I don't agree with Alon's criticism about Israel - Israel has been very very soft and nice to the Arabs who call themselves "Palestinians", always bending over backward to make sure they were given yet another chance to normalize themselves and behave as human beings - but they were not able to come along.

failed to mention that the entire thing is a diversion by iran to get the G8 not to talk about sanctions about their nukes. if the world, the west and israel thinks it has won here then they are very stupid. iran is laughing at everybody.

Israel wins a huge victory with world acceptance (even Saudi Arabia!) to dismantle Hezbollah.

Why Israel should win the heart of Fakestinians? This is not necessary and almost impossible because hatrous Arab propaganda and terror will ruin this strategy. A more pragmatic approach is to convince Arabs that attacking Israel is not even an option. It requires less efforts, it's more efficient and it will eventually succeed after a while if Israel has a true leadership and not a bunch of far Leftist appeasers. Ben Meir wants to initiate a new "Peace" process. Regarding Bush mistakes, you are wrong, the Yanks supported the French ideas according to prove that French scums are a bunch of major losers unable to find a solution to Lebanon problems. Ben Meir wants to implement French ideas, these ideas failed during Oslo process, they failed in Lebanon and will fail again and again because they are silly. The point with the French is that they are not pragmatists and are afraid of using strength because they are cowards. That's why they are failing again and again. During the Cold War, the French used the Ben Meir approach to try to defuse Communism importance in France, this was a major mistake because today, France is almost a Communist country on the verge of collapsing. Israel must base her policies on realities and facts rather than on PC wishful thinkings and French BS.

Everyone outside Kadima and extreme left predicted this War. Since this guy did not predict this war, why we should listen to him now. It is like listening to Peres-Beilin-Barak over again.

Your analysis can be summarised by two points: 1. Lebanese and Palestinian resistance are terrorists and they did not understand the repercussions of their deeds. 2. Israel is a peaceful country and it made a mistake by not killing all Lebanese and Palestinians yet. Very shameful but very realistic provided the aggressive nature of the Hebrew state. Israel could have avoided killing innocent people in Lebanon if she wanted to. Israel could have avoided destroying Lebanon if she wanted to. However, Israel is seeking NO PEACE. Otherwise, how could you explain the Israeli bold refusal to release Lebanese prisoners? If Israel wants peace with the surrounding people, she has first to show a gesture of goodwill. Can you imagine the credit that Israel could have gained by releasing the Lebanese prisoners in its jails...!!!! Many calls on doing so have been sent to Israel but to no avail because Israel considers such actions as signs of weakness rather than signs of goodwill. I hope next time your analysis would approach the reality.

There should be no doubt that our mutual leaders are stuck in a dynamic that reinforces the violence and hostility. It is the nature of politics and institutional inertia, and it is more than obvious. Real peace will have to come from the peoples themselves; if we wait for leaders to resolve anything, we will wait forever, and pay a daily price. As a Palestinian I find the alternative to also be a depressing prospect, because reading posts on YNet, CNN, etc over the years, I have ever-increasing doubts that Israelis truly want peace. It seems that Israelis rather prefer Moshe Dayans approach "- that we should tell the Palestinians that we have no solution for you, that you will live like dogs, and whoever will leave will leave, and we'll see where that leads. This approach automatic leads to a policy of making "staying" a hellish proposition for the Palestinians. I see this as today's face of Israeli public opinion proven daily, e.g as electors empowered Sharon (known even to Israelis as a rutheless war criminal but forgiven because they feel the end justifies the means), as few Israelis express any reservation to the indiscriminate killing and destruction of Lebanon (while complaining about indiscriminate suicide bombing), as Israelis have no problem with a security wall uin the West Bank and more direct agressions in Gaza that are precipitating abject poverty and indeed a humanitarian crisis - all these and more accepted and adopted as strategic options in the interest of Israel. What a contradiction. And what peace? It is time to forget this way of thinkning Israel. It is time to understand that as your lives and soliders are valued, so should you value those of Palestinians. As your right to exist and to live in peace is sacred, so is that of Palestinians. As your Israeli neighbour is your brother, equally is your Palestinian neighbour. As you participate in voting and governing the land, equally should the Palestinians. If you are afraid of a Palestinian majority and repulse it, then you are afraid of and repulsing democracy and equity. And this race-based and religion-based repulsion leads to endless violence. This is certain. Israel is the powerful side in this conflict, and it has the ability and choice to continue to follow Dayans approach, and continue to aggravate the conflict, or to change the rules of the game. But dont rely on your leaders for change or for any improvement. With them, the war will continue to escalate, even if there are temporary lulls and even if they use big words. They are stuck in a rut. Peace requires mutual respect and we need to build this because it is now completely absent. For this, a dialogue and cohabitation between peoples (not leaders) is required.

