Opinion
The Saudi conspiracy
Shaul Rosenfeld
Published: 04.04.07, 22:13
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
47 Talkbacks for this article
1. Israelis Fear Peace and Lust for Land
Fred Farkelsteinman ,   NY, NY USA   (04.04.07)
Israel has a golden opportunity to make peace with its neighbors, yet it finds only excuses why it cannot happen. I believe there can be compromise in the Arab plan if Israel withdraws fully from all land seized in 1967 in return for the Palestinians moving into the former Jewish only settlements in lieu of their right of return. I cannot see Israel being allowed to keep the occupied land just because the tried to create facts on the ground by transferring Israeli civilians onto land it held under belligerent occupation, and I don't see moving refugees back into Israel proper as a good thing either, so compromise where both give up something is fair, equitable and doable. Give peace a chance.
2. Note to Fred from NY
Reality Check ,   BaGolan   (04.04.07)
You say that we fear peace in our lust for land. You obviously have not read anything about the Saudi proposal or its ramifications, other than the Saudi spin: it calls for all land as defined by the Saudis, not anyone else; allowing Palestinians who VOLUNTARILY ran at the behest of their Arab 'brethren'; and it calls for a pali stae IN ADDITION to the palis taking over the Jewish State. What you also fail to read, in your condemning us for not compromising, is the simple comment made by the Saudis every day - "THERE WILL BE NO COMPROMISE." The Saudis have made it clear that we accept their "peace initiative" intact without any room for compromise, or it is not acceptable to them. This is a golden opportunity - for us to commit suicide - which is obviously what you and your kind prefer!
3. Olmert/Livni/Peretz Will Destroy Israel
Jerry ,   NYC, USA   (04.04.07)
if they are allowed to stay in power. Their lust for power is far more important to them than the nation of Israel. They are selling you out to stay in power. Save yourselves before it is too late, bring this government down.
4. Why would he become COMPETENT all of a sudden?
sergio ,   Israel   (04.04.07)
Why would he become COMPETENT all of a sudden? OLMERT IS DANGEROUS TO ISRAEL!
5. #1 - This is how it works...
Peter ,   Las Vegas, USA   (04.04.07)
When a country (or many in this case) attack a country (1967) this is a war. If the country that is attacked overpowers the aggressors, the country that was attacked WINS. Winner take all. This isn't a board game where one person wins and the other side says "OK, my mistake, lets try again". Aggressors should think before they attack, they didn't in 1967 so they need to deal with it. "Right to return" was lost along with the war instigated by several cowardly countries that had neither the power or wits to carry out their mission of hate. For someone to live in squalor and utter filth while their elected leaders choose to spend aid on weapons instead of food/aid/infrastructure shows a complete lack of inner drive. You can only be a "refugee" for so long...50 years and still whining and begging without trying to progress is BEYOND belief...it is insanity.
6. #2 Reality Check needs realtiy check
Fred Farkelsteinman ,   NY, NY USA   (04.05.07)
First off, some facts: 1. Under UNSCR 242, all land occupied in 1967 by Israel was to be returned in lieu of peace, which is what will happen if Israel accepts the plan 2. The civilians who fled during the war in 1948 (the reason why matters not one bit) were forcibly denied their right of return by Israel, which was illegal as well as immoral. That said, those who believe as you do have been the root of the problem for many years, so full of hate and bigotry that you have passed up many opportunities to live in peace simply due to your lust for plundered land. The initiative already has wording that calls for a "just solution to the issue of Palestinian refugees" which means there is room for compromise and thus peace. Peace and security is what Israel has always said it wanted, and now it has a chance to achieve it.
7. BRAVO # 2--# 1, get your facts straight...
The Watchman777 ,   USA   (04.05.07)
ALL of the land that Israel NOW occupies is HERS and her's ALONE. The Pa's ARE squatters and do NOT belong there. NO, Israel should NOT give back any land from the 67 war. By BIRTH RITE from the God of Abraham, Israel should occupy 5 times the amount of land it NOW has and the only reason it doesn't is because she was scattered by barbarians who hated her and remained broken up for centuries until she regained her RIGHTFULL place in 1948. Her elected officials along with my country will face the wrath of ALMIGHTY God for dividing up the land AND especially J-salem. May HE have mercy on their souls!
8. Olmert's LAst Stand
Malcolm   (04.05.07)
9. # 5: US and EU create israel.
papa jay   (04.05.07)
reading your post one might think that israel won all these wars on it's own. with out any help. israel didnt do it on it's own, thanks to the US and EU that made israel happen. now the US and EU are saying u must compromise you must make peace, and Israel must listen. dont ever forgot how you came to exist. winner takes all??? i know your in Vegas but this is not a card game.
