Culture
History lesson
Yaniv Halily
Published: 09.01.07, 03:07
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25 Talkbacks for this article
1. Mizrachi Education
Marc ,   USA   (01.09.07)
Sephardic parents must step up and teach their children their own culture. Not enough to say that the Rambam is Sephardic. Fathers should be siiting down every night and teaching the content of the Mishna Torah, Iben Ezra, Rif, Chidah to their kids.
2. Also, how the Israeli "elite" treated Mizrahi Jews
(01.09.07)
How they treated the Yeminites!!!! SPIT
3. As Ashkenazi, I want to know about all my brothers histories
David ,   Boston, USA   (01.09.07)
I am just as interesting in Sephardic culture and history. We Jews have so much history all over the world. Make NO mistake. We are all brothers.
4. Don't worry we hate that type too
Caroline   (01.09.07)
We Ashkenazim on the right hate those Ashkenazi, bleeding-heart, leftist, naive fools too. They have marginalized everyone who is not part of their Ashkenazi leftist elite and it is about time the silent majority in Israel of both Ashkenazim and Sefaradim take down these losers.
5. I sympathize with you Yaniv
Noam ,   Boca Raton, FL   (01.09.07)
The State of Israel needs to remind itself that a majority of its Jewish population does not hail from the shtetl in Eastern Europe nor romanticizes gfilte fish and kneidelech. The majority come from lands of Islamic rule and adhere to Sephardi/Mizrahi tradition, more likely closer to the original practices of the Bnai Yisrael in their homeland before the exile than the Ashkenasim. It is shameful that the education system only emphasizes Asheknasi worldviews and historiography. The history of Jews in North Africa, Iran, and the ME should be taught, emphasizing Jews' achievements and episodes of tolerance as well as the persecutions suffered under some harsh Islamic rulers. Likewise Mizrahi literature and sages such as Rabbi Shabazi from Yemen should be taught. It should emphasize that despite the differences in cultural and practices of Sephardim/Mizrachim and Ashkenasim, we as Bnai Yisrael have remained one people with one destiny.
6. mizrachi
Arthur ,   jesey city usa   (01.09.07)
My mothers close friend married a Mizrachi about 50+ years ago. Her family were skeptical, he dovined for them and finally convinced them. As a kid what I learned was that he was great at simchas and I learned a lot about the Mizrachis and loved that part of our heritage. All Jews should be aware and share our mutual and different cultures and understand the history and beauty. Our cultures are fascinating from the different areas we came from. Cynically, those who hate us do not draw distinctions so why should we. Lets revel in our heritage.
7. lets not devide the nation
Alex ,   San Francisco   (01.09.07)
I'm also an ashkenazi jew that's interested to learn about every group of our diverse jewish tribe. However, I find this article and topic inappropriate at the time when Iran is uniting the world against us and stating that Israel is weakening. Jews, we're one!
8. May be Israel need another Education Minister
Ben Abuya ,   Spharad   (01.09.07)
Very interesting this article about non- Ashkenazi Jews. But you must distinguish among Sephardim Jews and the more generic Mizrachi Jews that include all middle-eastern Jews however big cultural differences among them. Besides, you have Jews from India, Cochin, and Ethiopia. Sephardim are descendant of Spain expelled Jews that settled not only in Morocco, Greece, Turkey but also in Holland, Germany , Italy, Romania, Balkans, Palestine, and so on. By the way, Hertzl mother family name was Diamant a well know surname of Catalonia (Spain). Really, Hebrew religions own to Sephardim almost all liturgies. Not be acquainted of this means ignores almost all about Jew culture and religion. Think about Talmudic epoch (Babel (Iraq) and Jerusalem Talmud) thank to Mizrachi Jews.. Afterward, Kabala is mainly Sephardic. The historical permanence of Jews in Palestine after Second Temple destruction till nowadays in Jerusalem Old City, Hebron, Bethlehem, Gaza, Schjem, Acco, Tiberias, etc, happened thank to Mizrachim and Sephardim. Study about this means to be a proud Israeli no matter which group you belong to.
9. History Lesson
TorahNotes ,   Yerushalayim   (01.09.07)
You got parents? Don't they have the responsibility to talk about family and roots. Stop blaming the Ashk. leftists for your family's ommissions. The Ashkanazy lefty's have plenty of aveirot on their heads without you making up a new one.
