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Soldier's dismissal slammed
Efrat Weiss
Published: 05.05.06, 17:04
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1. JEWISH PATRIOTS ARE HATED & PUNISHED
Linda Rivera ,   New York   (05.05.06)
Before the ethnic Jew cleansing, Islamo-Fascist religious supremacists rained down thousands of rockets and mortars on Gaza's Jewish communities. Most of the deported Jewish refugees from Gaza have been unable to get jobs. Many live in poverty in tents. The impoverished refugees are financially obligated to pay the mortgages on their homes that Israel destroyed. The Gaza surrender created Hamastan - a global base for terrorists. Jewish communities bordering Gaza, inside the green line, who thought they were secure, now live under the stress of a daily barrage of rockets from the ethnically Jew cleansed areas of Gaza. Ashkelon's power plant and chemical storage tanks are now vulnerable to Kassam rocket attacks, which if hit, could result in major damage to infrastructure and a large loss of human lives. Israel's leaders reveal their satisfaction with the results of the surrender to religious supremacists by declaring that Judea and Samaria is next. The surrender to the terrorists will place Jerusalem, Tel Aviv and Israel's international airport within rocket firing range. Besides Israeli leaders' immorality of aiding and abetting Islamic terrorism and advancing global jihad, is this Israel's way of telling the world they don't want tourists?
2. The law reads:
Ben Avraham ,   Tel Aviv   (05.05.06)
A soldier, by law, must salute a superior officer, but has no obligation to shake his hand. Only a fascist understanding of the procedure can rule otherwise. Perhaps Halutz is just that.
3. Skip the "High Court"
sk ,   USA   (05.05.06)
It has no legitimacy anyway.
4. dismissal
Raymond ,   South Africa   (05.05.06)
So the Israeli leadership has lost its zionism & dismisses those who publicly & openly take a stance contorary to its each own & this is called democracy.This Government is a traitor government not only to true ideals of zionism & Jewish rights, but also to G-D.Its only master is is money & U.S.A. Wonders if y-net will publish this, hmmmmmm. True Israel will still rise & Amelek wil fall.AM YISRAEL CHAI
5. Shooting Themselves In The Foot
Adina Kutnicki ,   US   (05.05.06)
The IDF High Command deserves a black eye on this one. What kind of 'democratic' regime would ever countenance a dismissal/military tribunal for a soldier for NOT shaking hands with the Chief? This type of dangerous despotic activity is what happens in North Korea and all the other cesspools. If someone does not bow, scrape or shake hands in these countries then.... How is it possible that a soldier being honored for excellence is then vilified for 'non-hand shaking'?Where is the freedom of expression? The lunatics are running the asylum and the people who will suffer will be the good citizens of Israel. Why? Because the best and the bravest will join their secular leftist brethern and avoid service much like Olmert's draft doging son et al!
6. Pathetic.
Drew ,   soon in Israel   (05.05.06)
I'm going for my army service in November, and if Halutz came to me I would also not shake his hand, no matter what. kind of makes me double think as to whether or not I want to serve a country that won't respect my thoughts....
7. # 2
yakov shani ,   afula   (05.05.06)
I suggest you look up the word Fascist before using it and apart from that I do not know who you are but I do know that you are here because of soldiers like Halutz and many many more of my friends for whom I have dug holes in the ground for.You are obviously ungrateful for this. Shame on you.
8. # 3
yakov shani ,   afula   (05.05.06)
You say High Court irrelevant. A soldier derides and offends The President and Chief of Staff. The ultra orthodox resort to unmittigated violence any time they feel like it. Drivers overtake in the wrong lane and on the hard shoulder.In general people stick their fingers at the law. ANARCHY HERE i COME !!!
9. General Hananel Dayan ... we salute YOU!
Theo ,   Bat Yam   (05.05.06)
... and would love to KISS your hand.
10. I don't get it...
Michael Steiner   (05.05.06)
When a left-wing soldier refuses to obey orders out of political considerations (e.g. serve in the sh'takhim), they are decried as traitors, self-hating/loathing Jews, Arab-lovers, blah blah blah. When a right-wing soldier refuses to obey orders out of political considerations (e.g. carry out evacuation orders), they are lauded as the last Macabee, true Zionist and all the rest of the nonsense. And the same now. This soldier disrespected his superior officer. Regardless of his political beliefs, the Army is the Army, with a hierarchy that MUST be obeyed at all times (save for unconscionable orders, per international law). If every soldier started showing contempts for people he or she disagreed with for any reasons, the whole organization would fall apart in no time.