A very good and informative article that is well though out. I can not disagree more with number 6, as he is obviously anti-israel and pro-arab as before reading and looking at the sources he has jumped to the conclusion that Israel is always wrong. Perhaps a gesture of goodwill would be for the arabs, to recognize the state of israel, stop supplying missles, stop their racist propaganda about Israel, America and the west. To allow free speech, Christians to stop being persecuted and Jews forced to Flee. As for releasing prisoners, ever stopped to wonder how israel got them in the first place? Perhaps wanted terrorists, criminals and others deserve to be in Israeli prisons. perhaps also you could point out that Hamas and Hizbollah use civilians as sheilds, bilding their bunkers, weapons caches in civilian areas. Unlike the fact that the arabs always target civilian areas, and seem to be happy to kill israeli civilians. So, it is not the Israeli;s (who pulled back from Lebanon and Gaza) and are discussing pulling back from the west bank. Compromise is two ways. And the arabs havent shown any.

I think it's a miscalculation to consider that Khizb'Allah didn't "cross the line" until they attacked urban areas inside Israel. Khizb'Allah crossed the line when, unprovoked, they crossed Israel's border and attacked Israeli soldiers on sovereign Israel territory - an act of war. Our response should have been no less if that were their only act of war. One of the errors Prof. Ben-Meir notes has been Israel's penchant for repeatedly eroding our own our red lines. Having personally dealt with a cross-section of English-speaking Palistanis (who would likely be most receptive of moderate views) and talking with them on many occasions, my assessment is that there has never been any chance - at all - of Israel winning their hearts or minds. Mutual dignity and respect is the most either can reasonable hope for. I'm most critical of Prof. Ben-Meir's comment about "tit-for-tat and collective punishment." He suggests a vague warm-fuzzy with no concrete and viable suggestions for implementation. On the other hand, his observation about Israeli restraint in the face of Qassam attacks into sovereign Israeli territory (which I think began before PM Olmert's tenure?) is exactly right. Similarly, our doing "very little" to discourage Khizb'Allah's arms build-up began when we tolerated Lebanese spitting and throwing stones across the fence at us. We must be firm in protecting, not compromising, our rights - or we lose them salami style. After each compromise, preventing the next compromise becomes more difficult, NOT easier. (The "Salami Tactic" refers to taking a salami one slice at a time.) Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il

Israel has many so called "chochems", that are ready to criticize everything, and usually ignore their own stupidities and miscalculations. This chochem Ben Mair should just shut up!

Ben Meir joins a long circular line of 'analysts' who express their personal feelings as analysis. Israel kidnaps thousands of Palestinians and hundreds of Lebanese, and murders hundreds more. Including Mossad depredations in Lebanon and Shin Bet turkey shoots in Gaza. This analyst says: "Hezbullah’s leader Sheik Nasrallah must have assumed that the Israeli retaliation would be proportionate, as the European Community shamefully has in fact demanded. " He does give the Jewish State's game away. Death and destruction - despite the 'shameful' requests of Christian EU. Today, Nasralla enjoys the adulation of the Muslim world. For the first time, the sneering killers of Israel are getting a little bit back. Read ANY talk back forum and the Jewish mindset is clear: Kill them Arabs. Nuke them. A minority of Jewish leaders and writers do offer some semblance of balance but are outweighed by the morally blind majority.

