Very few Jews make use of these archaic ritual baths nowadays. The few who want them should pay for their own. However, since in Israel it appears that the State contributes financially, it is absolutely bonkers to restrict entry to religious extremists.

Reforms "marry" same sex couples Reforms "convert" people whithout any comitment to 613 mitzvoths Reforms use electricity, cars etc on Shabat Reforms do not bother about kashrut in short they interpret judaism whithout the need of its traditions and rituals. WHY ON EARTH DO THEY NEED A MIKVAH FOR????? seriously Let them need first a wife for husband, and not another husband for the man Let them need first some kosher diet Let them need first to honour shabbat Why would they single out this one rite as necessary when to top it all the prospective "convert" wont need to eat kosher, wont need to respect shabat , may end up marrying same sex???? I'm puzzled at their own reasoning. They probably reason that this is the only way mainstreem judaism will accept their converts, by inmersing in a proper kosher mikvah. What they unfortunaly do not take into account is that the prospective convert needs to immerse her/himself into 613 mitzvots PRIOR and sin equanom waters per se just dont work any "magic" This is NOT an issue of Religious against Reform, I'm not interested in cliche words as "discrimination" This is plain NONSENSE May G-d illuminate their ways

First do not post opinions on jewish rituals Second- explain why are they "archaic" ? Important question I'm asking you Third: if you knew about this issue one ounce you'll see people in Israel using them by the tens of thousands. An indication to this is that there dozens of them in every city and afew in most villages. I'm not making up numbers just check for lists. This is because, specially in Israel this is a well kept tradition in which (according to a poll I've read some 5 yars ago 55%-63% of the people who should be using them, DO so.

No equalty in Judaism. Christians can't use mikvehs, Arabs can't use mikvehs, Budduists can't use mikvehs--it's terrible!

Conversions performed by anyone other than an Orthodox Beis Din are invalid according to Jewish Law and not recognized by Torah-observant Jewry. Potential converts should be aware that the Halacha has strict requirements for the conversion process which are not met by the Reform and Conservative movements. If you are sincere about joining the Jewish people and being apart of our history, culture and mission, you must convert only through the Orthodox rabbinate. You and your children (if you are a woman) will not be considered Jews and you and they will be unable to marry a Jew according to the laws of Moses and Israel. Moreover, despite any information regarding the authenticity of a non-Orthodox conversion that you may have received from Conservative or Reform rabbis or other sources, such "conversions" are not only not authentic but, rather, they are down-right fraudulent.

The Shabbat “optional” or just a “tradition”? Homosexuality just an G-d’s “opinion” but not to be taken seriously eh? Braking about almost every law in the Torah but fighting the OBSERVING Jews with “everything under the sun” to “just” to make a “point” i.e. mockery out of Yiddishkeit? Seduces and Christianity started like that so what reform and others discovered that is “new”, rabid contempt on a fellow Jew for being observant? Really there is nothing new there for 2000 years Jews were burned at stake for being just a bit “extreme” for not accepting Jibas “moderate ways” i.e. “enlightenment”. If you have the law of the country i.e. you follow all the laws in the book you are law abiding citizen… as OPPOSED of CRIMINAL who follows 99.99% of laws but i.e. he does not believe that drinking and driving has anything to do with “real” laws in his “manual” of life? People who chose to follow the different “rules” within society are justifying it with creations of many different sub-groups like Cosa Nostra, Mafia, Hells Angels, etc. they are a the groups which don’t take law to such a extreme, they are kind of moderate eh? They know which laws to take and which laws are “ridiculous” of course? Something like Shabbat, Sodomy, etc. The only problem those “creative” forces in EVERY society encounter is REALITY CHECK. Laws religious or otherwise are not “just a tradition” they are the laws that should be followed as long you ascribe yourselves to belong to that society, your adherence to those values makes you VALUABLE – CONTRIBUTING member of that society, breaking the laws of your society are not acts of your “creativity” they are the acts of belligerence and challenge to that society like any other enemy that this society is facing. It is interesting dough that everyone wanted to burn the Jews only on account of their “moderate” digressions from those “extreme” Jews, i.e. Catholic, Protestants, Orthodox as well Muslims. So those that want to make their names on account of persecution of those “extreme Jews” are not new discovery or a new “religion” they are just a “usual moderates” we experienced for the last 2,000 years or so.. I am just curious dough if they are so desperate do “baptize” their flock, why not going to Vatican? Jeddah? Those guys already went over those issues with those “stubborn” Jews for so long .. they can tell you they did not budge a bit, I pretty sure they will offer you their “mikveh”, “cookies”… a whole NEW works with the NEW laws that will hold Jewish values with the similar contempt as you do? Ignorance of the JEWISH VALUES is THE ultimate challenge to the existence of the JEWISH SOCIETY. Ah thanks G-d for those “stiff-necked” Jews.. ? Who else would keep every letter of THE LAW so ALIVE and so REAL!

WHAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTTTTT does a muslim or christian need the mikveh FFFFFFFFFFOOOOORRRRRRR????

