Opinion  Others
Postpone the march, for the sake of peace
Yakov Margi
Published: 11.07.06, 13:04
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24 Talkbacks for this article
1. Sorry, buddy....Jerusalem belongs to all of us...
Andy   (07.11.06)
not just orthodox Jews. And gays will not breach the peach of Jerusalem, your violent consituency will. I hope Israel does not give in to the manacing terror threat of the haredim.
2. Shas Rabbis pick and choose which halachot to follow
yossi shalet ,   miami, fl   (07.11.06)
Hey Margi! It seems to me that you are picking and choosing which halachot to follow. I mean when was the last time that you and your buddies in Shas got this upset about agunot, about women who are beat by their husbands, about children who are starving, about widdows? Until I see a Haredi parade where the top rabbanim from shas and the Gimmel party show up and denounce men who beat their wives and denounce men who don't give their wives GETS then i have no need to listen to you because frankly it seems that you are picking and choosing which halachot to follow. so you see you are not better than the conservative rabbis and the rest of us.
3. Now you sound like the Palestinians
David ,   NYC/Tel Aviv   (07.11.06)
So if violent religious fanatics "throw a rock or two" that's the fault of the peaceful marchers? If they engage in incitement to violent behavior and then commit to violent acts, not to mention baseless hatred, that the fault of people who just happen to be gay? Take some responsibility for your actions! When Palestinians claim that Israel "provoked" them into terrorism and violent behavior, we don't accept this lame excuse. The same goes for certain rabbis and their angry followers. You have the right to peacefully protest the gay rights march. You don't have the right to violent words and behavior.
4. Why did Shas not vote in the no-confidence...
AB ,   The Rock   (07.11.06)
vote initiated by the UTJ against the government regarding this disgusting parade? The author is very naive if it thinks the organizers are going to do any soul searching. These gays are not only shameless perverts (as the picture shows) but are brainless, heartless and I hope the earth swallows them up. That is what they deserve. This is not tinok shenishba. This is a declaration of war on G-d. And we don't stop it, we will all suffer the consequences.
5. Why did Shas vote for the Parade in the Knesset?
bill handel ,   brooklyn, usa   (07.11.06)
I'm confused. If Shas is against the Parade, why did they fail to support the reolution in the Knesset that would have cancelled it? Is this a case of cynical politicians talking out of both sides of their mouth?
6. #1 - Sorry, buddy.... Jerusalem belongs to God.
David ,   Jerusalem, Israel   (07.11.06)
7. World Pride Must Go Forward
David T. ,   Toronto, Canada   (07.12.06)
It's one excuse after another one delay after another. Tomorrow you will say the parade should be stopped because the stars are not in the correct alignment. Let's get a few things straight please. Homosexuality is found in every culture throughout all history and throughout the entire animal kingdom. That means it has got to be millions of years old and is an essential part of nature. Despite what the Torah says about homosexuality it is not an abomination. Homosexuality is as natural as the rain falling or the sun shining and it has been around infinitely longer than any of your three religions. Jews, Muslims and Christians who use their religious beliefs as an excuse to hate homosexuals need to step back and reflect on what they are doing. You are beginning to sound like a bunch of unthinking zealots. You are demonizing the 'other' based on misinformation and ignorance. Your arguments are certainly not rational. I don't care how religious you think you are or how offended you claim to be the fact is you are using religion as a weapon of hate. Just by that alone I know that you are not really religious -- you are merely blind zealots. This parade and the tolerance and understanding it represents must go forward. I am going to be there with my friends and I won't let hateful people put me down and call me stupid names. We are proud of who we are and we know G-d loves us. Stop this parade and you may as well change your name from Israel to Iran.
