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Long trail of anti-Semitism in Europe, ministers say
Ronny Sofer
Published: 03.06.07, 11:39
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61. #20 Brian, Judaism is a religion, being Jewish is ethnic
AK   (06.04.07)
You deny the Jews, who are a recognizable ethnic and cultural group, just like, let's say Norwegians, to their own country. Why? BTW, never in my life have i met an self-admitting anti-semite, just a lot of folks with all sorts of off the wall grievances against those Jews.
62. #25 Chris, you hypocrite, are boycotting Saudi oil?
AK   (06.04.07)
63. #36 Good, that boat (EU) is sinking fast.
AK   (06.04.07)
64. #57, now you must be a wind-up merchant
Danny   (06.04.07)
Daily Mail supported Nazis until late 40s? What so after the second world war ended? Islam no threat to the UK? What the 7/7 bombers were buddists? I think you should maybe do a little less "scrutinising"...
65. #57: you call it "paranoia"...
The Doc ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.04.07)
I call it "being ready" and "staying informed"... BBC is so "subtle" in promoting the Right that it actually promotes the Left! Thanks for putting my suspicions to rest. I don't know on which "independant observations" you're basing your "facts" but my sources show a quite different story. You may want to check http://www.bbcwatch.co.uk for a change, or you might claim that they are also part of a secret "promote the Right group" formed by Rightists disguised as Socialist unions and Muslims. You see Brian, I have been born in a communist country and I KNOW your methods all too well. I also know the West more than you credit me for. The twisted logic and double-talk you exhibit here with such an artsy demagogy does not work. And I dig that by saying "the Left wants peace" you imply that the Right (and Israel) do not. You totally ignore teh fact that Israel has been seeking Peace with its neighbors (who have attacked it forever) but instead it got more wars and terror. But as usual, nothing will please your kind except for a total dissapearance of Israel - the true spirit of the Islamo-Left has finally peeked through the skin. Well, now that is clear where we stand, I am even more resolved to "stay informed" despite your claims that I am "not informed". Sorry, your "information" and "sources" are either imaginary, Soviet-style brain-wash, or meant to seed disinformation in every possible forum - as you do now. It did not take too long to see your colours Brian, and judging by your shaky command of the English language, I wouldn''t be surprised if your actual colour is not even Red, but Green, your name Bshara rather than "Brian" and not hailing us from "Britain" but some God forsaken Muslim Paradise. Paranoid? Maybe, but better safe than sorry. Anyway, I bid you success in bringing Britain into the new Muslim era that you so much dream of (NOT)! And I definitely take your advice to "See more that the selected facts, see the bigger picture and scrutinise everything you hear." that's what I've been doing all along!
66. To #56: back in...WHAT?
The Doc ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.04.07)
Lamb, you should dumb down the rethoric so that us, mere mortals understand what a highly intelligent life form (Democraticus Americanus) tries to communicate to us. Maybe telepathy would work better (or mind contol). Ah! I got it! You want us to support the Democrats in the next election (or was it erection?)? Is that right? Ahem - considering what Carter has been writing about his noble deeds in the ME and his opinion and "facts" about Israel, and looking at the Clinton "high" Administration where everybody was having lots of fun under the table while US troops were losing in Somalia or having second thoughts in Afghanistan, and now looking at his (blind) "wife"'s utterances, your advice really finds an appreciating crowd. Yessir! Now just climb in a tree so that the stampede to the next Dem Conference does not kill you! Thanks for sharing!
67. USA not so tolerant to jews either.
Efi G ,   Washington DC   (06.04.07)
I see that some halfwits here are happy about Europe's problems. Is the USA so great and tolerant to jews? Is America the Goldene Medine? Surely not. Whats your point? Stop with the stupid anti Europe slander. You learned this trash from your friend Geor ge Bush.
68. Aliyah?
Laurence ,   Santa Ana, CA USA   (06.04.07)
Make Aliyah to the USA. Just a thought.