10. SINCE WHEN DO THE ISRAELI SCHOOLS TEACH ZIONISM?
Ben Avraham ,   Tel Aviv   (01.09.07)
11. Let's be realistic guys
Eytan Aronbayev   (01.09.07)
This country is dominantly a Westernised European country, founded by European Jews and in many cases (not entirely) controlled by European Jews. It's up to US to look after our culture, our tradititons, our food, our music, and our languages. This state will not do it for us. We are one people - one nation - and I am glad that we are finally united. But we shouldn't allow that to dissolve thousands of years of our history. I am a Bukkharan Jew who cannot speak a word of Bukhori, and already my family have lost a lot of our traditions and some of our cooking recipes. I wish that my grandparents had taught me Bukhori when I still had the chance, but I will pursue learning this language myself. It is sad that Israel, the Jewish State, pays so little attention to the rich history that the Jews had outside of Europe.
12. Mizrachi Education
suzi tourgeman ,   jerusalem israel   (01.09.07)
I am an English teacher in an Israeli public high school. One year my students were having a civics test and they were very absorbed with it so I let them tell me about what they were learning. Many of my students were of Kurdish background in that class and I asked them to find me something discussing Kurdish history and/or Kurdish Jewish history. We could find nothing in the civics or history books. It was really an eye opener to me and to the class and I told them that one day they would have to help rewrite their Israeli history books. I mentioned something to somebody teaching history and they agreed that very litle has been and was mentioned. I do believe the situation has changed and if not, it has to very quickly. Also Ethiopian and new Russian Jewish history should be included. By the way the students know nothing about the great history of the American Jewish communities. They think all Jews come from Brooklyn and that America is for making money and working in malls.
13. Teimanim, Bavlim, Persian Jews, Mizrakhim & Sepharadim...
Paqid 16 Netzarim ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (01.09.07)
in that order are, from the Judaic history sources I've read, the most true to the Hebrews / Benei Yisraeil and Torah-Halakhah at Har Sinai. Israeli (and Diaspora Jewish) schools should teach all of these -- in this priority. Ashkenazi tradition is a story of European influence that is alien to our roots in Har Sinai. Paqid Yirmeyahu Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il
14. Excellent point Yaniv!
Michelle ,   Jerusalem   (01.09.07)
I agree 100%. Considering 50% of the population in Israel is probably Sefardi/Mizrachi - there is no reason why there should not be a short unit on all these different typesof Jews - Persian Jews, Iraqi, Kurdish, the 5 different types of North Africa Jews, Greek and Turkish, Indian, and Ethopian. It's a great way for the kids to connect with the family history. I also embarked into my own research on the history of the Jews in Egypt, where my family is from. Fortunately, nowadays there are some interesting websites: International Association of the Jews of Egypt: http://www.iajegypt.org/ Historical Society of the Jews of Egypt. http://www.hsje.org/.
15. It's about time
NYC Girl   (01.09.07)
For too long the history of Sephardi and Mizrahi Jews has been neglected, and aside from overlooking a very important aspect of Israeli society, it also clouds the fact that nearly one million Jews were forced to flee the Arab countries. Now, it can only be to Israel's advantage, both culturally and politically, to start making up for past neglect.
16. Thank you
Chaya ,   Bat Yam, Israel   (01.09.07)
Thank you for telling us an unknown (at least to most Jews) part of Jewish history. Who knows how many thousands of Iranians are descended from those who had been forcibly converted (as there are thousands of Anusim in South America, Mexico and Southwest U.S.). Maybe its their Jewish neshama that brings thousands of Iranians to listen to Israel's programming in Farsi. But for sure, you got this Ashkenazi Jew interested in finding out more!
17. Respect for Ancient Hebrew Scholars in Babylon
Rivka Sterling ,   Nashville, TN, USA   (01.09.07)
From an outsider student's view, it seems that the Babylonian scholars are not as respected as those in Jamnia, without objective evidence. Priorities aren't correct for what I see in modern day 'thinkers', either. I can only judge by their actions - which dishearten me to see how willing they are to trade away land that is our sacred covenant - NOT up for grabs to the biggest bully.
18. Victims!
Jamal K. Aboud ,   Ramallah   (01.09.07)
It has been trend that some, dare I say so many, Jews always seeks to show themsleves as victims in order to gain some support derived from guilt from the gentile world. I just keep wondering when the Jews will stop using this as a way of life. Palestinians, my great people, learnt the lesson so well and decided to play active palyers in shaping history rather vbeing ictims of failed and unjust world order. It is the time that you learn from our story and struggle.