11. Soldier's Dismissal slammed
sl ,   New york, new york   (05.05.06)
Dayan, you were right. I support your actions 100%.
12. Soldier's dismissal slammed
zf ,   new york, new york   (05.05.06)
Halutz: you should be insulted by Dayan
13. He has a right to do so
Nadav ,   Misgav   (05.05.06)
You may call me lefist, that is all right. However this soldier has been serving his country to a degree that brought him to this occassion. All he did was to refuse a handshake in order to show protest. This is simply his democratic right. Steiner, do you get the difference?
14. You get more flies with honey than with vinegar
David ,   New York   (05.05.06)
The perpetrators of the cultural war against the national religious community are soooo stupid.
15. #7 & #10
Bush ,   USA   (05.05.06)
An army that turns its back on its citizens is not an army. When dayan went to the army he was going on condition to defend the Israelis and the land. That was once the israeli army. but when dayan goes home and sees his unhappy family living unsettled in trailors or whatever, when he hears his grandfather die after the expulsion and knows it wasn't in the most peaceful stage of life whats one to do. you are right that its the army. but if the army would have said to destroy peoples lives in tel aviv physically financially however just do it because its the army, is it wrong for one to rebel. the truth is the army did make a mistake with gaza and if youre to blind to see ashkelon in danger of destruction or hamas in power then so be it but others see the mistake in their own backyard. Even America egypt and jordan feel bad hamas is in power and there should be no more expulsions just israelis are to stubborn to admit their mistakes.
16. herr steiner
dana ,   us   (05.05.06)
The obvious answer to your question is thatJewish commitment, religiousity and zionism are largely on the right. In the past there was a Zionist left, which has largely died off with progeny that has minimal Jewish commitment and few Jewish kids. Today, the people that practice Judaism 365 days a year, have Jewish children and grandkids(in greater than replacement levels), make aliya and not yerida,build new settlements(where is degania gimel?), march in Israeli rallies, visit Israel and send their kids to yeshiva are on the right. Unfortuneately Herr Steiner the JINO's you like are intermarring and yordiming themselves out of existance.
17. TO YAKOV SHANI AND MICHAEL STEINER:
SETTHERECORDSTRAIGHT   (05.05.06)
Yakov: Anyone who uses the term 'ultra-Orthodox', reveals their utter comtempt for the religious. It's just Jewish people following their religion the way it's supposed to be followed - nothing 'ultra' or 'Orthodox' about it. Michael: Dayan didn't disobey orders, he refused to shake Halutz's hand, hardly a required duty.
18. let me talk to you as it we were,....
Yoel Ariel ,   US   (05.05.06)
Geeeez, Mike, Let me talk to you as if we were not conversing by 'puter, but as if we were sitting accross from each other having a drink. The kid, Dayan, is a top soldier. His political/social views are not yours, but he is an honorable fighter and obviously (because he was a selectee. One of 100. a prize winner) a fine example of a soldier, and an excellent representative of the IDF. He performed(according to what I have read from open sources)all of his assigned duties and followed all legal orders, without fail) He performed the required salute toward his commanders and towards the Chief of Staff Halutz. What Dyan failed to do was shake halutz's hand. Listen carefully here. because this is important, there is no regulation in any army that I ever heard of, anywhere that requires any soldier, sailor or airman (I have not forgotten the Marines) to shake the hand of any superior officer or non comissioned officer. anywhere. If anyone eavesdropping on out tete a tete and knows of any military organization anywhere that requires a handshake, I will happily stand corrected. The ONLY required sign of respect in the presence of a superior officer is: A-a Slaute B-Standing at attention unless allowed to assume a secondary stance. Disagreeing with a commander when not under fire or in a hostile situation is not only a military tradition of the IDF, but an obligation. Any soldier has the right to disagree. NOT to disobey a lawful order. That was not the case at hand. The retribution against the young soldier is petty and beneath contempt. Over to you.
19. This is for you Steiner
Caligula's Horse ,   Solomon's Stables   (05.05.06)
Saluting a higher ranked officer is in the law, shaking a hand is not an order and refusing to shake an officer's hand does not equal disobeying orders. Anyways the punishment is clearly out of proportion, but I guess thats what happens when politics get hold of the army (Sharon replaced Yaalon with Halutz so he could go through the withdrawal from Gaza more easly).