69. to #66 Back in what
AY_Lamb ,   USA   (06.04.07)
my sincerest apologies sir I didn't mean to be condescending or spout rhetorical nonsense but, I admit that I did. Anywho, :-( what can I say? That is what happens when I imbibe alcohol and then read/comment on the news. Sadly, antisemitism is growing in America and what the are the ramifications of that? It is anyones guess. I am in the US military and sadly I see it and feel it daily. I feel sometimes that time is running out and the widow of opportunity is closing because unfortunately there are many profiteers from fear mongering, discrimination, prejudice and violence. The whole situation can be summed up from a line in the movie Wall street when Mike Douglas's character tells a crowd that "Greed is good" "Greed works" many are seeing that "ethical behavior" may be outmoded, naive and unnecessary. Even I fully admit I can't see any real consequences and I do see the gains being achieved and I have to wonder. When someone counseled Hitler and suggested perhaps a different course that was more merciful, ethical and tolerant did he and his other advisers dismiss the notions of compassion and ethics as sentimental unscientific nonsense? In the board room and the briefing room courses of action are developed and recommendations formulated based on data collection and logical analysis to accomplish the overall stated goal. In the interest of self preservation one usually doesn't exceed those parameters. Dr. Rice and her husband often use the term anticipatory self defense in relation to the GWOT and maybe this concept originated in Israel? Who knows where they came up with it. Theodore Herzl's early career was one of a German Nationalist and patriot he was a member of the Burchenshaft society. Who knows maybe many of his contributions to German nationalism may have inadvertently contributed to the atmosphere of logic and reason over quaint and fanciful ethical behavior. I am rambling again I know and again I apologize and this election year in America is proving interesting no matter what I say and I think everyone can agree its outcome is a pivotal global event. I am hopeful for an independent run of Mayor Bloomberg and Sen Hagel. My own comfort level would increase with leaders that are a little more pragmatic and thoughtful but, my comfort level is about as relevant as a thimble full of Hamster vomit. Peace everyone and hopefully this rise in antisemitism and Islamophobia and just general perception that hate and contempt equal strength will fade quickly and be replaced with some other popular measure of strength.
70. Defamation
John Harby ,   San Diego, US   (06.04.07)
I think the power of this defamation stems from the secrecy of the WWII era. This has resulted from the generation gap, many of the old have not unveiled the truth to the young. We need to insure the whole truth is known so we can move on.
71. To #69 hmm, not convincing yet...
The Doc ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.04.07)
AYL, no ,not enough reasons to run and elect ANY of the Demos. I've seen their televised "contest", heard the mumblings of Hillary and laughed at the empty slogans of the rest. Empty deeds are sure to follow them just as in the past. Don't forget that Al Qaida is here courtesy of year of criminal neglect of Democratic Administration which failed to see it grow, failed to contain it and then made a fool of itself by failing at activating the military to stop it. If not so many lives have perished as a result, it would be a laughable matter - but itis not! Also we have to thank the Democrats for failing to see what a Mullahs' Iran can become. Now we all are faced with the specter of a Nuclear Winter. Well - THANK YOU DEMOCRATS for making our world a "safer" place! If you care to remember, as soon as he was elected, Bush Jr. declared that he will put less emphasize on the External Politics and concentrate internally instead. As a big thanks, he got 9/11. Until 9/11 US was an impotent paper doll, run by impotents busy with themselves and hoping that the problems will go away. Now at least, it showed the world that US has not lost all its virility and if and when attacked or threatened, it is prepared to fight for it . Sorry to say, but terror can not be fought with flowers and today if you turn the other cheek you may well find yourself with a knofe in your back. But being in the military as you claim, you must know this already. Islamophobia is a result of ... guess what... Muslims' actions. Trust is not given away - it is EARNED. So let's see some real proof that Muslims does not want to wipe out Israel off the map. Let's see real changes in the Palestinain Educational system - where Israel and Jews appear bearing ANY KIND of borders along a "Palestinian" State. Let's see the Palesinians put a stop to the Summer (boot) Camps for 3-4 year olds where they march up and down in military fatgues toting wooden weapon replicas. Let's see how the Muslims stop the hatred and incitement in Mosques everywhere. Now Sir, unfortunately I don't see that happening anytime soon. Instead of holding my breath I prefer holding a gun. It is less comfortable but at least I know that this time, we will not be slaughtered like in the "Illuminated" Europe of the thirties! As Thomas Paine said: "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it." I am porepared to fight for it - are YOU?
