Jewish Scene  Rivkah Lubitch
You're not Jewish anymore
Rivkah Lubitch
Published: 16.05.07, 15:42
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1. Feeeeeu that was a close call
Avi ,   Israel   (05.16.07)
Thank you rabbi for asking the question, you are so sharp, where woould we be without you We almost let this shiksa and her kids tfu tfu tfu live among us, I can't even think about that. She didn't do mitzvot? oi vey vey vey whatever next I am going now to read Tehilim Shalom
2. Good Lrd, the rabbinate....this
ben ,   singapore   (05.16.07)
Rachel did she converted to xtianity or hristianity ? I hope not .
3. No longer Jewish ?
leon ,   Grand Rapids USA   (05.16.07)
Theocracy !!!!!!
4. to #2
Jon ,   NY, NY   (05.16.07)
No, she do not. The rebbie believes that her convertions from 15 years ago is not valid. How sad.
5. politics not Halacha
mordy   (05.16.07)
I think it is pretty clear in Jewish law that "once a Jew-forever a Jew"principle applies. If a person had a sincere intent to keep Mitzvot at the time of the conversion, then she is Jewish, and her later observance is not relevant to her status UNLESS it could be shown (which I doubt it could) that conversion to begin with was under false pretenses. This seems to be the case of haredi judges trying to control conversion process and trying to de-legitimize Modern Orthodox conversions. We see it happen with failure to recognize American Orthodox conversions performed by RCA.
6. Did she convert according to Halacha ??
Harry   (05.16.07)
If it was done by an orthodox Rabbi She is Jewish however if he/she were not converted by an orthodox Rabbi He/She were never Jewish
7. I'm curious...
Wolf ,   Brooklyn, NY, USA   (05.16.07)
... what the questions and answers were that prompted the judge to issue this severe ruling. Was she not observing shabbos and the like, or was it that she just wasn't observing some chumra-of-the-month. I'd like to think the former.
8. Author Cast Aspersions Without Checking Facts
Reuven Brauner ,   Raanana, Israel   (05.16.07)
"Did the judge forget the Halacha ruling that states that a convert is a Jew in the full sense of the word? Where is the "love for the foreigner" Judaism prides itself in? Where are the compassion and morality?" 1. It is unlikely that a rabbinical judge "forgets" a Halacha, particularly like the one the author claims he forgot. 2. What does "love" have to do with it? If the convert has rejected observance of Torah over the years, it puts into question the sincerity of his/her conversion in the first place. Maybe he/she cleverly fooled the conversion court regarding his/her motives and commitment? 3. Are you accusing our rabbinical courts of lacking compassion and morality? Are you aware of the Torah prohibitions you have just violated by publicly casting such vile aspertions on rabbinical judges?
9. Ruling against Halacha but more info needed
Besalel ,   Kew Gardens, NY   (05.16.07)
The Halacha is very very clear that if a person decides to convert and accept the Torah and Mitzvoth he is a Jew even if he later strays off the path. How can the Rav in question know that the woman did not, in fact, accept the Mitzvoth for even one minute? Nonetheless, I don't know what the whole story is but I know we aren't getting the whole story. Why on Earth will the husband be delcared a non-Jew? What is really going on here? Too bad Ynet has a tendency to bring opinions in the form of half-stories.
10. i was born a jew from both parents
(05.16.07)
and i dont do that much miztvot. not really very observant. am i still jewish? will they let me into Israel?
11. Hey, she's not an aguna!
Aviva ,   Jerusalem, Israel   (05.16.07)
She got the divorce. Stop complaining. And buy yourself a new hat.
12. Something fishy going on
Kyle ,   Southpark, CO, USA   (05.16.07)
Fake conversions happen all the time, but revoking conversions is a rare thing. The last time I can recall a conversion being revoked was back in the '70's in which Rabbi Goren (Chief Rabbi at the time) retroactively invalidated a man's conversion so that a woman's first marriage could be declared null and void and her children by a second marriage (sans get) be declared not mamzerim. He was applauded by seculars for his creative halachic decision. No one paid attention to the man who was stripped of his Judaism. I would like to hear Beit Din's side of this story--something is not being reported. I am now suspicious of Mrs. Lubitsch's claim to being a "pleader." Wouldn't publishing this kind of nasty article in a hostile venue such as YNet compromise her position with Beit Din? I suspect that she is another fraud like Tali Farsquash. It is also possible that this story is completely bogus, this would not be the first time that secular Israeli media has made up a "haredi atrocity." YNet will probably censor this talkback.
13. halachically, she is Jewish
Wendy in chicago   (05.16.07)
Halacha states that if a convert has a halachic conversion, but in the future stops obsering mitzvot, s/he will be judged as any other Jew who fails to observe the mitzvot. Follow your own laws, runaway Rabbinate!
