Olive trees uprooted in Palestinian village
Ali Waked
Published: 25.11.05, 00:43
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18 Talkbacks for this article
FARES ,   CLEVELAND   (11.25.05)
2. The truth about Bil'in and other crimes of the occupation
Jacob katriel ,   Haifa   (11.25.05) Other crimes of the occupation, related to olive groves: and this is not even the tip of the iceberg ... Will Ynet publish my comment? I trust they will!
3. and Palestinians are suppossed to LIKE Israelis???
4. Thieves are thieves no matter what you may call them
Salameh ,   Gaza, Palestine   (11.25.05)
Settlers are thieves who steal our land before the very eyes of the international community, Israeli Occupation army are thieves who steal our right of freedom and movement on a daily basis before the UN and the security council every hour, and the Israeli gouverment is stealing all the above while humaity is watching and doing nothing to stop it. However, no matter how many of our olive trees they cut, and how many of our water wells they poison and how much of our cattle they slaughter and posion, we will not leave, this is OUR LAND, and while yvgeneys, poliskys and falshas have countries to go back to, we've got no other home than this.
5. I agree. This is a criminal act.
David ,   Yerushalayim   (11.25.05)
6. Yes, criminals, the hizz bull ahh, the slumy jihad, etc. are
Bunnie Meyer ,   Santa Monica, CA   (11.25.05)
criminals. And, without their terrorism no fence would be needed. And if the koran didn't urge islamic people to "kill the Christians and the Jews' then neighbors could live in peace. OK, the arabs could disavow the koran, Israel could take the fence down and neighbors could live in peace. Arabs first!
7. to # 4
ari   (11.25.05)
you do have land to go back to. Jordan, Syria, Egypt, Lebanon.....etc. Never your land to begin with. love how u people just make up lies through your clenched teeth
8. It's a crime; no two ways about it
Michael Steiner ,   Praha, EU   (11.25.05)
Yet another plate comes off our armor of morality. I hope the people adversely affected sue the asses of those who perpetrated and facilitated this outrageous crime and get their just compensation. The anti-terror barrier should be built on the Green Line, on our side. Then there would be absolutely no problems.
9. Terrible but if you play with fire you get burned
Lemar ,   UK   (11.25.05)
Of course its terrible to uproot old olive trees but if only the Palestinians had accepted Israel in 1948 or not waged three wars against them or accepted Baraks offer there would be no wall and nothing like this would have happened
10. What's the difference?
Shai ,   Israel   (11.25.05)
Yes, instead of selling the old trees to a bunch of landscapers, they should have been replanted on the other side of the Green Line (the trees were on the Israeli side, according to the article), and that in fact is what is supposed to happen. That's what happened with other infrastructure projects that did not result in an agreement with the owners of the trees, in any case. That said, don't act so righteous. The Palestinians have been stealing us blind (car thefts, lives, electric, water, etc.) for years. Two wrongs don't make a right, but don't ignore that both sides victimize each other, not just Israelis making victims of Palis. There's plenty of blame to go around.
11. Shai (10), are you sure you understand what you read?
Zumbush   (11.25.05)
You wrote "the trees were on the Israeli side, according to the article" and I would like to tell you that you are nuts! Go to Bil'in and you will see in your own eyes how far from the green line this all is. There is a whole illegal sttlement east of the green line and WEST of Bil'in, called Modiin Ilit. If you can read a map I will send you an appropriate link. Just leave a message for me to do so. I doubt you have full elementary school education.
12. Sign the petition protesting against the robbery in Bilin
David ,   Israel   (11.25.05) Thank you Against Wall
13. To 11
Shai ,   Israel   (11.26.05)
1) The article referred to Modiin, not Modiin Illit. Modiin is ENTIRELY inside the Green Line, Modiin Illit is ENITRELY outside the Green Line. Send me a request, and I'll send you a map that shows this so you can show your kindergarten buddies. 2) Quoting an Arab from the article, "It is true that the lands are on the other side of the fence, but according to an agreement between us and the army, we are allowed to cultivate them. Although the army puts a lot of difficulties in our way, it does not deny the fact that the land is ours," he said." I'll allow the army to speak for itself, as I find them more trustworthy than an Arab from Biliin regarding who owns what, and what the army "does not deny". It's more probably true that the Army allowed them to tend to these trees that were not on lands with clear title, since the Israeli government is rightly in control of lands with no clear title, and since they benefit and nobody is harmed by their tending these trees and profiting from the olives, the army allowed it. But even if these Arabs did own land inside the Green Line, and I mentioned that Modiin is ENTIRELY inside the Green Line, it's entirely within Israel's right to take land that's within the Green Line for anything they want, from Arabs and Jews alike, and they do it all the time, just like other governments take land by eminent domain. As far as the so called "illegal settlement" of Modiin Illit, Zambush, which is NOT what this article is about, one needn't even a elementary school education to look on a map and see that while it may be EAST of the Green Line, it's ever so slightly NORTH of it, and there is no Arab settlement between Modiin Ilite and Modiin. No Arabs are being displaced by Modiin Ilite. The reverse is true, the location of the fence to exclude Naalin has put Nili and Naaleh outside the fence line, which in the future will likely displace quite a few Israelis. Lastly, Zambush, we see that your definition of "illegal" is a political one, loaded with obvious pretensions of righteousness, when in fact it's not righteous at all, but is rather tendentious like similar comments offered by people like you who pretend to know so much more than every othe r mere mortal when these mortals disagree with your infatuation with Palestinians and all things Palestinian. Your definition is consistent only with GEneral Council of the UN resolutions, and the opinions of other bodies of the UN whose opinions have no legal weight, and it contradicts Resolution 242, which does have legal weight, and leaves to negotiations between the two sides what the final boundaries should be. In other words, the boundaries are to be negotiated, not decided by the Arabs of Biliin or Zambush. In the meantime, there's nothing wrong with Jews living in ANY part of the Holy Land, and as long as the lands are not taken from people who have clear title and don't wish to sell it.