... and used by three different population : 1- Once : by people becoming Jews 2- Monthly : by married women respecting family purity (Taharat Mishpaha) 3- Weekly : by men (mainly 'hassidic) purifying before Shabat 1- "progressive" conversions are not done according to halakha so these converts are not Jews and cannot use a Mikve 2- "progressive" women don't respect family purity 3- "progressive" men even don't know what a Mikve is "Progressive" Jews don't need Mikve because they don't use it. In all America, which is the geographic basis of "progressive" judaism, there is No mikve built by them. So why do they need them in Israel ? Because in Israel, the "progressive" Jews want to fight the legitimate Judaism in order to secure government funds. This Mikve scheme is just a tool for them to try once again to destroy Torah Observant Judaism. "laMalshinim vélaMinim al tehi tikvah..."

B"H This sounds like there is a huge discrimination problem. But what it amounts to is the reform want access to pools of water here and are upset that Orthodox Jews regulate who can go in and who cannot. For a mikveh to be constructed, a bore hole is dug in the earth, and concrete is then poured, very similarly to a swimming pool. Then the rain water falls in for a fresh water mikveh. Then the water can be heated for someone to use to immerse. This is a mikveh. The reform are able to construct mikvehs just like anyone is able to construct a swimming pool in his or her back yard. And like with a swimming pool, a life guard attendent needs to be present to make sure the immersion is being done properly so that the person immersing does not die. At sea or in a swimming pool, it is the same issue. If any reform Rabbi wants some help to build a Mikeveh, he can contact me. He just posts his email address here on ynet, and we can go from there if there is a geniuine issue and not just a bunch of whining here. I think that it makes sense for Orthodox to have seprate mikvot. The Orthodox want to make sure that venerial disease and so forth is not introduced into the water that would compromise the entire cømmunity as well as to make sure that the immersion is supervised properly so that there are no potential drownings, like in the sea visitor case. The reform need to be resposibile for their congregation on this, just like any other branch of judiasm, as well as bear the liability if this is not done correctly, as in the case of someone almost drowning without proper supervision. Just for the record, another way to construct a Mikveh would be to pitch a tent in the shallow ocean water for privacy. So this is not a hugely expensive endevour for anyone located near an ocean or lake.

Without an Orthodox-bashing article on YNet.

I bet a man invented the Mikveh. It's their fantasy, a naked women being washed by another one. They are gross and dirty and outdated and should be done away with. Anyone wanting to use one should go dip their head in the Med instead.

What the hell do you know about the use of mikvahs in Israel when you live in London.

I'm getting sick of the daily attacks on Orthodox and Charedim. Give it a rest!

Are you Hashem? Does He speak directly to you and tell you what He wants. No, I didn't think so, so why don't you stop speaking for Him. Reform converts have a more Jewish heart/attitude then you could ever hope to have. As they embrace Judaism they deserve the same rights as any other ger to go through the conversion process properly and immerse themselves in the mikveh. And for the record, I know MANY kosher reform Jews who DO NOT Drive on Shabbat. Are you really in any position to cast judgement on others?

Once again, where do these people get the right to judge. Judaism has evolved with the times and that is what caused it to survive.

reform or conservative - does not matter, we are all Jews and deserve equal treatment by all. This IS discrimination, plain and simple. the orthadox do not follow all of the 613 mitzvot - as this is impossible in 2006. Please do not judge others' commitment to the state of Israel or to Judaism based on some imagined "we're better because" rules.

I made a solemn promise to a certain poster( he is on this page ), not to be abusive to Haredim in my posts. I shall keep that promise. I wish to point out to you, in the most polite fashion that I know, when the Haredi community in Israel force me, a secular Israeli, to adhere to customs that I do not agree with and to submit myself to restrictions on my liberty, either by demanding the passing of laws or by coercion, I view this as an "attack" on myself and others of my disposition. to paraphrase you Kyle, no day complete without restricting my liberties.

Why does a reform or conservative Jew need a Mikvah? Let them just rewrite the halakha as they have done for everything else. Here is one suggestion, instead of immersing themselves in a Mikvah of water, they can meditate in a room full of buddha idols. The Reform & Conservative have changed every single halakha (law). They effectively are created a new religion and if they continue down this dangerous path, we may G-d forbid loose more Jewish souls. Most Israeli’s including the nonreligious laugh at the reform & conservative Jews. The nonreligious Israeli realizes that they may not follow many halakhot but know that G-d's intension was not to have man change 2000 years of tradition. In order to avoid splitting the Jewish religion certain things need to be preserved as STATUS QUO, including Orthodox conversions. Most of the Ynet English readers from Israel are Anglos, I am not. My family made Aliyah in the early 1800's before the state of Israel. I guess that makes me a Jewish Palestinian. We didn't ask for the creation of the State of Israel. In fact our Rabbis were against it mainly for fear of creating secular laws and courts that conflict with the Torah. Ben Gurion decided to create the "status quo" with regard to religious orthodox jurisdiction for the sake of unity and support of the Orthodox Jews in Israel. We eventually supported the creation of the State of Israel because of the "status quo". Without our support and unity the UN would have not voted in favorite of creating a state of Israel.