14. You Never were Jewish
Steven ,   Jerusalem   (05.16.07)
Rivka. One of the prerequisites of conversion is acceptance of the Torah. Sadly, thousands of converts are simply not Jewish because they never converted properly. What's so difficult to understand?
15. the more the merrier.....no. 1.....
d ,   centre   (05.16.07)
don't you understand, you silly little man, that every person who wants to be a jew should become one without question....think alittle bit further than your teffilin.
16. It is not a ruling by a judge...
gedaliah   (05.16.07)
There are laws in Judaism. If the conversion was not kosher then it wasn't sucessful. Where is the problem? Any person with an issue with this has an issue with Jewish Law. Do not go after this rabbi, go after Judaism and G-d.
17. and we think the High Court is bad?
mother of four ,   Israel   (05.16.07)
This incompetent judge should be thrown off the bench and all his judgements which have caused suffering sent to appeal - at his expense. He is a disgrace to Judaism and Jews of all denominations
18. re:You're not Jewish anymore
Rabbi Yosef ,   Jerusalem,Israel   (05.16.07)
If this story is true than the rabbi at the bet din is a raving lunatic and should be thrown off the bet din and sent to live in a deserted desert town in the negev.
19. #12
joe ,   sheffield.u.k   (05.16.07)
well,you see you weren't censored;but there's certainly some distressing comments in what you say;no doubt you belong to the school of censorship and would have censored the article;long live free speech.
20. Dont know what to say
David ,   PARIS FRANCE   (05.16.07)
It will be very interesting to hear about the Dayan who took this decition. It smells like there s something behind doors.
21. Conversion anarchy
Michael ,   Jefferson, GA USA   (05.16.07)
It would be a lot better if rabbis could decide on some of this conversion process and put the ambiguity behind us. How can we follow hallacha when the rabbis can't even decide what it is? There are less Jews in the world every day while the rabbis make more trouble every day. Make up your minds and stick to your decisions! No wonder the rank and file Israeli is disgusted with the rabbinut!
22. When those Rabbinical Judges will be judged,
God ,   Heaven   (05.16.07)
I'll tell them that in My eyes they stopped being Jewish on the day they made this judgment.
23. Truth
allen ,   israel   (05.16.07)
How about telling the the truth i mean the whole truth WHY the rabbi did what he did and not try to portray the rabbis as something stupid I cant believe that you act and talk this way as a rabbinical pleader !
24. the nerve of those Rabbis
rpc ,   modiin, Israel   (05.16.07)
and we think the Knesset is filled with power hungry thieves... the Rabbanut is the worst! I thought excommunication was for the goyim?
25. to number 15
(05.16.07)
try to read post number 1 with a tongue in cheek, you know, pulling the leg
26. This family is Jewish
David ,   Los Angeles, CA   (05.16.07)
If this woman and her children have lived their lives as Jews and consider themselves to be Jewish then that is what they are no matter what some bigoted rabbi says. There are people who are born Jewish and do a lot less. These people are definitely Jewish.
27. Jew or not a Jew
Hilda ,   USA   (05.16.07)
G-d help us all from such fanatic perversions. Thank G-d I was born a Jew, of a Jewish mother and father else this self appointed moniter of mitzvot might dispute my Judaism because I do not wear shetel and I ride to shul because I am unable to walk.. Then again he might put me in cherim Oh dear.
28. Now they play God himself????
Scooby ,   Ramat Gan   (05.16.07)
If the facts of the writer are correct then these 'so called' judge /rabbis should be severely reprimanded. Just who do they think they are??? After fifteen years? I hope that my taxes are not going to subsidize any of them in any way - seeing as they don't work and only have time to tell people they aren't Jewish!. Allah must be laughing his head off.
29. Brauner's slavish support....
Andy ,   ramat hasharon   (05.16.07)
with NO facts as to whether this decision from this judge was arbitrary. Aspertions are the only response to such a ludicrous, unfair ruling that on its face lacks compassion or morality.
30. switched at Sinai
avramele   (05.16.07)
you live your whole life as a Jew; you speak Hebrew, you've cast your fate with the Jewish people in their own land... you will prepare yourself for the ultimate sacrifice as a member of the IDF...Jewish? I think so! You do not recognize the legitimacy of Zionism, you prefer a language that is a close cousin of middle german, you dress like 17th century Polish nobility and your gastronomic tastes mirror that of a Ukranian peasant.;you will not serve in the IDF.... Jewish? mmmm, which of these two souls stood shoulder to shoulder with amcha at sinai and which wanders in a desert of idiocy?
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