72. what is the meaning of semitism?
sameer ,   al quds   (06.04.07)
The semtism is not limited to jews, but it includes the arabs too, why only jew use this slogan to punish the EU for racism.
73. Anti-Semitism in Europe
John ,   Dundee, UK   (06.04.07)
I see very little anti-semitism in Europe but I see a lot of anti-jewishness and so long as jews align themselves with the deplorable acts of israel this will continue. As far as I know jews from Palestine are identical to Arabs from Palestine so to support Arabs at the expense of jews is hardly anti-semitic. Until people in israel and those jews in the UK and elsewhere who support them blindly get their heads round the fact this won't go away until israel changes its policies massively nothing will be solved. Israel doesn't have much time, as the IRA always used to tell us, "we only have to be lucky once and you have to be lucky all the time." I can't see things changing, the brick wall up ahead waits and neither israelis, jews abroad (safely out of the firing line), or anyone else are going to change their minds so something has to give and it must be israel in my opinion. Israel was founded on terrorism, Star of David hotel and the rest, and its whole foundation is under threat unless it can keep terror going, keep its citizens running scared, and so inevitably it must hit that wall. A two year old could predict the future if it carries on like this. No-one hates jews but they hate the fact so many jews seem to think they are above the law, ...... they aren't.
74. #72 the meaning of antisemitism and #71
AY_Lamb ,   USA   (06.04.07)
#72, Absolutely you are 100% correct antisemitism does indeed apply to Arabs as well however, I have learned many Arab scholars resist the use of this concept because they don't want affiliated with Jewish ethnicity, I use the term Islamaphobia instead. Either way both are irrational fears that impair dialog and decision making capacity. (The Doc) you had my attention momentarily but, honestly can you expect anyone to believe that nonsense and I think you can fabricate better. There is absolutely no tangible connection between Iraq and Al Qaida either now or during Saddam's reign. The 9/11 hijackers were Saudis. Abdulla Omar and the taliban are still operational and prolific. Most people in Western countries still don't understand the differences between Sunni and Shia Islam or know the difference between a turban or keffiyah. Conservative are intellectually unable to focus on the economy or civil matters they must look to external diplomatic and global interaction where mistakes can be shrouded and dismissed as linguistic problems or communication failures. The President had absolutely no intention of struggling with domestic issues. What this administration has done is inadvertently trigger a culture war and it is way to early to predict a victor. Due to the conservative mentality and shortsightedness things have been set into motion that none of us can possibly predict. I don't doubt your sincerity and I am sure you are eager to fight; all people constantly inundated with "fear and panic stimuli" are willing and eager to fight. The question is and remains; what exactly are you so willing to fight for? At the end of the day are you certain it is not for the continued prosperity and wealth of a privileged minority? Can you state the noble goal? Are Arabs and Jews not often criticized and condemned in the Romanized western world for their shared linguistic, cultural and societal similarities and characteristics? How many lives might have been saved and how many lives might yet be saved if we "the electorate" hold diplomats, bureaucrats, academics and merchants to the same standards we hold laborers to? A diplomat is paid well to hold constructive dialog to find middle ground to pursue peaceful conflict resolution but, can you honestly say any have put forth an honest effort and have done that? Should Iraqis be expected to abandon their culture and adopt the culture of the US? Well my friend through force of arms that is exactly what is happening and it is anyones guess or hope what the final outcome of that will be. I was always taught though that hope is not a course of action. Republican faith based foreign policy is a dismal failure and you should rethink you position on their continued leadership but, fear not most were wealthy before they assumed the power of office and I bet they will continue to be prosperous long after we the "electorate" remove them.
75. #74 - no, you're not there yet...
