israel Lands Administration (ILA) to stop restricting public tenders for JNF land to Jews. The JNF announcement was part of the state's response to the High Court petitions. The state and the JNF had reached an agreement according to which the government would "reimburse" the organization for land it sold to non-Jews, by providing it with an equal amount of state land. According to the JNF's response to the High Court of Justice, this policy will be in effect for the three months it will take to draft a final land-swap deal with the state. The decision followed the adoption of a former ruling by Attorney-General Menahem Mazuz, who said the ILA must uphold the principle of equality in allocating land.
12. Gennaro #1
Robert Haymond ,   Teko'a, Israel   (06.08.13)
Your response is so full of holes predicated on your ignorance of the actual situation in Israel as well as your ignorance of sociology that I will only identify one serious error in your (socalled) "scholarship": The Jewish people in Arab Muslim lands escaped the frequent and brutal treatment to which they were subject in Christian Europe so, by comparison, you are right, they were not "ill treated". Treatment of Jews (and Christians) in Arab lands, as minority populations, varied considerably depending on the mood of the ruling elite, the political pressures on the particular regime and the economy, etc. At all times, however, Jews were considered "dhimmis" and were forced to wear demeaning yellow stars in order to identify themselves. They were not equal before the law. For instance, a Muslim child could testify against a Jew but no single Jew was allowed to testify against a Muslim in Court. Jews were second class residents. From time to time they were subject to pogroms as well as mass expulsions in which their property was confiscated. About 900,000 Jews fled Arab lands in fear for their lives after 1948, their property confiscated. Poor and bewildered, they were taken in by the newfound State of Israel and, within ten years, were more or less integrated prompting Golda Meir to say: We were almost too successful." She meant, of course, that these Jews could not be used for propaganda purposes as the Arabs used the pitiful situation of the former residents of Palestine used, and still use, theirs. Incidentally, there were terrorist attacks on Jews from the neighbouring Arab populations beginning in 1920 in the area once referred to as "Palestine" and a particularly brutal assault in Hebron in 1929 (60 Jews murdered, women raped, property pillaged). Once the Jewish population developed anew its nationalism, however, it was able to protect itself and, eventually, build a nation. I hope this little comment helps you, Gennaro, improving your academic credibility and might even spur you on to visit the region for a month or so in order to view the historical facts firsthand as well as the current sociological situation of Jews and Arabs, not to mention Christians and Druse, in Israel today.
13. Dan asks "Why is it that every other group of people can...
Fred Nerks ,   Wagga   (06.08.13)
... have at least one national homeland where they are the clear majority?" He has not been to Australia no doubt..
14. Here 'Gennaro', start with our southern nieghbour;
er der   (06.08.13)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_and_Muslim_countries#Egypt You can get some knowledge! :^)
15. #1
nava ,   jerusalem   (06.08.13)
Your facts are completely wrong. Non Jewish citizens can lease JNF Land since 2007. In other cases, in land disputes, Arab falsification of past ownership is usually given precedence over Jewish proof of ownership. That my friend is racism against Jews. This was designated as a Jewish state. It's a sin that we are the majority?? Did you read the article? In some cases Arab villages get less for education, etc. but in others they get more than the neighboring Jewish ones. Life isn't equal between Jews either. That's just life. But the most bizarre statement you make is that there has been no inquisition or expulsion of Jews from Arab or Muslim countries. What are you thinking? It is completely documented fact you can look up anywhere...The Jews were persecuted, expelled and their property stolen from Algeria, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Lebanon, Libya, Morocco, Sudan, Syria,Tunisia, Yemen, Aden and Djibouti. Was this supposed to be a joke post?