10. #5 Stick to Gambling Peter, You're Clueless
Fred Farkelsteinman ,   NY, NY USA   (04.05.07)
First off, your knowledge of history is severely lacking, as the refugees are not from the 1967 war, but that of 1948. Secondly, the right of return for civilians during war is guaranteed under international law and affirmed in UN 194. Also, if you say Israel conquered the West Bank and Gaza during 1967 (which Israel started BTW) then all those living within the conquered lands should have been granted Israeli citizenship and Israel should have annexed and assumed sovereignty over all lands it captured, but they did not .... I wonder why? (Google ethnic cleansing) Lastly, nobody, not the US and not the United Nations recognizes Israel's claim to the West Bank or East Jerusalem as it is both a violation of International laws and the UN Charter as mentioned in UNSCR 242. So those fact, which I'm sure will get your panties in a twist, outweigh your uninformed and bigoted opinion from Sin City. Give peace a chance.
11. auschwitz
zichron   (04.05.07)
a completely inappropriate comparison .
12. saudi plan
george ,   canada   (04.05.07)
It is good for Israel to sit with arabs to talk about anything and everything. But Olmert will cave in to US or arab pressure cause he does not have willpower based on firm conviction.He wilts under pressure.Its a dangerous situation for Israel.
13. Reject the Oppressive Saudi Kind and his Wahhabi Creators
BIP   (04.05.07)
Olmert must repeat everyday that Kind Abdallah is the worst fate Saudi people can have. Israel should proudly reject oppressors like that. It would win the sympathy of the whole Arab world for an Israeli prime minister
14. #7
sydney volkenstein ,   heidleberg germany   (04.05.07)
people like the watchman are responsible for the increase in global anti-semitism.
15. #2 Reality Check - You're right!
Carl ,   Indiana, USA   (04.05.07)
What lust for land is the other guy talking about. Israel is the one that was attacked, every time!
16. just a realistic PM
FR ,   Lobnan   (04.05.07)
with the US is getting ready to declare No victory in Iraq ..and the summer Humiliation of the IDF by some part time libaneese fighters .. i think he is just a realitic gentelman .. all isrealis pm turns left when they hold office .. comments...
17. Sad story of Fred Farkelstienman
Michael U ,   SF,CA   (04.05.07)
It is sad to read a post by someone so deluded that they believe the words of those who have lied and lied and lied. I dont believe a single word the Saudis say, they are not friends of the USA nor friends of Israel. The Saudis are the source of a good deal of terrorism. This Fred character buys their propaganda hook line and sinker. Maybe Fred is a child and has no experience in the world. I have had experience and seen the Arab peace proposals come and go, and each time the Arabs have lied to us. One thing I believe, they want to destroy Israel, and destroy all the Jews. If they want peace, they will accept the peace plan presented to them. These people have been creating problems in the Jewish state. They have places to go. They should move back to where they came from and allow peace. They lost the war they started, and they cry about it. I have no sympathy for people like this. If you want peace, create it.. Dont kill innocent people...
18. Fred Farkelstenman, American's lust for plundered land?
Allen   (04.05.07)
Fred, are you a property owner? Will you give up your occupied land (aren't you an illegal occupier?) to the Native Americans from whom your ancestors plundered, illegally settled and took by shear theft and by force; they literally stole Indian traditional lands? Wonder if Mr. Bush will give his Crawford, Texas ranch to the Mexicans. Essentially, American settlers squatted on Mexican lands and then took the land by force of arms (Polk declared war on Mexico because of Manifest Destiny and degenerate American lust and greed), later paying Mexico a pittance. How 'bout it Fred? What do you think of white European plunder and theft of Indian lands? What about the 1830 Indian Removal Act, the Trail of Tears, the pluder of the Cherokee nation, etc. Don't these injustices need to be addressed by you and by your land-hungry ancestors?
19. Time for Fred to wake up and stop the propoganda
Reality check ,   BaGolan   (04.05.07)
First off, some facts: 1. UNSCR calls on the parties to negotiate the land. Read the Resolution before you spew the Arab line. READ!!! 2. The civilians that left did so of their own volition. The reason they did so DOES matter. Maybe they should ask Egypt or jordan for compensation for forcing them out - and then REFUSING to let them have Gaza and the West Bank back. They're not 'returning' to Gaza and the west Bank was not an Israeli decision but decided by Nasser and the Hashemite Kingdom. That said, those that believe as I do will always place our security before surrender and capitulation. Peace is what we want. The Saudi "peace initiative' is not a Road Map to peace but directions to the ovens of the 21st century for Jews.
20. 1 And Fred as someone in the USA, you
freedom ,   canada   (04.05.07)
know I have the right to tell you that you are 100 percent wrong. Give peace a chance, theres more than enough land to go around, no need to go back to false 1967 borders that were false in the first place.
