Opinion
Taking lead on Darfur
Shlomo Avinery
Published: 18.05.07, 00:35
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23 Talkbacks for this article
1. so they are PR tools, ahhhhh
izzy d   (05.18.07)
2. saving lives
habakook   (05.18.07)
surely psychological and neuroscientific tests could determine who are goodly people and who a psychopaths .
3. international message
Richard- Goj ,   Holland   (05.18.07)
Many of the roots of the Darfur genocide reside in Islamic jihad. Israel has enough problems with jihad. Nevertheless Minister Tzipi Livni 's decision was a wise one. The message is that Israel is not indifferent.
4. Darfur/Vietnam not a valid comparison
elan ,   toronto   (05.18.07)
THe people of Darfur are muslims, whereas the Vietnamese who came to Israel either assimilated largely into Israel or moved to the US/EU. There are thousands of Sudanese in Gaza - largely as second/third wives etc, and adding to their number, Israel would find that their guests of today will become your children's enemies, as invariably they will not be thankful to their jewish hosts, and will join your arab adversaries, both inside Israel and outside. Any refugee in Israel from Darfur should be resettled in an arab/muslim country
5. Elephant in Living Room: Muslims or Christians?
sk ,   USA   (05.18.07)
Why did the author not provide this information? The Vietnamese that Begin allowed in were not Muslim, and Israel has had nothing but savage ingratitude from Muslim immigrants. I say that I wouldn't spend one cent to save Muslims unless I had a very, very good reason--and charity isn't one of them.
6. Darfur travel agency: Pick your dream home, Israel, U.S, EU
Doron Katz ,   Sydney, Australia   (05.18.07)
I dont think so, they go where the UN says they go, not to Israel, to Egypt or nearby African states, they dont choose the most prosperous countries. Its not Israels problem,
7. Is Israel the only country in the world?
Kyle ,   Southpark, CO, USA   (05.18.07)
All these people who have suddenly opened a Chumash for the first time in their lives and are pompously lecturing about "loving the stranger" are the very same people who are filled with seething, ferocious, poisonous, shrieking, crazed, irrational hatred towards the religious segment of the Israeli population. The same people who want to welcome Sudanese with open arms (except just not in the posh Tel Aviv neighborhoods) would also like to expel entire communities of Jews from their homes. I also just looked at a map of the M.E. and I see that Israel is bordered by five countries (Egypt, Lebanon, Jordan, Syria, PA), none of which is Sudan, which means that in order for the Sudanese to get here, they had to pass through one of these five countries. So the question is, why didn't any of these five countries offer them asylum and refuge? Because these countries are oppressive and tyrannical? And yet Israel should surrender land and make "peace deals" with countries that are so oppressive and tyrannical they can't absorb a few Sudanese?
8. I think we should let them in
Israeli ,   Israel   (05.18.07)
even if they're muslims, we need to let them in. after all, we were just like them about 60 years ago... poor people.
9. Stop worrying about starngers..take care of your own!
Al   (05.18.07)
10. #5 Go take your pills first, then talk about saving others
Sam ,   Florida, US   (05.18.07)
No one Muslim or none Muslime will ask someone sick like you to save him , someone like you should be treated in the hospital first and then barely will be allowed to walk in the street,
11. #7 - apples and oranges.....
Andy ,   ramat hasharon   (05.18.07)
Taking in refugees to live in Israel and territorial compromise are two difference issues.
12. Sam, Florida (10)
sk ,   USA   (05.18.07)
Oh, so now an unwillingness to offer charity (and to a group of people who seem unable to assimilate peacefully) is a mental disease requiring pharmicotherapy and institutionalization? I think you are the one with a mental problem (and a moral one, because nothing good will come of this gambit). I used to think in "universal human rights terms" until Muslims showed me the error of my ways.
13. #11 Two parts of the same issue
Kyle ,   Southpark, CO, USA   (05.18.07)
"Taking in refugees to live in Israel and territorial compromise are two difference issues." Israel is one of the smallest countries in the world and HAS NO ROOM FOR EVERYBODY'S REFUGEES FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD. Look at a freaking map before you mouth off. Israel made its own citizens refugees and they are still living in trailer parks, meanwhile the "territorial compromise" of giving away their communities HAS RESULTED IN...QASSAMS AND ANARCHY not peace and rainbows. Are you one of those retards who still believes that giving away more and more territory will achieve something positive?
14. Take them in and use money to feed and
jason white ,   afula,israel   (05.18.07)
care for them. It is not like they need money for shelters in Sderot. Or the North.Or better equipment for the soldiers. Or for education here. Or road safety. Let us take in every refugee in the world.We can afford it,we have unlimited funds and land.
15. Give them asylum!?
Joe ,   Ohio, USA   (05.18.07)
Set up refugee camps on the border, arm and train the men send the kids to a school and train the women to work, and tell them that if you want your freedom FIGHT for it! By god that is what I've done all my life. I'm tired of these people running from the problems they face and taking the easy road to safety. Life is worth fighting for and living give them their chance there and support them anyway possible.
