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Orthodox riot; unhappy with neighbors
Efrat Weiss
Published: 16.01.06, 19:14
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27 Talkbacks for this article
1. Arrest them, penalise them & imprison them...
Meir Moses   (01.16.06)
2. Orthodox riot; unhappy with neighbors
Joseph ,   Brazil   (01.16.06)
Are these people above the law?
3. Fighting Spirit
Bill Pearlman ,   Chicago, USA   (01.16.06)
Obviously these guys are itching to get into combat, I'm sure the IDF can find a place to put all this rage and hostility to good use
4. Orthodox riot
(01.16.06)
Certain communities do have standards that they want everyone to keep, but they usually make it known to the people before they move in, not after. If things are really important, they'd make regulations for their community and vote on them, not have some kind of vigalante system. One more thing, people need more than to be just religiously observant, they also need to have their heart in the right place.
5. Traditional Ultra intolerance !
hiram ,   tel aviv   (01.16.06)
Great stuff ....do we see this happen in other countries ? Not religious enough ??? who says so ! Are Ultra Orthodoxes getting worse than some other faith ? This is what you get when tolerating "priviledges" in a so called " democratic country ".. But after all what differentiate them from Talibans ? Shame !!!
6. respect is a two-way street
Nat ,   Montreal, Canada   (01.16.06)
Respect is a two-way street. Are the new residents provoking their neighbours with inappropriate behaviour? When you move into a comnunity you are expected to respect its minimal standards of behaviour. The article doesn't answer that question. Normally, one would think that the proper orthodox response would be to befriend their new neighbours, not riot.
7. this is not a riot
george ,   us   (01.16.06)
tis is not a riot sorry this is wild youth getting out of hand, but nice try
8. Incitement
Kyle ,   Southpark, CO, USA   (01.16.06)
It is not "ultra-Orthodox" or "extremist settlers" it is only disaffected youths. If they had more opportunities and didn't face societal discrimination they wouldn't be frustrated and lash out against their oppressors.
9. Jewish Wahabbists
Raymond from DC ,   Washington, DC USA   (01.17.06)
Just as Abd al-Wahhab in the 18th century set Islam onto its current destructive path, we're seeing here the modern evolution of the Da'as Torah ideology with its roots in the 18th century reaction against modernity. I see here frightening echos of the Saudi bands roaming the streets "promoting virtue and suppressing vice" in the name of their perverse sense of Islam. If you think I exaggerate, consider the increasingly oppressive atmosphere at the Western Wall plaza. Or check out the strictures imposed by the ultras at the tomb of Maimonides in Tiberias. I lived in Israel in the 70s, revisiting in the 80s and last summer, so I've seen things change, not all for the better. A growing, increasingly "triumphalist" ultra community will only put increasing strains on Israeli society. I'd suggest these folks reread Maimonides to understand his concept of the "middle way" - a classic argument against this kind of extremism. By the way, no nation in the Diaspora would consider calls for the kind of accommodations in public conveniences we're seeing here. If the buses aren't "modest" enough for them, they can setup their own bus services on their own dime.
10. bad news article; counterproductive responses
sk ,   USA   (01.17.06)
Did Weiss actually interview anyone for this story? There is no detailed information here at all. I'm not ultra-Orthodox (I'm atheist, in fact), but I wonder if anyone here realizes that it is precisely the anti-religious fanaticism of the government that facilitates the power of the Haredi establishment and thus religious coercion. Think about how many believers who are not U-O end up voting for religious parties because of the anti-religious qualities of the other parties! Thus the irony that the anti-religious manage to destroy the religious Zionists (including "settlers") who are noncoercive only to strengthen the Haredim.
11. YOUR ALL WRONG
DACON9 ,   TRUST ME   (01.17.06)
KNOW THE WRITER....... THEN YOU WILL KNOW HOW CREDIBLE IS HIS STORY.... FIRST ***BRAVO FOR THOSE ''EXTREMIST'' THAT WANT TO MAINTAIN A STANDARD AND DO NOT ASSIMILATE OR BECOME POLITICALLY CORRECT OR KIND TO THE EVIL .BRAVO BRAVO BRAVO. AND REALIZE THAT THESE WRITERS ARE EXTREMISTS IN THEIR SOCIALIST VIEWS. LISTEN HERE PEOPLE... I AM THE ONLY ONE YOU CAN TRUST BELIEVE ME ONLY ME.