8. Gay Parade
David Severy ,   Baltimore, Md., USA   (07.12.06)
I have visited Israel twice. The saddest thing I saw there was a sex shop, like here in the States, selling pornography. The saddest report I ever heard was that Russian women who emmigrate to Israel have been selling their bodies on the street, because they find them selves too poor (wether they are or not, I would like to know?), and have lowered their poverty another notch. And is an effort being made to lift them economically above this "need"? As a man who has repented of fornication, Greek: porneia, I KNOW that heterosexual immorality, adultery and pre-marital sex, will send one to hell just as surely as homosexual acts will. It is easy to kick a homosexual as he is at the bottom of the barrel of sin. Persons who love G-d do not do this, though they eschew the practises of "gays". Many people are well aware of the hypocrisy of some who condemn the homosexually sinful soul, while themselves sinning heterosexually. It has been said that he who looks upon a woman and imagines her in his lust, does commit sin in his heart. It is quite easy, and regrettably acceptable in some circles, to be a pot in this world full of kettles.
9. belonging
David Severy ,   Baltimore, Md., USA   (07.12.06)
All things, and we ARE things, belong to G-d. Regrettably not all of us things are SUBMISSIVE to G-d, that is in proper rank under Him. Many prefer their own "thing(s)". Some even regard G-d a thing.
10. Flawed logic #7
(07.12.06)
"Let's get a few things straight please. Homosexuality is found in every culture throughout all history and throughout the entire animal kingdom. That means it has got to be millions of years old and is an essential part of nature." So are behaviours like theft, murder, incest, rape, etc. So by your logic just because these things are found in nature or humanity has an inclination towards them they are appropriate behaviours? תורה elevates humanity above nature, so that humans can become more than mere animals satiating every desire that pops into the mind. Time to lay down in the streets to prevent this impurade.
11. #6 - No David - heaven belongs to God
Andy   (07.12.06)
Jerusalem, like the rest of the planet, he has placed in our hands. And we gay Jews love this wonderful city as much as hetrosexual Jews do. But will it be a city where all are welcome or will the government cave in to terror tacits and allow only orthodox Jews get their way? That is a human choice, but I am sure God is watching, including haredim who incite violence against gay people who assemble peacefully, with modesty and dignity for our relationships and families. All this trashy sex talk has nothing to do with gay people. We know it isn't about sex but instead is about human dignity.
12. #7 - Nicely Said - Ditto
Andy   (07.12.06)
13. Sexual Orientation
David T. ,   Toronto, Canada   (07.12.06)
A person's sexual orientation is not a behaviour. Behaviours like theft, murder, incest, rape even pedophilia and bestiality are predominantly heterosexual predilections. I don't know why heterosexuals like to do these things so much but 90% of this behaviour is by heterosexuals. The funny part is not one single Rabbi has asked that heterosexuality be banned. I mean think about it, if a person's sexual orientation is responsible for these things -- as you claimed -- then heterosexuality must be stopped immediately. The truth is neither heterosexuality nor homosexuality are responsible for rape, incest, pedophilia, etc. It's a shame you didn't already know that.
14. Congratulations
Paul Phillips ,   london england   (07.12.06)
A perfectly crafted essay in medieval bigotry. It should be compulsory reading lest we forget that the battle for decency and civilisation is ongoing.
15. orientation vs. behavior
David Severy ,   Baltimore, Md., USA   (07.12.06)
#13 You say: "A person's sexual orientation is not a behaviour." People are both "oriented" sexually and behave sexually. My lungs are oriented for breathing, but if they breathe, are they not responsible for admitting oxygen to my blood? I am a former fornicator. Former, because the I have stopped behaving as a fornicator. But this does not negate the damage I did as a fornicator, to others and to my own soul. Thankfully G-d mercifully forgives me, and has begun to restore my mental and physical health. But it is with much regret that I realize I cannot do the same for those I harmed. (Some may join me in prayers G-d would attend to their needs now, yes, please?) Much heterosexual behavior is already banned by the Torah. Any sex outside the boundaries of marriage between one man and one women is unwise if not unlawful. Don't ask me to explain polygamy please. It is altogether so that the adversary does blind men making G-d's perspective in hidden from they who will to have it "their way". Unfortunately, or fortunately, if YOU will, G-d does not endorse the sexual smorgasborg man enjoys to his peril.