19. Why this article?
Michael U ,   SF,CA   (01.10.07)
What is the purpose of this article? Is it to divide the Jewish people into camps? This is the definition of Baseless Hatred, which caused the destruction of the Second Temple. When will the B'ne Yisroel learn? When will we merit the coming of Moshiach? With continued hatred like this it will be a long, long time before we see the redemption. I have rebuked Ynetnews.com on repeated occasions, yet they continue putting out these hateful diatribes. I am Ashkenazi, my family survived the pogroms of Ukraine, and our tradition is just as valid as any other Jewish tradition. We don't have a negative view of Sepharidim, it seems that the Sephardim are the ones who seek to belittle and harass the Ashkenaz. When I used the word Shabbos in a post a couple weeks ago, a Sephard was rude and uncaring as to my Jewish neshama. I have never seen such division and hatred from a fellow Jew. Please, Sephardim, calm your hatred and think before you speak. Also, don't blame the Ashkenazi for your own family problems. This is not a Jewish thing to do.
20. Let's educate ourselves
Haim Ovadia ,   Los Angeles, CA, USA   (01.10.07)
It's about time we acknowledge the huge gap in Jewish education in Israel and abroad. we should approach this problem not from a standpoint of bitterness but from one of pride and strength. After all, 90% of the Jewish bookshelf was written by Mediterranean and sephardic Jews or as a commentary ontheir works. It's OK to read Bialik (who by the way said that he doesn't like the Arabs because they remind him the Sephardim) but what about all the great Sephardic poets of antiquity and modern times? We should advocate Sephardic curriculum in Jewish schools, starting in America, then let us hope it catches on in Israel.
21. Response to the two San Franciscans
Noam ,   Boca Raton, FL   (01.11.07)
"I find this article and topic inappropriate at the time when Iran is uniting the world against us and stating that Israel is weakening. Jews, we're one!" -Halili isn't trying to divide Am Yisrael, he's trying to include the historical and cultural experiences of one part of the nation into education curriculum, so as to better reflect the diversity and vibrancy of us. Michael, I am sorry that a Sephardi rudely denounced your way of pronouncing what I call Shabbat. Halili is far from advocating Sin'at Hinam. He is lamenting that a secular Jewish education curriculum so bent on including other cultural perspectives, including Palestinian ones (Which I have no problem with) ignores the histories and backgrounds of 50% plus of Israel's Jews. He wants us better understanding of ourselves, our histories, how all these Jews from different countries returned home and how they are all contributing to an invogorating blossoming Israeli Jewish culture and society.
22. No. 19, Michael
NYC Girl   (01.11.07)
While you may not personally have a negative view of Sephardim, I don't think it can be denied that certainly, in the past, non-Ashkenazi Israelis were discriminated against in a variety of ways. And it may even be safe to assume that some of what you describe as "hatred" from some Sephardim, is in part a response to the bigotry they were subjected to, more so than it is a deliberate belittling and harassment of Ashkenazim. Also, when you say "don't blame the Ashkenazi Jews for your own family problems," you're overlooking the fact that many of these Sephardic families were kept down by the Ashkenazi establishment and the lack of opportunity they suffered was often a contributory factor to their family problems, which is not to say there weren't also certain cultural aspects to the problem that had to do with the fact that they had absorbed much of the Arab culture with its patriarchal system and its inequitable treatment of women. But, the fact is there's enough blame to go around and, hopefully, things have now changed to a great degree. However, that doesn't mean we should be blind to the historical realities.
23. History Lesson
Jay ,   Los Angeles   (01.15.07)
Thank you for your article. My wife, also, came from Crypto-Jews, but from Spain. She was born in Guadalajara, Mexico. She imbraces her Judaism differently that I do. I'm an L.A. Ashkinazi and kind of take my Judaism for granted. She, on the other hand, holds her Judaism as Precious and Sacred. It was something she had to keep secret and hidden, and for that reason, closer to her heart.
24. Non-ashkenazic Protagonists
Gosia ,   Holland   (01.23.07)
I have found on wikipedia that the first ever woman rabbi was appointed in 15th or 16th century in the territories of contemporary Kurdistan. Correct me if I am wrong.
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