20. rightists criticize decision to punish?
Betsy   (05.05.06)
interesting. somewhere between 1970 and today, right and left appear to have switched places.
21. to Drew
John ,   Jerusalem   (05.05.06)
While in uniform and in the Army, you have a responsibility to serve your country, follow all lawful orders, and respect your superiors in the chain of command. If you want to be part of a political protest, in your spare time and out of uniform, then that's your right within a democratic society. However, disrespect of a senior officer based on political or religious grounds has no place within the service.
22. Soldier's dismissal slammed
WAV ,   Chicago   (05.05.06)
IDF Chief of Staff Dan Halutz is behaving like a child. He is reacting emotionally to an already emotionally charged issue and he is doing this great soldier and the IDF a disservice. His ego was wounded and nothing more. But it's a small man who will react like this. He pulled rank. Shame on him. How infantile can one person be? Halutz is a good example.
23. #10
Betsy   (05.05.06)
how do you know it was a show of contempt? the soldier in question said it was because his emotions were too intense. shaking hands, with the man who evictied the soldier's family from their home of three generations,, might have made the emotions unendureable, or might have destroyed the soldier's composure. maybe that would have spoken more eloquently and would have been better. his "crime" was in not bowing to the image of cheif of staff. the cheif's ego was involved here.. so now he's weilding his power. ..if the cheif could've been a human being--he'd be less than cheif of staff, and much more at the same time. he might have responded with understanding and downplayed the incident as a decent human being should have done.
24. To Olmert: Keep splitting the country apart
(05.05.06)
Man he must be possessed or something because this will lead to civil warl, you are splitting the entire country apart. IS THIS WHAT WE WAITIED 2000 YEARS FOR?!!!
25. As you were!
Yoel Ariel ,   US   (05.05.06)
John#21 Wrong. Item#1- No one claims that young Dayan did not serve his nation and military formation faithfully and well. Otherwise he would not have been subject to the prize for being one of the top 100, would he? Item#2: While in uniform in military service you have a responsibility to follow all lawful orders. Respect is formalized because every nation realizes that it is not possible to respect all officers. The required respect is manifested in the salute, which is a sign of respect for the rank, NOT the man holding/wearing it. No military organization can enforce what is not possible to be given. Protest of political disagreements are possible AFTER a lawful order is followed fully & appropriately. Refusal to shake the hand of any member of the service, and a superior officer is not only NOT demanded as a sign of respect but should be eschewed by any military formation, anywhere. I again asseret that there is NO military formation of any nation that currently requires or demands such an unenforcible sign of respect. Personal signs of respect (for the specific man) when saluting a superior officer is given by a small smile and a verbal "Sir" during the hand salute (different) or presentation of arms(different) or the standard salute. Protests out of uniform are a different bucket of fishies, and are not suitable to this particular conversation. Dayan-1, Halutz=0, IDF=0- The writer is a retired Senior Law Enforcement Offical who spent ten + years on active military duty before entering law enforcement.
26. Soldier
Shaka ,   New York, USA   (05.05.06)
While in Uniform the soldier must not be a politician. He could protest all he wants when not in military uniform. However, once he was honored as a soldier representing the military he should not have undermined his superior in public. This undermines the State and must be detterred so as not to errode the entire State. Therefore he should be punished. They should take away the honor they bestowed on him because he did not act like a good soldier.
27. #21 Drew, you're not required to respect officers who issue
AK   (05.05.06)
illegal orders. There is no whitewashing what happened in Amona and the behavior of Sharon/Olmert regime with regard to Gaza expulsion was far from legal, even if given Israeli Supreme Court 's imprimatur.
28. #22 I am not surprised.
AK   (05.05.06)
He is the man who ordered the smashing of the sculls of the Israeli children at Amona.
29. Dayan
Brod ,   Marshall, USA   (05.05.06)
Is Hananel Dayan a grandson or great grandson of famous Israeli General Moshe Dayan?
30. 24, try again pal
Israeli ,   IL   (05.05.06)
you fascists have to stop threatening civil war (especially you wannabe cowboys from the US) because YOU'LL GET IT. And if you get it, you'll see again (last elections shoulda showed you) how puny, pathetic a minority you are. You're the ones splitting the country and people by stubbornly refusing to respect the will of the majority. Take a hike.
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