The Doc ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.04.07)
Spoken like a true Liberal Agitator - LOL! Yet another Islamo-Leftist unmasks himself. AYL - you are NOT with the US military any more than I am. You sound more like a pompous British "inteligenzia". You spread a lot of falsehoods like "Bush no intention of struggling with domestic issues" - well how do you know THAT? Just because he said teh exact opposite? Are you a mind reader? Are you part of a secret CIA telepathy program that is able to know what presidents think? Your claim would not pass any test of validity - but of course, despite the fancy wording your target is vast hordes of pimpled kids who believe every word a Liberal massiah cares to spit in their direction. AYL - we are not that crowd - take your show elsewhere. As for your claim that this admin has "inadvertently trigger a culture war " is absolutely rubbish too. Extremist Islam has flurished during the Demos' Admin, encouraged by a debilitated America - debilitated by Leftist Imbeciles bent on suicidal polical-correctness. Your mumblings about "privileged minority" and "what are you fighting for" exposes you all too well Mr. Lamb. You are nothing but a Leftist, Muslim or both with a hope that your venom in these forums will cloud the truth. Maybe you are more successful in the US or Britain or from wherever you're hailing, but in Israel is much, much harder to use Soviet or Muslim-type disinformation. That's actually why you hate us so much.
76. #73 - now this is a bloody convetion!
The Doc ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.04.07)
Hey "John", care to explain where you know all these "facts" and how you reached all your far reaching conclusions? Have you done this yourself or did you get some help from thye "Rightist" BBC or the friendly Mosque or from the "unbiased" Amnesty International reports? If yes, then you have passed the "brain-washing" test. I see that people like you multiply at an alarming rate. Fortunately, sooner or later you'll die of overpopulation and starvation, you know, like in the "foxes and rabbits" story? Anyway, it is encouraging to see how much people like you care about what's been happening around here, especially after Her Majesty's Mandate left it in disarray. Happily we do not need your approval or sympathy. We are growing apart as quickly as Britain is Islamized (did you notice that John?). And yes, you do sound like a "two year old" predicting the future. And don;t tell me "no one hates Jews". The fact that you take the time writing here tons of anti-Semitic nonsense gives you up. Why don't you find a different forum, preferably at an Al Qaeda or some Socialism-affiliated website. I am sure that there you will find a more helpful crowd.
77. #67: so? Does this clear Europe from anti-Semitism?
The Doc ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.04.07)
"Efi" - "US is not so tolerant of Jews..." is not reason enough to stop fighting anti-Semitism everywhere. And BTW - "not so tolerant": sounds to me "not so convincing". You know, it is difficult to quantify "tolerance" but if you insist, US is MUCH MORE tolerant than almost ANY AU country, and that's enough for me! I chalenge you now to prove me wrong, but do take the time. For any example I can bring you a counter-example so this may be a long argument - let's save the bandwidth and concentrate on the fact that suddenly this thread gains so much interest from abroad - everybody claiming that there is no anti-semitism while exposing themselves as rabid anti-Israeli (which is today's neo-anti-Semitism). Can you explain this? Can you explain why we see all the baseless lies and slogans parrotted here too? The foreign Leftist media - mostly European - does that on a daily basis repeating anti-Israeli lies without checking them, accepting them as "tryths" only because they come from Muslims against Jews? I'll tell you why: because they WANT to believe it. They WANT to perpetrate the injustice done to Jews for more than 2000. They want to hide their hideous past and "clean" themselves from the sins of their predecessors. They ally withj Muslims which were Hitler's best friends and they ally with Communists which have been trying to subverse the Western Democracies forever. They create unholy alliances with whomever is against Israel and Jews and for as long as there are Jews alive and prospering. Don't worry "John". We keep our eyes open for amti-Semites both in US and in EU. But now, the spot is on Britain. US for now is a dear friend that we need to stand by just as it's been standing by us, regardless of the reasons.
78. What a Farce
Pnina ,   Israel   (06.04.07)
The article drags on and on about how to counter the Jew-hate in Europe and ends with putting Tzippi Livni in charge of the action. That is a equivalent to losing in advance.