Captain London - You ask: "Can you imagine the credit that Israel could have gained by releasing the Lebanese prisoners in its jails...!!!!" No, I can't, but I can imagine the reaction of Hamas and Hezbollah, which would be to do whatever they could to kidnap more Israelis. I can also imagine the reaction of the Israeli people to seeing convicted murders set free, which would be to immediately remove the government from power. The reality is that Israel has shown over and over again (withdrawal from the Sinai, peace with Egypt and Jordan, withdrawal from Gaza) that it is willing to take concrete steps toward peace. The response has been violence and declarations that Israel should be wiped off the map.

Mr.Meir beautiful,thoughtful analysis from another "expert" misses the point:thereis no "gesture"of goodwill the Muslims will accept except for Jews to pack and leave Palestine altogether.Even then they will make sure to kill us all to ensure we do not return.This conflict started in 1920 through incitement of stupid,hysterical,martyrdom seeking,jihadists prone Muslims to kill Jews.Mrs. Ashrawi,not a Jew lover,to say the least,said clearly:"We Arabs,differentfrom you Jews, are a all or nothing people".It means there is no room for compromise in their culture.Arabs see conspiracy in every move Israel will or has made for peaceful coexistence."Moderate "Palestinians are gone,victims of their own propaganda,the mais word in their psychopathological culture is "revenge".Who can survive mentally in an environment that fosters only hate from preschool to the day you die?This is Israel's predicament. We love life too much,they love martyrdom too much.So, "peace process" is an illusion of people who can not accept our enemies the way the are. Therefore,there is no room to criticise Israel,except when it engages insuicidal acts like Oslo,disengagements or the like.Land for peace is over.Now the motto should be "peace for peace"

Those who are most hate-spewing are also usually the most vocal and strident. That goes for Christians and Muslims, including Arabs, as well as Jews. On-line, I've encountered more hate-mongering Jews than I'd ever thought existed. Yet, in my Teimani beit k'nesset (synagogue), no one I know of hates Arabs. My daughters Orthodox high school schoolmates don't hate. The college friends she has now at Tel Aviv Univ. don't hate. No one I know would waste their mental energy on hate. On the contrary, I, and everyone I've talked to, would love to see Arabs in Gaza and the West Bank live a happy, prosperous and peaceful life. But that isn't what the majority of Arabs in Gaza and the West bank, as proven in their most recent election, really want. Instead, Arabs in Gaza and the West bank are implacably committed to ripping the heart out of the Jews - Yerushalayim and a decimated land that Muslims can be sure of eliminating. If you genuinely want a happy, prosperous and peaceful life the quickest and surest way to obtain that is by making Israel your political and economic partner instead of blowing up busloads of Jews and sending rockets into Israel. Take responsibility for a change. It's the Arab people, often called civilians, in Gaza and the West Bank who elected terrorists to represent them. You aren't innocent. Whether Palistanis or Lebanese, people everywhere in this region are going to have to learn that they are, and will be held, accountable for who they elect to govern and represent them and the consequences of that choice. When Jews disapprove of our leaders we get out in the streets and protest and change our leadership. You think we got out of Lebanon and Gaza because some glorious Islamic Arab "martyrs" chased us out. That's a huge load of crap that Islamic Arabs swallow because it fits the warped theology of their false prophet and they want to believe it. We got out because Israeli Jews insisted that we didn't belong there and insisted that our leaders follow the will of the Israeli citizenry. This is what you will have to learn to do. Your greatest miscalculations now are occurring because you think Arabs "martyrs" can continue chasing us into the sea when the fact is that the Israeli Jews who got us out of Lebanon and Gaza are the power that now tells our leaders we DO belong where we are now. So, Khizb'Allah is getting its arms amputated. Your poverty is 180 degrees contrary to Israeli interests. If you were happy and prosperous you'd be busy enjoying life instead of attacking Israel. Your poverty is caused by your own choices in allowing corrupt leaders to steal from you and keep you impoverished- keeping your shops closed, sabotaging any economic progress and the like - so that you'll stay angry and they can direct it at Israel. Israel is a scapegoat for all ills while your leaders line their pockets or pursue their dream of an Islamic caliphate. Take a hard look about valuing Palistani lives sir. We don't celebrate or hand out candies when one of you is killed. For Jews, it is a sad necessity of self-defense. Look at yourself. When a Jew is killed you dance in the streets, hand out candies and dismember the body, kicking a head around like a soccer ball. That's all documented, not baseless assertions. Valuing life begins with yourself and in your own community. When Jews are welcome to live in Mecca then your complaint about our repulsing a Palistani - Islamic - majority will ring a little less hypocritical. Take a strong dose of your own advice, sir: "But dont rely on your leaders for change or for any improvement. With them, the war will continue to escalate, even if there are temporary lulls and even if they use big words. They are stuck in a rut." Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il