16. What are you, 5 years old? Do you completely lack ...
Intedi Nensak ,   Stockholm, Sweden   (06.08.13)
..the ability to think logically? Most blacks in South Africa had it way better than their neighbours also thanks to the strong south african economy, there was a constant pressure of blacks wanting to get into South Africa - despite the racist policies of the state. Your view is that arabs are one solid bloc but they're not, why is it so hard to understand that Egyptians are Egyptians and Yemenis are Yemenis - and proud of their nationalities? Arabs are not all the same people, they deserve their own states, just like you pointed out that the swiss and danes are two different peoples, despite both being white and christian. No one is slamming jews for their wish to have a homeland - they're slamming Israel for their denial of other people of theirs and their constant mistreatment of non-jews. None of those 22 arab countries with their 350 million people can match the military of Israel and none of them have nukes, they're just as afraid of annihilation from you as you are of them. Israeli arabs do not enjoy all the benefits of citizenship, to claim such a thing is just ignorant. Look at arab towns and you see how decayed they are, how every possible step to exclude them from the rest of the country is made. Roads, electricity, state grants - everything goes to the jewish cities while the arab ones are left with some of the leftovers, and that is if they're lucky to get anything at all. Nor are they allowed to buy homes wherever they like, that is blocked by the JNF to prevent jews and arabs from mixing - they're mostly confined to their bantustans with a few exceptions. They can vote and serve in parliament, yes, so can jews in most arab countries, the few jews that remain there anyway. Being excluded from military service is a more correct way of putting it, the jewish state doesn't WANT them to serve, it has nothing to do with some good will gesture towards the arabs. You obviously have no idea what democratic state is if you think having a vote is enough and then the state can go ahead and abuse you as much as they like, cuz hey, once every 4 years you get to vote on who will kick you in the head. Israel is far from a democracy, apartheid state is truly a very fitting label for it, it has extensive rights for some ethnicities (jews) and less so for others (anyone who isn't a jew). In its current form, Israel deserves to become extinct. Hopefully it can be replaced by a new state of Israel, where the jewish aytollahs have lost their influence and people of all ethnicities and religions can enjoy democratic rights.
17. Privileges
Get Real ,   UK   (06.08.13)
Jews in Arab countries do not have all the privileges Arabs enjoy in Israel, whilst Arabs in Arab countries too lack many of those privileges. It is no wonder Israeli Arabs are content with their position when compared to living in most Arab countries.
18. #1. Looks like someones been shucking YOUR oyster
A ,   Belgium   (06.08.13)
In 1947, Heykal Pasha, the Egyptian UN delegate, presented a plan to expel the Jews from Egypt. A similar plan was devised by Iraq, who suggested "transfering" Iraqi Jews through Jordan to Israel. Similar plans were endorsed by Yemen, Libya, Algeria, Syria and other arab countries. The only arabs who actually protested against these actions were "palestinians", as more and more Jews were arriving home to Israel from arab countries. And your so called indigenous "palestinians" fled because they were ordered to by the arab armies who planned on pushing the Jews into the sea. Either learn some facts or go back to shucking your oyster.
19. #16 from the Israeli "far" left
Shachar ,   Eilat   (06.08.13)
I very rarely agree with Dan Cilic but the gist of the article is right. Israel is not a racist state or apartheid state(and I was in South Africa in the 1980's). We have many problems and a very awkward situation, things are not ideal. But Israeli Arabs have all the democratic rights to fight for their rights. The Israeli High Court of Justice is a very special court which doesn't exist anywhere else in the world. It allows all citizens and even non-citizens to challenge gov't policy, norms etc. There is more to Israel than what appears in the news....
20. #1 Are you for real?
Sergio ,   Tel Aviv   (06.08.13)
Mate is everything ok with you ? Are you delusional? Jewish National Fund??? Where when how??? As far as i am aware there are no restrictions on buying apartments and houses in any part of the country. I have many arab friends living in the same city with me and in cites near me. And they never had an issue with moving to another place as long as they wanted to. Arab villages hardly pay taxes and we are trying to fight this thing with all citizens jewish and non jewish together. If you will go to any Jewish city that not paying taxes it will look the same. Regarding Jews from arab countries please educate your self read history and facts. They had to flee arab countries and leave all their property there. And trust on me they owned much more than any palestinian who willingly left by the way. If you are talking about few of them who were forced to leave most of their lands still belong to them and are untouched. Please get your facts straight before writing the nonsense. To the author. I did not know Switzerland is a nation. Sorry dude it is a multinational country that has french, german and italian parts. You would better use Sweden but i believe they will soon become more Muslim then Middle East. Cheers.
21. whatever happens, don't talk about Turkey.