21. 6 The British partition was done incorrectly
freedom ,   canada   (04.05.07)
to start, your point is invalid.
22. # 1 is on the payroll
ay_lamb ,   USA   (04.05.07)
I am pretty sure that #1 is on the payroll. He sounds like a US statey to me or maybe even deeper.
23. Israel's land is everlasting
Brod ,   USA   (04.05.07)
Israel's GOD-given land should not and must not be given away to the dark forces. Doing so will be counterproductive to GOD's protection over Israel and the interests of the growing Jewish population. Never give away your land. The Arabs already occupied vast swath of land. They can take care of their own people without having to usurp and occupy Israel's land. Arab peace is the destruction of Israel. Hence, don't be deceived by the Arab 'peace'. Their 'peace' means jihadizing other countries and nations.
24. to #1,Fred Fartingman
freejay ,   Israel   (04.05.07)
Are you stupid or just plainly hate Israel? What happened when Israel removed the settlements and gave the barbarians Gazza????? Suicide bombers and Rockets that have been fired just about every single day since we gave them an opertunity for peace, is all that we got in return. Use that little bit of grey matter you have left in your brain to work it out.
25. Shaul, I feel your pain, but...
Persian CAT ,   Middle-o-Nowhere   (04.05.07)
You must have been very young during the last war when Israel was a "victor" - judging from you pictue. That was a loooooong time ago and you guys almost lost it - if it were not for the generous help from others including Iran. I know your kind is very nervous because your wriggling room is getting smaller by the day - no wonder you and Bibi hate Oslo because that might have brought the region some peace and security - something you, Bibi and Leiberman HATE to see (heck you guys may be out of a job if peace happens). But listen carefully to what that rich Arab chief is saying. It's either peace or war! Based on the performance of the Israeli military during the fight they started with the Hezb, I can tell you for sure the you guys are not going to be the "victors". Two reasons. Israel has exhausted the reservoir of goodwill that the American people (not the politicians) and had twards it. Second, you right wingers have scuttled EVEY opportunity for paece during the last 30 years in order to keep the land you occupied since the war. Finally, those Arabs that you defeated are gone. The new generation of Arabs are not as corrupt and incompetent as their parents and Iran is NOT on your side any more. Think about it. Olmert is not a peacenik but he has seen something that you obviously are not capable of seeing. Those Isaelis who used to win wars are gone too. You guys like to play the stock market, launder money and yak to your moms on your cell phones before going to the "front". Get the picture?
26. So What Israel Want?????????????
1.5 Billion Muslims   (04.05.07)
Reality Check, world
27. From mistake to mistake
Marcel Abel ,   France   (04.05.07)
until destruction. NO to the Saudi death trap. "This is what the Sovereign Lord says: 'When I gather the people of Israel from the nations where they have been scattered, I will show myself holy among them in the sight of the nations. Then they will live in their own land, which I gave to my servant Jacob.'" ( Ezekiel 28:25) Who dares oppose the Lord's promise ?
28. # 14
Marcel Abel ,   France   (04.05.07)
And you, of course, are not responsible for anything !
29. The Chosen People
fahd najad alotaibi ,   Makka, KSA   (04.05.07)
Israelis donot stop amazing me , they deserve the prize of the most confused people in the world .They simply want to win 10/0 not 2/1 or 3/1 .It is their fate to be too smart for themselves, confusing startegy of peace with the tactics of incremental occupation.On one hand they want to blast the Saudis as corrupt, then you find the israelis more corrupt, they want the arabs to advnace peace proposals, they they reject them .Be serious before others call your bluff and it is too late, we are not far off.
30. saudi peace plan for Israel
chaim ,   miami beach usa   (04.05.07)
R I P is used on a tombstone after death. the Saudi,US, U N, EU, Hamas, Hizzboloah, Fata, all have tried for over 75 years to bring their version of Peace with Jews, guess what their version does not even allow the dead Jews the R I P they demand all vestages of Jewish existance to be removed from the ME including the dead, maybe they will compromise and allow the the dead to remain undisturbed even that I highly doubt, loot at what they did with the Jewish cemetary or Mt. of Olives when they held in during 1948-1967 and of course the world never even took any notice. Israel you must rember Olamrt has a wife, daughter and sons who are a die hard religious Jew hater and for him to go home and find some peace there he must destory Israel from being a Jewish State. Israel you choose that tratior you get rid of him befrore he destroys you and sets you history back to the time of the Romans, american and other Jews of the world will never support the destruction of Israeli Jewishness no matter how hard you try all you will accomplish is a new river Jewish of blood to rectify your perfifdy.
Next talkbacks
Back to article