B"H What you say is not true. Anyone immersing in a fresh-water lake immerses in a Mikveh. This is regardless of religion. People from many cultures imerse in water like this. The huge problem with "discrimination" is quite a bit different than what you are positioning. Next is the discrimininatory attitute of lifeguards who will not anyone else sit on their chair except those who are hired by the owner of the swimming pool. What you are neglecting is the issue of public safety here and the responsibility of religious leaders to enforce that safety for the sake of the public involved. That means that the reform should make, maintain, and verify the safety of any lake or private swimming pool or mikveh that they own, and I think is very reasonable. Similarly with any other religious organization and associated ritual. In the United States, no one would even raise a stink about this because it is obvious here that reform congregations are responsible for their property and for their rituals, and that anyone can visit a lake with proper supervision after paying the national park fees. However, actions that endanger public morality or safety are not permitted even here.

Your are so filled with disrespect for jews that you speak nonsence, as most times, I should add. You've never ever been to a mikveh, but ever always talk without knowing a thing. Women do not enter together to a mikveh. It is only CONVENIENT that another one slightly overlooks from atop in case the one inmersing is not 100% sure the waters cover everything, including every hair. PERIOD. Also interesting, is that you report on their filthyness - Have you ever been to one??? I bet it's just your animalistic instinct to hate jews that makes you write this. Because of the so many I've been to: NONE was dirty And to complete your input you think you only need to dip your head. GET A LIFE and let G-d guide you

only in third world countries would such an article be published in a leading newspaper, leading to such hyperactive comment in the talkback

Shira!!! This is not Canada or the US. This is Israel, the mostly holiest place on Earth. It's funny the Reform and Conservative have at one time removed the mentioning of Israel from their Prayer books, I don't know if it was recently put back. The point is to them Canada, US, England, Israel or all the same countries with Jews living in them. Shira, what is a Jewish heart/attitude with out "the soul", "the Torah". Seriously what is a Jewish heart/attitude? Is Jewish heart some one that eats giffilte fish, or maybe has some Matzo once a year, or maybe plays some organ music in their synagogues? Or maybe knows someone who was in the Holocaust. I know it is not the Torah, what could it be please enlighten me? What laws does a reform Jew have regarding Shabbat? Is riding a car on Shabbat permissible and if it is why it would matter if you know a reform Jew who doesn't ride on Shabbat?

and still using notions of ritual purity coming form the antiquity! as if water could do more than washing the skin...

Shani, in what way does "mikvah" consist of an "attack" on your liberties? Nobody is forcing you or Mrs. Shani to go or not go, you are free to make that choice for yourself.

The mikves weren't built to hold parties in, Mr Mazor. Your contemptuous ceremonies are even less than that.

I'll tell you the truth, there are many secular laws forbidding you from damaging yourself. Drugs, suicide, speeding are all illegal despite weather or not you think in might be good for you, or infringing on your rights. It is the same with Judaism. Just because you choose to be ignorant of Jewish tradition and call your self a secular, does not mean that you are not doing great damage to your soul, and effecting everything around you. The real question is, is Judaism for real or not? 9 times out of 10 those who say it is not, have done no investigating into the matter (think about that). 9.9 times out of ten, those who have done real research have concluded that the God of Israel is as alive as when he took us out of Egypt. They know the damage that is done when any Jew doesn’t follow the Torah. Read your Bible where it says if the Jews want to live in peace in Israel and be saved from Hamas the must remain loyal to God. How far have we fallen!!!

YES you are reform, otherwise who other could you ask me, a person, if i'm G-d?? probably cristianity and your reform idea messed you up with such an idiotic a question YES Hashem speaks to me and to anyone that opens his ears and heart to listen. Too bad you don't believe this is a possibility. But I believe you, that cant get his message . HOW could you hear if you screen all "inconvenient halachot" that do not fit your own agenda. Who would like to speak to a "only what's easy for me" person like you. So don't answer what you asked ME in my place, you were wrong: He does speak and I do hear. And pretty well - toda l'E-L How can you state that reform converts have a more Jewish heart than I do?? YOU don't know ME , but already bash hatred and pure lashon hara. I haven't done that to you . YOU did. These converts are not even jews. So dont dare compare. I'm glad you know kosher reforms who do not drive on shabat, 'cause I never met any such individual. Never. Needless to say they use electricity which comes around as bad. Ovbiously these are only examples And to your last question : YES I'm in every position to pass judgement. The fact that reform converts are not jewish is very clear to me. If it is not to you PLEASE dont ask ME personally why. Since It is not personal, any halachic jew can do so, so suggest you read all previous talkbacs. They are wonderfully written, very comprehensive and variated, and I wouldnt be doing justice if wouldn't reccomend these wonderful pieces of Living Torah into your knowlege I wish you the best

All jews are intitled to use mikvaot, in that I agree with you for sure 100%. The problem is that not all reform people are even jews !!! GOT IT???? "Discrimination" is a stupid word, 'cause nobody discriminates as you see The correct world is "irrational", 'cause there nothing rational about having reform people adhere to this mitzvah when they even marry same sex, to give you an example. Read other talkbacks please. YOu'll get yor answers KOL TUV

http://www.iapp.org.il/