Your message unfortuantely goes to prove my conviction that Israelis do not care for peace ; - you only reinforce the own cycle of thinking that you have no choice but to kill and bomb us. But you do have a choice. Your proposition that Palestinians and others in the region will be punished if they do not democratically elect those that you wish to see in power is unacceptable. The election of Hamas represents exactly what you recommend - an effort to rid ourselves of corrupted leaders with bankrupt policies. If you truly believe that suicide bombings targetting innocent civilians is loathsome and unacceptable, which I do believe, you would not repeat the rhetoric that the we must pay the price, thereby justifying the killing of innocent civilians in lebanon, gaza and the west bank, as a national strategy. And if you openly and sincerly consider the facts (and the all the incidents of oppression, torture, killing, open theft and robery, terror) that we face on a daily basis for now almost 60 years, with so many broken promises from the international community, and with Israel talking morality to the world while carrying out the most immoral acts, you would not be so surprised that (after all these years, with back to the wall and the relentless oppression continuing to squash us not only as individuals but as families, communities and a nation) some palestinians have decided to resist with whatever action they could, even if it is the most drastic of action, somehow justifying to themselves the unforgivable. This is the irony, that you have pushed us to the point where being inhuman is the only option for us to save some of our humanity. Even Barak said that if he was a Palestinian, he would be a terrorist. Dont be surprised then, in these circumstances, about kicking the rare body that falls in the hands of desparate and bottled up youth. Israel cannot credibly continue to paint us as reborn nazis when it is the occupier, it is building walls and ghettos, it is killing as if for fun. I dont know if I am sad or sick but I ask you to please think again. You know that there have been efforts to partner with Israel and you know where these led. But I am sure that you do not appreciate why the proposals made to Palestinians could not be accepted. I would guess that you heavily buy into this thinking that it was a generous offer. Actually no one on this side is looking for generosity. We are looking for justice. We were offered bantustans. And on top of this we were told that refugees abroad can die and rot where they are and to hell with them. And why do we get such a dismal proposal when people from around the world can and do return to Israel/Palestine? (Just as long as he/she is a Jew, of course) Then you say you have no problems with muslims... Mecca is neither valued by the rest of the world nor a major restirction on your lives and livelihoods. It is one holy site with its own rituals. It is not the norm. This example that is so loved by Israelis is completely irrelevant. it does not parallel or compare to the exclusion that you have implemented as a matter of general/global policy. I can go on, but the point is, please take a look at the reality on the other side. take a look at what you have that you should be thankful for, and see whether that can inspire you to wish well to your neighbours. Not because it means that we wont put any more attention to fighting, but because you genuinely may wish well to your neighbours. After all, lets admit it, they did not pick this fight. Zionism did. And what do you want them to do now? Thank Israel for its humanity?

