Opinion  Others
Morality requires: Hurt hostile population
Yisrael Rosen
Published: 22.06.06, 14:52
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77 Talkbacks for this article
1. I disagree
Michael ,   Tel Aviv   (06.22.06)
Children cannot be guilty in any way. Therefore they shouldn't be hurt. And to use 2000 year-old moral standards to justify todays actions seems a little bit backwardish. We live under different circumstances, we have other possibilities than people in the past. Are we not allowed to improve our moral standards? Sad, if not!
2. IDF'd job is to defend Israel, not Jihadists
yehuda ,   new york ny   (06.22.06)
Olmherts statement that the IDF is the "most moral army in the world" is just the OPPOSITE, they are the LEAST moral! A moral army's main job is self- defense. They have a right to draft, ask for volunteers, taxes etc, to defend their country, not some enemies country. It is immoral to risk the lives of Isreali soldiers, to save Hamas or Fatach supporters, who overwhelmingly support the terrorists! General Sherman, understood that cutting a 40 mile swath from Atlanta to Savannah, was necessary to free the slaves. The US had no problem with bombing Nazis supporters (called Germans after they lost) whether in Dresden, Frankfurt and Berlin. Any US General, who risked Americans to save Nazi civilians, would be immediatly removed! Ditto for Hiroshima and Nagasaki! If the IDF wishes to consider Jihad supporting Arabs, more important than soldiers, or Israeli citizens, time to restructor the whole Army. Get rid of Halutz and others who feel that their main job is to make soldiers shake their hands, and promote and train, those who get back to defending Israel. The only ones to blame for tje civilian deaths, were Hitler, Tojo Arafat, and other Jihadist. They wanted a war. That's why civilians are dying. If the Jihadist stopped trying to kill us, or lost civilian support, none of their civilians would die!
3. Morality-"Profs", "Authors"..
Dany ,   Canada   (06.22.06)
What do these "Educated" "High Brow" people have to do with our common, every day people? Just like there are lawyers, doctors, there are lawyers, doctors... In other words these "Smart" characters have NO KNOWLEDGE about OUR every day life, human behaviour, etc.; What do they know about living in Sederot, the Western Negev? They are a bunch of Rich, Hypocrites, who live of the land, far away, etc., who are better off keeping their mouth SHUT. If they are any good in their trades & we know quite few who aren't, let them stick to their trades !
4. y.rosen
av ,   london   (06.22.06)
Rabbi Y.Rosen is free from jewish complex of the diaspora .and he is one hundred % right.
5. Right of self defense
manuel   (06.22.06)
No right for self defense for an occupying power. Get out of WG & GAZA and let them live in thier own state and then you can speak about self defense. Today it is an army of occupation and domination versus armed resistance. And everybody know that
6. nonsense
mike ,   san diego   (06.22.06)
the article basically implies that Israel has a 'legal' right to retaliate against arab civilians (who may or may not be supporting the terror groups) this is nonsense. at what point will we be morally different that the enemy that we are fighting? I agree that Sderot must be defended 100%, but killing their civilians randomly is not only stupid, its ineffective as a ground defense strategy.
7. Great Article
Aida Strocovsky ,   Winnipeg, Canada   (06.22.06)
Finally someone making sense! Thank you
8. IDF SHOULD NOT BACK DOWN
haim ,   mtl canada   (06.22.06)
IDF MUST AND SHOULD PROTECT THE JEWS AT ANY PRICE NO MATTER WHT THE WORLD SAYS meaning coute que coute WE R NOT HERE TO CARE ABOUT HAMAS OR CIVILIANS ON THE OTHER SIDE THEY DID MAKE A CHOICE LET THEM LEAVE WITH IT I DONT CARE ABOUT DEAD PP IN GAZA I CARE ABOUT JEWS FIRST AND ITS TIME SOME IDF MEMBERS START TAKING DEFENSE MATTERS IN THEIR OWN HANDS AND LET COURT JUDGES DECIDE WHT STEPS SHOULD BE TAKEN WHEN KASSAMS LAND IS SDEROT EVERYDAY SUPPORT IDF PP THIS IS THE ONLY ARMY THT WILL DEFEND THE JEWS LETS NOT FORGET THT
9. I'm waiting for
(06.22.06)
all you self hating israelis/jews and your nonjewish likewise thinking mates, and your talkbacks. Ready steady go(don't come back ). Could be so beautiful here without disloyal traitors.Rabbi Rosen is the real thing, and they won't like it one little bit.
10. TO RABBIYISRAEL ROSEN --THANK YOU , THANK YOU !
AVINU   (06.22.06)
Thank you RABBI YISRAEL ROSEN ! PROUD , PROUD , PROUD of YOU ! THANK YOU !
11. Finally a sane voices!
Jew ,   Jerusalem   (06.22.06)
There will be always be Jews praying in Jerusalem and israel and putting tefillin, when all the SMART heads are already part of the dustbin of history. The people of Israel trust only HaShem and no one else.
12. #1
Eli   (06.22.06)
Depends if you believe that your morality is from G-d or people. Morality learned from G-d can not be improved on, and any impovement would be a subtraction. Morality from people is forever changing, and then yes, it could always use improvement to no end.
13. BINGO !
Reuven Brauner ,   Raanana, Israel   (06.22.06)
14. Quote from my favorite president
Ron ,   LA   (06.22.06)
Carry the battle to them. Don't let them bring it to you. Put them on the defensive and don't ever apologize for anything. Harry S. Truman
15. So true, it harts...
Ron ,   LA   (06.22.06)
Not only this is true, EVERY great general in history would sign his name under this article.