14. To Shai (13)
Zumbush   (11.27.05)
Dear Shai, You think that you know what you are talking about. Well, you don't. I will only address your (presumably) strongest point: You quote a Palestinian whoo says: "It is true that the lands are on the other side of the fence, ..." and you conclude that the lands are on the Israeli ("west") side of the green line. I have news for you, Mr. ignoramus (or Mr. Lier). The apartheid fence runs well inside the occupied territories. All the lands of Bil'in are "east" of the green line, i.e., on territory that Israel occupied in 1967. I know that you would like people to believe that the apartheid fence is being built on the green line. I wish it were. PS: I use "east" and "west" in a symbolic sense, to mean occupied territory or Israel, respectively. The green line serepentines in a complicated way but this is immaterial for the argument. So, please try not to be a smartass. It is enough that you represent assholes.
15. "the nearby Israeli town of Modi'in. " Misprint!
Zahava ,   Petah Tiqva   (11.27.05)
Modiin and Bilin do not neighbour one another. Modiin Ilit separates bewteen them. The text should have referred to Modiin Ilit. It is a pity that this ultra-zionist Shai (13) tries to use this unfortunate misprint (or lack of knowledge of the reporter) to make an argument justifying the robbers.
16. To 14 and 15
Shai ,   Israel   (11.28.05)
First, to 15. I'm proud to be a Zionist. I wear what you see as scornful as a trophy, and hope one day you'll rediscover your obligations as a daughter of our Jewish Nation, and recognize that even we Jews, too deserve to live though this inconveniences others, and that yes, Palestinians are not always the good guys. You assert that there was a misprint, but this is not necessarily so. Until Ynet admits this, then the facts under discussion are as they've been submitted, not as you imagine them to be. Contrary to your claim, Biliin is east of Modiin Ilite, and Modiin Ilite does not separate between Biliin and Modiin, since Modiin is to the south of Modiin Ilite, not to Modiin Ilite's west (Naalin is to Modiin Ilite's west). Kfar Rut, Lapid and Maccabim / Reut are between Biliin and Modiin, as a casual look at a map would reveal. It happens that there are many olive groves adjacent to Maccabim / Reut (neighborhoods in Modiin), and perhaps this article was about them, not about those near Modiin Ilite? Biilin, while closer to Modiin Ilite than Modiin, is not so far away from Modiin that that a farmer from Biliin could not be tending olives near Beit Sira, directly adjacent to Modiin, as these villages are as close together as the next hilltop and only 1 1/4 miles from Biliin. Would you, Zahava, automatically reason as you have for the residents of Biliin that your neighbors 1 1/4 miles away in Bnei Brak, Kfar Sirkin, Givat Hashlosha have no economic interests to pursue in Petach Tikva? Doubt it. Similarly, you shouldn't doubt that the article is correct until otherwise clarified. Next, as far as "argument justifying the robbers". I didn't justify stealing trees, if you'll read my first post. The owners of the trees, or of the rights to farm them for income, if they are the Arabs in this article, should be recompensed for them, as I said before, and I noted that this is what is usually what is done when sites are cleared for construction. Now for Zumbush. Are all Palestinian supporters as splenetic as you are? It seems to be a pattern amongst you. You enjoy the "patina" of righteousness without the burden of having to earn it, and from your high perch you cast your words like Thor's lightening against what you perceive to be we poor, uninformed, ignorant souls. The result is that you come off as intellectually uninquisitive and lazy. Maybe that's not deserved, but that's the impression you give. It's an impression that is only amplified by your tendency to avoid debate and rather depend on unsupported statements of "fact", and personal insults like "smartass", "assholes", "ignoramus" and "liar, or casting aspersions about their education. That'd be bad enough but you don't end there You show reveal laziness as well by your tendentious use of bumper sticker phrases like "occupied territory" and "apartheid fence", which really have earned the phrase you use "immaterial for the argument". Any real understanding of the situation is too nuanced for any person who really respects truth to use words like those. If, perhaps, you'd be able to cool down long enough to address the article as it was written, and the facts on the ground for what they are, rather than for what you NEED them to be, you could have actually contributed something to this talkback. Instead, you simply "spew". A good beginning, Zumbush, would be to start relating to things as they are rather than in "symbolisms". It happens that your admitted tendency toward symbolism has obscured more than it illuminates. So don't do it. Once you start telling the truth, I'll meet you on the other side.
17. Shai (16) is a pathological lier and an asshole
ZubZav   (11.28.05)
18. zionism= facistism
richard Hitchings ,   methil   (11.30.05)
Its all very well to be a zionist and proud , as were the Germans Facist and proud of their right wing ideoligy. The German (Nazi) zeal for Living space to the east, may well be compared to the zionist quest for the same. Zionism an expression of doing what God wanted, taking their God Given land,... Well the zionist must realise that not all agree with God is reported to have said Having God as a real estate agent is not exactly convincing stuff. As for the trees..... well what the zionist do now might well come back to haunt them at a later date Cut down the trees if you must but there will be a Bill to be paid..... Count on it.
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