Opinion  Yaron London
Past wars and the war to come
Yaron London
Published: 17.08.06, 12:12
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35 Talkbacks for this article
1. good article, good tv programme, keep it up Yaron.
eugene ,   israel   (08.17.06)
2. learn and improve
PS   (08.17.06)
Hope we can learn from this war by implementing the suggestions in this article plus protect tanks from the missiles that took a toll on them. Re Halutz, bad judgement, but not grounds for dismissal.
3. This is the ONLY pattern worth watching...
Debra ,   USA   (08.17.06)
No ELITES were ANYWHERE NEAR the Twin Towers on 9/11... This SAME pattern will be REPEATED in Jerusalem on 8/22...
4. war war war
hamad ,   london   (08.17.06)
why can't you just talk about peace . why all this suffering for the people
5. Fighting Israel Haters on the Internet
Nehemiah ,   NJ, usa   (08.17.06)
http://www.libertyforum.org - you can post anything you want there - go fight the jew haters there - the jew haters there have taken over the forum there - the forum rules cannot ban anyone there
6. London supported dis'gagement - why is Ynet employing him?
Dudu ,   Kfar Sava   (08.17.06)
The author is a confused, self-hating atheist Israeli who does not believe the Jews have the right to this land at all. Hence his self-guilt and despair. Israel has nothing to learn from such losers.
7. Israel
Marc ,   West Palm Beach, USA   (08.17.06)
I thought the "blame America first " folks in the USA were bad. I cannot believe the self criticism Israelis engage in even before the war has ended and the troops are safely home. Israel needs dynamic leadership that can put aside partisan bickering and correct the problems that were evident in the Lebanon campaign. We Jews do nto have the luxury currently for a lot of divisiveness; much of the Islamic world wants to destroy us and the Christian world (except the US) is largely apathetic or worse.
8. Good and true article
Dan A. ,   Paris, France   (08.17.06)
I would only add: Don't trust Lahoud, Kofi Annan. Prepare the future: buy and stock powerful amunitions, bombs. Collect intelligence. Develop protection techniques for armored vehicles and short range missils. Train soldiers and express them our admiration for their courage. Elect strong and clever leaders for the country. Hit forcefully when necessary. The war is not yet over, the end of Hizbullah started July 12.
9. to Nehemiah: not every critic of Israel is a Hater
Lebanese   (08.17.06)
When you will stop thinking this way and start being self-conscious about the mistakes of Israel, then you'll be ready for peace. By the way, you're in NJ, so focus on NJ's problems.
10. Insider trading?
Jon ,   Australia   (08.17.06)
He sold his shares while on his way to give the cabinet advice which was sure to drive stock values down. So shouldn't he be busted for insider trading, or is that not a crime in Israel?
11. Wrong way to look at it
Nadav ,   Misgav   (08.17.06)
Sorry but it sound to me that we should spend hidden under the ground like rats....no way. What about a strongly improved Inteligence in Lebanon, a proper way to intercept rockets as well as a proper plan to really smash Hibolla in week.?
12. For Yaron
Issam S. ,   Lebanon   (08.17.06)
Maybe it is time to change the mentality of war. War never proved to buy you freinds, victory, or dominance. Instead, war weakened you and created more brutal enemies such as hezbollah.
13. driven out?
Adam ,   Stamford, CT, USA   (08.17.06)
One incorrect fact in this opinion article is that the Israeli's in no way drove out the arabs! Rather the contrary the Israeli's let the arabs stay but they wanted to just be bought out! Secondly the reason the Israeli's did not drive out the arabs is that they were great for cheap labor which the Israeli's liked a lot. So the land that most of the arabs owned was bought up by the Israeli's lawfully, properly, and without any fights of any sort. The arabs wanted to leave becasue it was Israel and they did nto want to live in Israel. Therefore all these claims being made by these so called "palestinians" who are in fact just ordinary arabs form jordan, saudi arabia, egypt, and lebanon have no claim's to any of this land at all!
14. "we should therefor fortify ourselves"
sagi nahor ,   Hatzafon   (08.17.06)
Yaron, I love you dearly. You have always been one of the more sane members of our society, but please let me comment on this quotation from your article. In our long and illustrious history, neither homot nor homotaim have ever served us well. In every single instance of fortifications and hidding behind walls we have lost. Metzada, Lachish, Betar and many more. I was brought up in the era and doctines of Arik, Raful, Moshe et al. It is the only way. Spearhead into enemy territory asap and in force and deploying ruthless and swift tactics. No walls.
15. so wrong on the facts
Jeff Gaer ,   Austin TX   (08.17.06)
The PLO was NOT a result of th e6 day war and conquest of the west bank, it was founded in 1964, and its original charter specifically excludes liberating the west bank ( then from jordan). The israelis did NOT drive the arabs out of Israel, the original 1948 mandate only gave Israel areas of Jewish Majority, the arabs that stayed live in peace, vote and serve in the knesset, the arabs that left were offered return after the armistace, and in some areas the Haganah literally BEGGED them not to go. Wars if decisvely won CAN bring a lasting peace. The arabs are no more warlike and determined than the Japanese in WW11, the original suicide bombers.