16. No such animal as "innocent PaLIEstinians"
Avraham ,   Netivot   (06.22.06)
Destroy all Gaza including all the PaLIEstinian terrorist residents. Leave nothing & nobody. The Rabbi is 100% correct.
17. if you want to believe the writter...
Ramzi Sfeir ,   Bethlehem, Palestine   (06.22.06)
If you want to believe the writter, then every death during war is normal , so people who died in bus attacks died in a war and people who are getting killed every day by the israeli army are dying in a war too so who cares....and not mentioning the jews who died in the Second world War, it was a war....and in wars, Civilians die! This ARGUMENT is not valid!and this shows the amount of culture this writter has! Killing during war or during peace times is PROHIBITED! no matter what happens! Every human being on this planet deserves the right to live and die naturally! As for the writter , i say that it goes both ways, If you really believe what you say, then stop criticizing suicide bombings since we are in a war.... I don't know why, but i believe that people on both sides are human beings and deserve peace security and a right to Live ! am i the exception of the rule ?
18. I'm sure any terrorist would agree with this
(06.22.06)
19. Great article Israel needs to wake up we are at WAR!
Take off the gloves ,   Israel   (06.22.06)
20. Rabbi Rosen For Defence Minister!
Yishai Kohen ,   YeShA, Israel   (06.22.06)
Within one week there would be peace. ONLY Jewish moral standards can bring peace.
21. #6 Facts, books, reason , not PC will set you free
Ron ,   LA   (06.22.06)
the article basically implies that Israel has a 'legal' right to retaliate against arab civilians (who may or may not be supporting the terror groups) this is nonsense. at what point will we be morally different that the enemy that we are fighting? I agree that Sderot must be defended 100%, but killing their civilians randomly is not only stupid, its ineffective as a ground defense strategy. >>> Yes, exactly. Read history books and see how wars were fought. Read at least one book on WWII. Of course if you read all the leftist " feel good" trash you believe this way. War is NOT about turning another chick. The problem is ignorance of masses of people like you. Pacifism is NOT a policy.Asl Truman. Remember the guy with twin babies over Japan? Read and learn.
22. #1 Learn from history, schwantz
Ron ,   LA   (06.22.06)
Thousands of years of wisdom is there, not your new age crap.
23. #12, #22
Michael ,   Tel Aviv   (06.22.06)
@ #12: Learning is not a once-and-for-all thing but a steady process. Even if I believed that we learn we morality from Him it would not change my opinion. He gave us free will and a heart to feel what is right and wrong; risking the lives of children is something I think is wrong. #22: Well said, Ron. You are the man! First, what history are you talking about? Second, offending others seems to me not very moral.
24. # 1
Bush ,   USA   (06.22.06)
Are we not allowed to improve our moral standards? The problem is Israels moral standards are not improving and is getting worst by the day. Everyday thousands more people are not JUSTIFYING your actions. if you can't change to what Maimonides or other wise Jews had to say and instead do what the Defense Minister or the PM who have said straight out there are no solutions is what I call stubborn, arrogant and SAD!!
25. to 21
haim ,   mtl canada   (06.22.06)
lets try it first then look at whts happening and maybe if they start using their heads will change our ways but for now we should bomb the hell out of them civilians or not how did we stop japan we dint care about civilians then so go read a bit more before trying to help the pals
26. to #21
mike ,   san diego   (06.22.06)
who said anything about pacifism? the writer is talking about firing shells into civilian areas. how does this make us different from what Hamas is doing? furthermore, how does this deter or protect Israel? this isnt about left or right, this is about having an effective and moral defense policy, and randomly shelling their civilians is neither effective, nor moral.
27. to #26
Jay ,   New YTork, USA   (06.22.06)
How does what the writer proposes make us different from what Hamas is doing? We don't intend to murder non-combatants; they do. Hamas and the other Palestinean terrorists aim to murder as many civilians as possible; in their ideology, to kill a Jew is worth killing oneself, and to murder a non-combatant Jew is particularly to be desired because of the terror it is intended to induce. In war you kill or disable the enemy before the enemy kills you. Shelling terrorists in the neighborhoods in which they hide and from which they launch their attacks on Sderot and the rest of Israel may result in civilian deaths and horrid maimings, but that's not the intent, but the unfortunate consequence of the war the Palestineans have chosen to fight. The intent matters.
28. #23 Start here
Ron ,   LA   (06.22.06)
Carry the battle to them. Don't let them bring it to you. Put them on the defensive and don't ever apologize for anything. Harry S. Truman After you study this great president go to study about great Russian general Kutuzov, who fought Napoleon. He used to say: Mordoy da v govno, meaning their face ito their shit. After you learn about them come back I will give you some more material. Good luck. Education is the key!
29. #26 Nobody says you hart civilians intentionally. Reread.
Ron ,   LA   (06.22.06)
After an ultimatum and giving the enauph time to evacuate. Bomb and bomb hard. The responsibility is theirs, since they operate in populated areas. End of story. When recognizing Kassam operators hit them, not civilians. They USE civilians as a cover. This is their shame not ours. our responsibility should be Jewish kids. Our sages are clear. They say; Those who are merciful to crual are in essense cruel to the merciful. Morality comes from Jedaizm, not Progressivism or New Age. Learn from history, genious not from Beilin.
30. Do you want us to become like the Arabs?
Caligula's Horse ,   Solomon's Stables   (06.22.06)
This is exactly why we dont do this, because we are NOT like them, and NEVER will be. Thanks but no thanks!
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