16. #12 Don't lie on yourself and others
Sam ,   Florida, US   (05.19.07)
Logically, if you reach the point to classify huge portion of human being (1.3 bln Muslims) as bad ot good ,then you are racist and full of hatred, in this moment you are a hater of Muslims, tomorrow you will be against the black, and at one point you will be full of hatred of Jewish even if you are a Jew. So, how many Muslims did you deal with in your life? or you just follow Glen Beck and Bill Orielly and you become expert in Muslims thinking? I can use your logic to say the Jewish people did everything to corrupt the humanity and always caused problems and they deserve to be executed and isolated? this is your logic,,, and I am using it here .. do you mind? Racism shows as a hatred of one group or class of people, but usually it is deeper than that.
17. The accusation of racism does not hold
Tracy W   (05.19.07)
ALL countries have set limits to the numbers of refugees they accept, and the conditions under which they are received. ALL countries. What is racist is to accuse ONLY ISRAEL of not taking in the thousands of Darfur refugees that need a home. Why aren't these same talkbackers addressing the Muslim countries, the African countries, and their own Western countries, for their failure to stop the genocide and for not taking in refugees. And for even attacking the refugees, as they did in Egypt. Why the silence?
18. Sam (#16): a hopeless prisoner of ideology.
sk ,   USA   (05.19.07)
Sam, I assume you're Muslim? If so, I can see why you have an interest in belittling or smearing me. Regardless of your own religion, I happen to be Jewish and American, and I see no reason to undermine democracy by bringing in those who (as they have in UK) demand sharia, blow up trains, regularly riot based on instructions from afar, and, as in Minneapolis Airport, can't even manage to be decent taxi drivers, but insist that one cannot ride a taxi with a seeing eye dog or with packaged liquor. It does not matter that MOST Muslims will not be active terrorists. It only matters that SOME significant proportion WILL BE, and that a much larger proportion will support the terrorists. The problem is ISLAM, which makes potentially decent people into troublemakers of one kind or another. How many Muslims have I dealt with in my life? More than "a few"; fewer than "many." Unless these Muslims were "Palestinians" (almost all of whom are stinkers), most have been ok. The issue, though, is not "most" but a nontrivial minority. Your blather about "racism" is just a ploy. First, though, I think there are much worse things than racism. For example, robbing people or killing them, for whatever reason. Racism is of concern in democratic countries (e.g. the US) where some people (e.g. blacks) couldn't vote. "Racism" is a joke when applied by a totalitarian, because in that regime, NOBODY has ANY rights except the leadership. Second, Muslims are not a "race" at all. Islam is a religion that people have opted into (or not opted out of). If Muslims want charity, let them convert to Christianity or Judaism, rather than continue to identify themselves with those who mutilate women's genitalia, lop off heads and hands, and bomb pizzerias. Third, my logic cannot be applied to blacks or Jews. Neither blacks nor Jews work to undermine democracies, demand a non-Western legal system for themselves that turns non-Muslims into dhimmis, and so forth. Fourth (and related), no you cannot say that Jews "corrupted humanity," because we have, as an empirical matter, enriched it to an unprecedented degree, and we continue to do so. And, it is just evil for you to insinuate that I believe that Muslims "deserve to be executed and isolated." No, I do not. I simply say that I am, personally, unwilling to come to their defense in the general case purely out of charitable considerations. If I happen to know someone who is Muslim, and he's a good fellow and not, in my view, a prototerrorist, then of course the situation is different. Sam, you think in catchphrases. Why don't you try a more nuanced style of thinking?
19. simple solution
simple simon   (05.20.07)
Just distribute those muslim refugees from Darfur to other muslim countries. Very good candidates include Indonesia, Malaysia, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Turkmenistan, Kazakhstan and many more. We do not mind paying their fares. Muslim countries are considered paradise on earth according to muslims, ours is Dar al-harb (war). To the likes of Sam (florida), you accused SK of being racist, kindly tell us how does islam (an ideology) turn into a race? Simply put, muslim is a race?
20. Well said (end)
rh ,   Ashdod   (05.20.07)
21. 1.000 Sudanese refugees accepted
Ran ,   Israel   (05.21.07)
Dear Shlomo, I agree that Darfurians should be accepted as refugees in Israel. The burden of caring for them should be shared internationally, as well as here. However, we need to stay realistic: for example, 2/3 s of the Sudanese in Israeli detention today are not from Darfur, but from the south, where the war is over and they have left Egypt because they are no longer refugees. As far as the rest, yes, criteria should be determined, also guarantees that neighboring countries will burden share and not 'dump their Sudanese in Israel', like Egypt is very willing to do. If Egypt would not accept back those that already were accepted as refugees in Egypt before they moved on to Israel, your 1.000 Sudanese will attract another 10.000 from Egypt in no time, and Israel will be unable to return them to there in an agreement of 'burden sharing'. Ran
22. Gaza refugees first...
Dina ,   USA   (05.25.07)
Israel should...Israel should...Israel should??? How about...Israel should find homes and jobs for everyone who was left homeless after the disengagement from Gaza? THEN start worrying about helping other refugees!
23. you better make sure they are Jewish refugees...
Rebecca Kmet ,   California   (06.07.07)
because I have learned how much most Christians and most Moslems hate Jews. Israel does not need any more problems.
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