To this day I haven't read a single post by an Israeli that I completely agree with. And I think it's safe to say that Israelis would not completely agree with my read of the situation. A small minority excluded, Palestinians do not want to throw the Jews into the sea or any such thing. You blame the palestinians for voting for Hamas - yet you yourselves have voted for Sharon's Likud a number of times. Did you ask yourselves what signal that sent to the Palestinians? The cold reality is that each people are primarily interested in their own happiness and peace - and largely disinterested in the other's welfare. That's only normal. Both peoples need to realise that their own happiness and safety is tied up with the other's, and that greed for land or resources may have a short term benefit if you have the armies and power to hold on to it - it will backfire in the long term. History proves that time and again.

Thank you for spelling so eloquently exactly how I think. I hope Arabs listen, do I doubt.

Does anyone know how to win the hearts and minds of Arabs located in the territories? Going forward, Israel will need to do this to the extent that it does not kill or expell them.

Mier Ben-Alone, talks about miscalculation of every party the Arab-Israeli conflict, I felt like reading reproduction of so many analysis and predictions before the “unilateral” US occupation of Iraq,.They have talked about removing the bad guy and people will get out to the streets in flowers to congratulate the “liberators” Four years since then no single flowers was given to an American not to the other invaders, many thousands innocent have paid, and still pay their lives, for the wise, realistic and true analysis of the crisis. Sadam was gone and few to be replaced with thousands of gangsters. How the writers of those analysis feel about it. The very same simplistic approach to suggest that “Hezbollah, from the Israeli perspective, must now be dismantled or destroyed” Even if Israel will achieve this goal soon, they will dismantle a one organization to create a more radical small groups that will turn the region into fire. I don not think that the many thousands fighters of Hamas and Hezbollah, will apply for jobs at MacDonald’s branches in Lebanon or even at a potential Tnouva Israeli out let in Beirut after the destruction of the two organizations. I hope politicians are not taken this “shallow analysis “and wishful thinking seriously and as an analysis. No one offered vision for Iraq after Sadam, they were all shortsighted, Being not only a writer but a head of the Middle East Project, we hope that Ben-Alone do his home work and tell us how all these youths and supporters of Hamas and Hezbollah would be absorbed shortly in the new Middle East Project while their main talents now is fighting. Hope to hear from him a deeper analysis next time.

It calls things by their correct names. However, it did not point out this: It's a good thing that all the mistakes it lists were made: Now, no new arguments on behalf of terrorist organizations can be made anymore: Hizbullah can't claim that it helps Lebanon, or that it has Pan-Arab support. Same with Hamas. It also lost its "heroic" status in the eyes of Lebanese and Arabs. That could have only happened if it were hit by Israel-as it is. Syria and Iran have lost respect and status, in front of the whole world-Arabs included. The Arab street always gets fed massive doses of propaganda, but now they see reality with their own eyes-the destruction of Hizbullah infrastructure, and its failure to deter Israel cannot be hidden. They also see that israel is not the murderer they were told it is, because it does not carpet-bomb Lebanon or Gaza, even though it is obvious it can-militarily speaking. Everything that was kept hidden, every lie, every inflated claim, have been brought out in the open now. This war will bring on profound changes in persceptions, rhetoric, attitudes, faith, and also pragmatic ones, on the ground. The best thing the Lebanese government did was state early "We did not know Hizbullah did this, so we're not responsible". That's how Lebanese people learned with NO doubt that Hizbullah dragged their country in a devastating war which Lebanon did not want and could not afford. And that's how the world was made to pay full attention.

The very first thing that comes to mind in answer to you question is this: As you correctly state, thousands of Arabs are "employed" as figheters and suicide bombers. They're getting paid. All that money can stop paying them to fight Israel and to blow themselves up, and instead paying them in jobs, and in schools.