12. A picture is not worth a thousand words
Menachem Petrushka ,   New York USA   (01.17.06)
If there were hundreds of "Ultra-Orthodox" rioting in Beit Shemesh today , why did Ynetnews have to run a picture of a demonstration in Jerusalem that took place years ago against the BAGATZ. Today everybody has videos, cell phone digital cameras and the like. if any thing breaks out, hundreds of photos are immediateley sent in to the news agencies. Someting is fishy here.
13. #6 - No
Howard ,   Pacific Coast, USA   (01.17.06)
When you move to a community, you are expected to obey the law. If you violate the law, the police have the monopoly on the use of force. They either arrest you, or ticket you and you must pay a fine. If the citizens want modesty laws, they pass them (if these don't contradict national law). Rioting is completely unacceptable. And in this case, the UO community decided to intimidate other people into line with their own cultural views. They do this with driving on Shabbos too. It is simply religious intolerance and bigotry; non UO Jews have a right to live in Jerusalem too. If they want a city dress code, they must PASS ONE DEMOCRATICALLY -- NOT t try to enforce it through mob rule like a bunch of Hamas thugs.
14. Joseph,Brazil
David,Sweden   (01.17.06)
No my friend- these people are above everything worldly. Apparently above being normally tolerant towards oneĀ“s neighbours too. Too sad not everyone is the same, what a great place world would be (hahaha)
15. To Raymonf from DC #9
hiram ,   tel aviv   (01.17.06)
Right on the dot ray, this is exactly what is taking place. hence the need for secularization of the country so that Jewishabites do not take over in a Mollahlike fashion ! same causes = same results
16. #2 - In Israel, they are.
Dorothy Friend ,   Tel Aviv   (01.17.06)
Unfortunately, always have been, and always will be. Original mistake made in '48.
17. I'm religious from Beit Shemesh
Meir ,   Beit Shmesh   (01.17.06)
I just want to say, that I as a religious (knitted kippa) resident of Ramat Beit Shemesh utterly and totally condemn the actions of these fanatics, who should have been transferred to Gush Katif when we left there. They give our neighbourhood a bad name, and represent no one but themselves. They cause a Chillul Hashem
18. so ... what's new?
(01.17.06)
19. the family has lived there for 6 years and is orthodox
howard ,   pacific coast, usa   (01.17.06)
The haredi rioters are upset, apparently, that the sons are modern orthodox and not haredi orthodox, and wear modern clothes. Or is it because someone covets their house? Hmmm?
20. #19
Dorothy Friend ,   Tel Aviv   (01.17.06)
Not fundamentalist enough for them? That's worse than being secular!
21. "quality aliya" time to reevaluate
Marvin   (01.17.06)
Israelis are used to mthink that North American Aliya is quality aliya . Not always so it seems , we are getting the last few years uneducated bigots and misfits .
22. #21 - Last few years?
Dorothy Friend ,   Tel Aviv   (01.17.06)
Longer than that.
23. Chilul hashem by the ultra Orthodox
chana ,   Modiin   (01.17.06)
When the ultra Orthodox wonder why they are so vilified by their fellow Jews, do they not realize that they have only themselves to blame? Today I'm ashamed to be a Jew.
24. Dorothy & Hiram: PAY ATTENTION
sk ,   USA   (01.17.06)
You guys just don't get it. There is no way to "secularize" Israel. There will always be enough fully observant Jews to prevent this. In fact, overwhelmingly, Jews (in the broadest sense of the term) consider themselves Jews first, not Israelis first. At least since Oslo, the anti-Jewish sympathies of the main parties has bolstered the strength of religious parties. The only way the main parties can form coalitions now is with the Haredi parties. A proud (and functional) Israeli government could easily live with the Judaism of Judea and Samaria villagers. The problems arise when you destroy this way of living a Jewish life. Post-Zionism ADVANCES religious coercion. Learn it already.