Miron ,   USA   (06.08.13)
22. Gennaro Pasquale # 1
Arnold ,   m   (06.08.13)
Jews were persecuted and expelled from every Arab country starting in 1947. If you do not even bother to check facts before posting then please stay away. PS- Palestinian Arabs slaughtered Palestinian Jews in Jerusalem 1920 , Jaffa 1921 , and Hebron 1929. Look it up.
23. To much time on your hands?
tiki ,   belgium   (06.08.13)
Than continue to explain & discuss with provokers like no.1
24. Can anyone tell me?
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (06.08.13)
When the ersatz "Palestine Authority" was invented. how many Arabs living as full Israeli citizens decamped eagerly in order to live under the ersatz "Palestine Authority?" NOT A SINGLE ONE. Doesn't that tell you something? It certainly should. What? Give up everything that the Jewish state has enabled them to have in order to live under a corrupt, tyrannical bankrupt self-proclaimed imaginary state? I guess not. I wonder why. Actually, I don't. I KNOW why. Israel is good for its Arab population. They aren't going to leave in order to live in a fantasy ersatz "Palestinian" make believe, corrupt and tyrannical entity. Gee! Why do you suppose that is?
25. #1
rodolfo kohn ,   BOYNTON BEACH   (06.08.13)
oh! the jews were never expulsed from arab countries?!wow! where were you living?in space? no internet or newspapers?no libraries? NEVER READ A PAPER OR BOOK? PERHAPS!Jews were never allowed to have land ,not even an inch in arab states!and they had to pay a special tax for non muslims which exists even today in some arab countries...even algeria and tunis had this.I must say:Gennaro lei e patzo!
26. Dan Calic Racism
Gennaro Pasquale ,   Oyster Bay, NY, USA   (06.08.13)
There is strong evidence that Zionist agitation was the reason for most of the Jewish flight from Arab countries. In 1999 the JNF was forced to withdrew an application for tax exempt status in Nassau County, New York when confronted with their racist apartheid policies.. For hundreds of years Jews went to every country in the world except Palestine. "Next year in Jerusalem" was just a way to keep the kids quiet when they asked why they do not want to leave New York for the Holy Land At least you are not denying that Jews were a tiny minority for hundreds of years before 1947 and even then they were only about 35% of the population. The Palestinians were a people rooted to the soil of the Holy Land.
27. About racism
Harri ,   EU   (06.08.13)
Most Israeli Arabs may have it pretty good (not as good as Jews), but the racism is greatest in the occupied territories. You have 2.5 million de facto citizens who don't enjoy any benefits of citizenship. They can't vote in the elections of the country that controls their everyday living.
28. #1 Pasquale
(06.08.13)
Everyone knows that there is no such thing as "indigenous Palestinian". The Arabs who nowadays are called "Palestinians" are mostly descendants of recent immigrants to Israel. Read the PLO charter and you will see that even they don't consider themselves indigenous people of Israel.
29. second class citizenship is still second class
avramele   (06.08.13)
The baseline is not the treatment of minorities in other lands but the comparative status and treatment of the majority both de jure and defacto. So while Arabs and other non jews have it better than elsewhere, they lack the full social equality that citiizens of a modern democracy, particularly a Jewish one, have the right to aspire to. Israel can and should do better in its laws, Social relationships and intergroup behaviors.
30. #16
Eli Reuven ,   Newton USA   (06.08.13)
Your assertion, "In its current form, Israel deserves to become extinct.", needs to be examined a wee bit. You implicitly claim to be able to think more logically than a 5-year-old. I don't think so. If your assertion were true, then it would follow that in their current form every Arab state deserves to become extinct, that most African states deserve to become extinct, that Russia and China deserve to become extinct, etc. In the context of such extreme hate towards Jews that is common in the Middle East, Israel, with all its imperfections, is a magnificent achievement, and it is an ongoing work-in-progress. Should there be a sea-change in the Arab/Muslim attitude towards Jews in which the A/M seek to be partners with Jews and the rest of the world in human advancement, the A/M Middle East could become one of the most desirable areas of the globe. Until then, the A/M Middle East continues to be one of the least desirable areas.
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