Had israel placed more pressure at the beginning, perhaps the international community might forced Hizbullah to change. Of course this only a theorectical construct and it is a little bit like Zeno's paradox about shooting an arrow at your friend -- since space subdivides ad infinitum, the arrow will never hit its target. There is only one little problem about Zeno's paradox --- don't stand in the way of the arrow!! Hizbullah is a terrorist organization and it seems to me that no amount of coaxing would make any difference since Nassarkah and others take their oders from ALLAH. In short, diplomacy can never solve the problem, but a pure military victory destroying Hizbullah might. . . . MS

Thank you for proving my point. I offered you the only possible solution in the real world but you are hopelessly mired in your propaganda. Rethink or don't but your arguments are irrational and illogical with no future. It's your life, your people remaining impoverished and your suffering. Rethink or don't but I'm not arguing your repeatedly regurgitated propaganda. Israeli Orthodox Jew Advocating Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il Ra'anana, Israel

I remember that a long time ago, when I studied medicine in Europe, there was a specialist in surgery from an Arab country who behaved very humanely and nicely towards me. He was the only one, the other supervisors in this department were very rude towards the medical students. His name was Muhammad. I remember that my gut reaction was: "For a Jew there is no good place in this world, except maybe in the Middle East, because deeply inside themselves Arabs are decent human beings". Generalizations are never 100% true, but on reading Ibrahim I came to the same conclusion again. Sooner or later there will be peace in this region.

He complains that the US is letting Israel and lehavdil the PA to its own devices whilst at the same time saying that Israel needs to wipe off Hizbulla and Hamas. We all know that when the Americans get involved our hands and feet are tied and any agreement orchestrated by them is always to our detriment. The best thing America can do is keep out of this. If they want to send help ($$$) for doing the job that the whole world should be doing, then fine. Otherwise let us defend and protect ourselves as needed. G-d loves the Jewish nation and even though we are not what we should be, we rely on Him and His mercy to keep our enemies at bay.

Ephraim, It's not about "decent people" my friend. There are good people everywhere. It's about non-stop propaganda inciting Arabs to eliminate Israel, and about how all Israel wants is to kill all Arabs. It is the closest thing to brainwashing. The Arab masses who read the newspaper and watch Arab TV get NO other news, NO other points of view. Remember how Saddam declared victory at the end of the Gulf War???? He knew the vast majority of the masses would believe him, because that was ALL they were going to hear. Hate is poured on them day and night and passed on to their children . Hate against Israel is woven into almost everything-that's how "good people" are turned into haters-they don't know anything else. The leaders and clerics who create this intensive, non-stop propaganda know the psychology of the Arab VERY well-they know their pride and loyalty, and their courage. They deviced the way to make these "good people" into human weapons. If change comes, it will come FIRST from a visible crushing of Hezbullah-something that cannot be hidden EXACTLY BECAUSE IT IS HAPPENING IN AN ARAB COUNTRY, written in Arabic, told in Arabic, by Arabic newsmen. Syria and Iran cannot control the Lebanese media as Saddam did in Iraq. Only a defeat will force the Islamists to find another way to be: the defeat will have taken away their arguments, their claims, their promises, and their posturing-they will have nothing left with which to galvanize and entice the masses. There lies the hope of sane, reasonable, moderate people coming to power and effecting change. Be safe my friend.

and not in Saudi Arabia and working for the MOSAD or Shen Beat. I think I know you long time ago at Arabynet if you forget I was Khalil at that time. GO PLAY IN ANOTHER PLAYAREA.

Palestinian strategy? I have only one question for the Palestinian people to answer, and it will tell you where they are going to end up after all this. What have you produced for export, in the nature of a commodity or services to bring your country into the world of commerce in the past ten years?

It keeps being an huge unanswered question why Olmert suplied Fatah Abu Mazen with a huge arsenal of arms,just one month ago. I would like to have this very obscure question answered. And,in another level of miscalculation,how the same government keeps permitting the entrance of enemies workers in Israel,before a clear situation betwen Israel and the territories is clearly defined. And still yet,how this govt. permit arab prisioners to have a decisive role in enemies politics and actions. And finally,what a miscalculation is that to let arabs subversives in Israeli parliament acting against Israeli interests? These all should be deeply review,I am sure.

The only "Disastrous miscalculations" here are the ones Alon Ben-Meir clings to: finding Arab "moderates" to talk to, blah, blah. In other words, according to Alon Ben-Meir, despite the "Disastrous miscalculations' " disastrous consequences in the past, all roads lead back to the same place.