16. gay pride
anne ,   bournemouth   (07.12.06)
D'you know, I was of the opinion that the Gay movement should have respect for Jerusalem - then I heard the nonsense about a price on their heads... Is this not terrorism too? Are we here to be judge and jury to everyone else? There was a very famous jewish rabbi who said 'Let he who is without sin cast the first stone' OK so jews don't believe in Jesus - but he was most certainly right. At the end of our lives, those of us who believe in a Deity believe that we will be judged. We are capable of judging ourselves daily, or at intervals - we even have Rosh Hashana and Yom Kippur to do just that. Leave God's work to him and look to yourselves, is what I have to say.
17. Give the gays an uzi and a map of Lebanon, they can march
Bunnie Meyer ,   Santa Monica, CA   (07.13.06)
there and help Israel find the soldiers.
18. Time to Postpone the Parade
Ron ,   Tel Aviv   (07.13.06)
I'm gay and I support the parade, but clearly it needs to be postponed. This is not the time to march or celebrate. This is a time of war when Israel's enemies are testing us like never before. This is a time for solidarity, for remembering our fallen soldiers and girlding our teeth for the battle ahead. The are far more important battles in Israel right now than gay rights.
19. The Parade will go on to proove that terrorism cannot win
Jerusalemite   (07.13.06)
The parade will happen even just to show that terrorism cannot win. Even if you oppose the march, you should get up and say "I will not bow down to terror". If you do now, they will be after you tommorow. If you fear for Israeli democracy help this parade happen, if you disagree with the march come and demonstrate against, peacefully.
20. Bunnie, I thought you were more sensible than this.
sk ,   USA   (07.13.06)
21. 18. Time to Postpone the Parade
Marcus ,   Ottawa Canada   (07.14.06)
I have to disagree with you. The smallest battle is but a part of the larger battle. The battle against internal hatred and intolerance in Israel is a part of the battle against hatred and intolerance from outside Israel, and also from within Israel directed outwards. This is the mistake that is happening right now in the United States, where they (the government mostly) are giving up their ideals because they are inconvenient during the time of the war on terror. Where they are giving up their rights and freedoms in an effort to save them. The cost of this are high and would also be for the gay community in Israel. You may return to this battle, only to find that you've lost some of what you already have. And let's be honest, when since 1949 has Israel not faced some level of war and threat or other.
22. Gay Parade
Baruch ,   Boston, USA   (07.27.06)
The parade serves the same purpose as the kidnapping of soldiers by terrorists. Do something that really pisses off the other side and then rant about how they react, knowing full well in advance the reaction. It's provocation. Gays should understand that they are so fundamentally different than the norm that they really belong in their own communities, not intruding on other communities. Haredim understand this about themselves and stay pretty much within their own communities. They don't run Haredi parades through Tel Aviv or Herzliya. The gays need to accept this. Let them do what they want, among their own people. They just really don't fit.
23. #7 - "an essential part of nature"?
Naomi ,   Canada   (07.28.06)
Interesting perspective - homosexuality "an essential part of nature" . . . in what way? Homosexuals cannot procreate or in any way contribute to the continuation of nature. Please explain. What I don't understand is why this "lifestyle" has to be shoved in everyone's face. It is my understanding that the Gay Pride Parade in Jerusalem is about more than just merely celebrating a lifestyle . . . Jerusalem has beeen specifically targeted BECAUSE of it's religious perspective. What's that about???? Doesn't sound like "tolerance and understanding" to me.
24. #7 David T You are right!!!!
A Gay Christian ,   USA   (09.05.06)
Jesus was Gay. It is proven all thru the NT. AND look what happen to him.
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