25. CHANA, MODIIN
DACON9 ,   ONE TRUTH = HISTORY   (01.17.06)
YOU ARE GROSSLY MISINFORMED ABOUT THE MEANING OF HILUL HASHEM. YOU USE WORDS WITH NO UNDERSTANDING OR EDUCATION. YOU SHOULD BE PRAISING THE TORAH OBSERVANT. YOU SHOULD BE STANDING WITH THEM DEMONSTRATING SCREAMING YELLING AND SHOUTING WITH ALL YOUR MIGHT FOR ISRAEL AND ALL ITS LANDS. YOU SHOULD BE CALLING THE PERVERSIONS THE HOMOSEXUALS THE PROSTITUTES THE SECULARIST THE REFORM THE CONSERVATIVE THAT ARE TEARING APART JUDAISM TORAH AND ISRAEL ...CHILUL HASHEM. STRAIGHTEN UP AN FLY RIGHT. YOU CANT FLY UNSIDE DOWN ALL YOUR LIFE. YOU HAD IT YOUR WAY AND LOOK WHAT IS LEFT.. YOU HAVE TO DEFEND THE KOTEL AS JEWISH, YOU HAVE TO DEFEND HEBRON THAT ABRAHAM OVERPAID FOR. YOU HAVE TO DEFEND YOUR OWN EXISTENCE,,ITS YOUR FAULT.. BRAVO FOR THE OBSERVANT BRAVO FOR THE YOUTH STANDING UP TO THE POLICITIANS BRAVO .ISRAEL IS GOING THROUGH A RE-GROUPING THE SOCIALIST HAVE DESTROYED ALL THROUGH HISTORY. BRAVO FOR THE RELIGIOUS. LIGHT THE PATH BLACK HATS, I WILL FOLLOW YOU BUT THEN AGAIN.. MANY DO
26. DACON9 - Shut your mouth
Chaya ,   Bat Yam   (06.19.06)
This is not the way for Jews to behave. They are behaving like the Taliban. One cannot be forced to be religious. If they don't like the neighbors, just have nothing to do with them. But violence against them??? This is SO unJewish. And it causes people to be turned off to religion. There is absolutely nothing you could say to make me think differently.
27. Got out; stayed sane
Untitled ,   UK   (06.22.06)
I'm thoroughly disgusted wtih the actions of the people who perpetrate such actions in the name of God and religion. I once lived in Ramat Bet Shemesh and my husband and I were not 'on the level' and were often excluded and looked down upon. We left for personal reasons other than the lack of Ahavat Chinam, but I'm extremely grateful we left when we did. Sadly, I'm not shocked at this behaviour. I've grown to expect it. We must have our forefathers turning in their graves at this point! The Bet Hamikdash was destroyed because of Sinat Chinam. Must we continue this vicious cycle? LOVE, my brethren, acceptance. Helping one another. These are things we should be striving for, NOT fighting one another and treating our fellow man like rubbish. Being orthodox members of our Jewish Community does not give you right or reason to put others down and treat them with such disrespect. You want resepect? EARN IT. Just because we don't all ascribe to the same views and ideas doesn't make us lesser men or women than you! Learn to give and forgive and try to reach us through love, friendship and understanding. God help you all, you sad, pathetic people. Riots and attacks are things we expect from our ENEMIES. Not our family, friends, neighbours and fellow Jews. I AM ASHAMED TO CALL MYSELF A JEW when that goes hand in hand with assault and insult to other Jews. I hope you all think long and hard, especially now with the three weeks and nine days coming up, followed closely by Rosh Hashana and Yom Kippur. Think long and hard about what is right and wrong and how much begging and pleading you would do well to get on with with the upcoming Yom HaDin. Yevarechecha Hashem V'Yishmerecha. Ya'er Panav Eilecha...V'yasim L'cha Shalom.
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