16. To Adam and all who deny the rights of the Palestinian peopl
Lebanese   (08.17.06)
What really surprise me is how ignorant of history you are. I guess living in the US didn’t help… When you decide to quite this arrogant rhetoric, you can start reading history: a good way to start is the official documents of the UN. Start with http://www.un.org/Depts/dpa/ngo/history.html Oh, I forgot the UN is against Israel… Have you ever asked yourself why? … Also, I’m not saying that the first immigrants did not buy land in Palestine, but did the followers do? The answer is NO; its called realestate greed. After looking at various alternatives, the UN proposed the partitioning of Palestine into two independent States, one Palestinian Arab and the other Jewish, with Jerusalem internationalized (Resolution 181 (II) of 1947). One of the two States envisaged in the partition plan proclaimed its independence as Israel and in the 1948 war expanded to occupy 77 per cent of the territory of Palestine. Israel also occupied the larger part of Jerusalem. Over half the indigenous Palestinian population fled or were expelled. Jordan and Egypt occupied the other parts of the territory assigned by the partition resolution to the Palestinian Arab State which did not come into being. In the 1967 war, Israel occupied the remaining territory of Palestine, until then under Jordanian and Egyptian control (the West Bank and Gaza Strip). This included the remaining part of Jerusalem, which was subsequently annexed by Israel. The war brought about a second exodus of Palestinians, estimated at half a million. Security Council resolution 242 (1967) of 22 November 1967 called on Israel to withdraw from territories it had occupied in the 1967 conflict. In 1974, the General Assembly reaffirmed the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people to self-determination, national independence and sovereignty, and to return. The following year, the General Assembly established the Committee on the Exercise of the Inalienable Rights of the Palestinian People. The General Assembly conferred on the PLO the status of observer in the Assembly and in other international conferences held under United Nations auspices.
17. How long?
The Raccoon   (08.17.06)
How long will we wade throat-deep in self-loathing, hesitation and fear? Israel could have won this war - easily. But our politicians were unable to do so - they do not know how to win. The very concept is alien to them, it seems. The next, inevitable, war should be fought without mercy or hesitation. The ground of Lebanon should have been turned into desert wherver a Hizballah fighter or supporter stood; same goes for the Palestinian terrories and their terrorists along with supporters. If we continue to wage half-a-war like we do now, we're doomed - we'll have another genocide and Israel will be destroyed. Why do we let a fifth column - openly striving to destroy Israel and genocide the Jews, impersonated by the Arab MKs - operate in our midst? Why do we let genocidal terrorists kill us without reprisal? Why are we afraid to use our military might against those who are trying to genocide us? And how long do you think we can survive like this?
18. End
Choni Davidowitz   (08.17.06)
The only way to end this conflict is to follow God's command. First expel/transfer all Ishmaelites to their fellow countryman in 21Arab countries,and then annex all of Yesha. This might invoke the wrath of the world if israel goes ahead with this plan,but if it does not it will invoke the wrath of GOD .
19. history of evil
moe ,   montreal, Canada   (08.17.06)
read your history books, through out your short history, since you took palestine all your history is about wars, one after another. is this a normal life or are you normal people? why do you fight, did you ask yourself?? do people really hate you, or they are just defending themselves?? you fight because you are in a land where you don't belong, and you always try to take more land and fight more people. if this is the life you choose for yourself, wel, good luck. and always be ready to fight.
20. the course of war
moe ,   montreal, Canada   (08.17.06)
time is changing, and the wars you used to spend a week, or week-end to finish and occupy the land and prepare for the next war is over. the change started with 1973 war, that was wasn't a major victory for anyone, but you were in real trouble, trouble continued when you went to lebanon in 1982, you managed to go to beirut, but the long term war was a big lose for Israel who left in 2000 with major defeat, but instead of learning the lesson you went to do the same fight against the same people and what did you win? another major defeat, but the blow was much harder this time. enough war, and get a life.
21. Nice try, Lebanese #16
The Raccoon   (08.17.06)
Very nice try. The UN is against Israel because most of the memebers of the UN are tinpot dictatorships, terrorist states and terrorist client states. In 1948, the Arabs rejected the partition and tried to destroy Israel and to genocide the Jews (and they havn't stopped trying until now). the Jews won. Now the Arabs whine that the Jews didn't die quietly. And hey - after you reject peace and start a war, you should be thanking the victor on your knees for being alive, not whining about losing land and how your "rights" were hurt as you were trying to commit genocide. Israel has made the mistake of being too soft.