79. To all foreign posters: THANK YOU for the attention!
The Doc ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.04.07)
Yes, you heard right. It is so entertaining to see all these posts coming from abroad (or so they claim). Can you enlighten me as to the reasons of your posts? Is it because you care about Israel's and Jew's well-being? That's why you smear us and our country, ignoring the fact that the so called "occupied territories" have been lost by Arab countries as a result of their own aggression against Israel? That's why you do not care about OUR citizens being bombed by Hamas, and last year by Hezbollah, although we have enough UN resolutions backing us, to wipe your butts for centuries? No? Maybe you care for the "palestinian innocent citizens" more that any Muslim country care? That's why you blame Israel for all their failures and do not ask yourselves where all those taxpayer BILLIONS of Euros, $ and ILS have disappeared instead of building factories, universities and welfare for? That's why you ignore that the "palestinians" (former Jordanians and Egyptians if you care to check the modern history) have been forced NOT to work in Israel by constantly attacking the only hope they curently have - the border crossings into Israel? That's why you ignore the internal terror they suffer from having their rights, liberties and dreams crushed by bands of Muslim imbeciles, impotemt politicians, terrorist groups, foreign Muslim countries bent on Israel's destruction no matter what, and gangs of downright criminals? I guess that you don't care about them after all either... But why bother you with facts when your hatred towards Israel and Jews has been nurtured at your mother's bossom, at the local Mosque, Socialist Union or Neo-Nazi parade? You will always be here but so will we - serving you with a mirror to watch your ugly face, every time you dare to raise it from the ignorance, racist and hatred mud you so lovingly live in.
80. #79 and ugliness
English guy ,   London, UK   (06.04.07)
After your long tirade which shows that you have not one iota of self-awareness, perhaps now you will look in the mirror. The interest of "foreigners" in Israeli policies does not need to be justified. Your catch all statement to all the posters "your hatred towards Israel and Jews has been nurtured at your mother's bosom" is absolute and total nonsense and you know it. Do you expect people around the world to rejoice as you kill more Palestinians and expropriate more Palestinian land? This "hatred" is not hatred but the results of observation. We "foreigners" see injustice and you simply cannot bear the fact that Moslems are equal to Jews because in the small, racist, supremacist body politic of Israel, ever since it was founded, there has been an assumption that non-Jews are there under sufferance. It is almost the exact mirror image of what Jews went through in Romania, Russia, etc before 1939, and you should be delighted that citizens of the world are standing up for the underdog. In short, you, and your dear friends, will find it very difficult - except among the paranoid Moslem-baiting xenophobe circles around the BNP or the KKK, to find many people who will differentiate between a dead Palestinian child and a dead Israeli child. The difference is in your mind. One doesn't matter and one does. That is your downfall Mr Ugly Racist of Hafa.
81. Look what England did to the Cornish!!!
Geraint ,   Plymouth Cornwall   (06.04.07)
England are the biggest bunch of hypocrites. They actually practice apartheid with their refusal to include the Cornish under the framework for the protection of national minorities and to adhere to European law. The Israeli government should look into this. Google Cornish Stannary Parliament or http://www.kernowtgg.co.uk/ Get in contact with those activists. England needs to be punished for its hypocrisy.
82. #80 "English guy" Ha ha! funny post!
What a joke! ,   USA   (06.04.07)
Funny because you don't live in Israel and therefore don't get your information first-hand, through something called experience. Mr. Doc Haifa made some emotionally charged comments to be sure, but your comments are so biased it is truly laughable. If you were really able to feel empathy for people in that region, you would empathize with both sides. Some of you English are so full of s**t and stuck-up about your own perceived moral superiority that you just cannot abide it when someone else tries to act morally superior too. This forum has been an absolute FARCE!
83. #79 - Doc - Thanks!
Your fan   (06.05.07)
Thanks for telling it like it is. I can't believe some of those comments about the BBC being right wing and so on... We need a voice like yours. There are too many people here signing with Anglo-Saxon or Jewish names or claiming to be Jewish, but giving themselves away by the type of criticism of Israel that they offer, and by the misleading content of their talkbacks. There is so much that needs to be done to expose the lies that the Left has been feeding everybody, Israelis included. Keep on posting, Doc. You're doing great!
84. #79 - To Doc in Haifa - good comments
A fan abroad   (06.05.07)
It's good the way you defend Israel against its critics. I won't add any more because my earlier comment didn't make it. Just keep on posting. It's necessary to counteract the anti-Israel propaganda every chance we get.
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