22. How would the Romans handle Hezbollah?
Matt ,   Issaquah, USA   (08.17.06)
How would the Romans handle an asymmetrical war like fighing Hezbollah? What the Romans always tried to do was simple and straightforward. They would try to negotiate with these groups, but if they became a problem, a Roman army would march off to wipe them out. This was a no-prisoners approach. If the victory was complete, then presumably thousands would be slaughtered. Those remaining fighters would be taken prisoner, and ritualistically crucified—also often, in the thousands. Women and children would be profitably sold into slavery. The track record for this approach spanned at least five centuries. Both the U.S. administration and the Israeli administration seek to engage fighters only. Apparently, they don’t understand that their war is with the entire population. In Lebanon, that’s 1.4 million Shiites committed to war against Israel. In Iraq, the Sunni insurgency span 5 million committed people, not just the actual fighters.
23. Failed Leaders
Jay Ticker ,   New York, New York   (08.17.06)
I am dismayed that a tzunami of revulsion has not already swept away Olmert, Halutz and this whole cabal of failed leaders. Israel needs to purge itself in order to prepare for the dangers it faces. Profound reforms, which I only hope and pray new elections may help clear the way for, are needed, now.
24. Micah dissent - no more war
McLoughlin ,   Ottawa, Canada   (08.18.06)
London is wrong. I hope this is not the prevailing defeatist attitude in Israel. War is not inevitable. War is not inevitable if you are prepared to do the math on what it will take for real peace. Real peace is possible. But real peace needs real men who are tough enough to lead the people to peace. Clue: Netanyahu doesn't have it.
25. DAN HALUTZ
SAM ,   NEW YORK   (08.18.06)
IS BOMBING ,SUNNI, DRUZE AND MARONITES IN ORDER TO MAKE THEM FIGHT HEZBOLLA THE BEST MILITARY STRATEGY DAN HALUTZ CAN COME UP WITH? WHY ALL THIS DESTRUCTIVE POWER WAS NOT UNLEASHED ON BINT JUBAIL?MORE PEOPLE EVACUATED METULLA THAN BINT JUBAIL
26. BALANCED LEBANESE COMMENTERS AND COMMENTS
NELSON FAIER ,   RIO DE JANEIRO   (08.18.06)
27. Re: How would the Romans handle Hezbollah?
Ron ,   USA   (08.18.06)
If Hizbullah enters Israel in another war, it's not likely they would target only the IDF. The entire population would be would be in their sights. Their indiscriminate firing of rockets and historical rethoric is enough to prove that they would treat Israel like the Romans did. On the other hand, if Israel is forced to reenter Lebanon, she should drive out the inhabitants. Let the neighboring countries handle the refugee problem and use the land as a negotiating card.
28. #23 Failed Leaders
Craig ,   USA   (08.18.06)
Well put Jay... The Israeli people must wake up and throw off this self-delusional leftist inspired stupor. Israel, you must immediately go to a WAR footing. Look around you, already the 'resolution' is being compromised, the Arabs are preparing, salivating as they realize you are led by a weak and appeasing administration. What is wrong with Israel? Wake up and act swiftly, your time is short. You must find the WILL to act. Don't Listen to fools who say war doesn't solve anything. Idiocy like this almost lost all of Europe to the Nazis, you are facing Islamo-Nazis, they only understand violence. You are God's Chosen People.. act like it. And if you are one of those fools who don't believe in God...YOU are a big part of the problem. Ever find it curious that so many leftists are also atheists..think about it. Evangelical Christians are your best support, never ever trust the Catholic Church.
29. # 13 Adam
Sam ,   NY   (08.18.06)
Right on. "palestinians" is a myth.They didn't call themselves "palestinians" when they were under Jordan's or Egypt's control ! ! When the Jews got on board they changed their tune.They NEVER were a sovereign nation,nor kingdom as "palestinians". They lived as tribes,then under Ottomans, & British. And they've shown little desire to live in peace. Most of them want all the Jews out. Ain't gonna happen.
30. #16 and #21
ahmad ,   bint jbeil lebanon   (08.18.06)
damm right israel was too soft on hezballah. for israel 2 kidnapped soldiers is a good reason to go to war...even though the reason this time might not be the 2 kidnapped soldier...because israel values the life of one human...but for hezballah a loss of 1000 soldiers doesnt bother them that much...it doesnt make the public opinion go crazy like it does in israel...so hezballah uses that knowing that the more he inflict casualties the more pressure israel would have on itself....the funny thing is that hezballah supporters admit that and agree with it...so the question is how come it doesnt bother them to loose so many people??? the answer is very simple as hezballah supporters say, their fighters are ready to die...death isnt a bad thing for them.....but how so???? again its very simple its because they believe in martyrdom, their religion ( which is mine too ) teaches them that....so the solution is also simple, you have to match their extremism. they are ready to die? men women and children??? then israel should kill them. men women and children, they use rockets to kill israeli? israel should use biological and chemical weapons, WIPE THEM OUT......and then i promise you nassrallah would see what israel is capable of and will be begging for mercy..... think about it... later
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