Opinion
The last Zionists
Elyakim Haetzni
Published: 02.10.07, 08:04
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61. uh, just a note for those needing some clarity
jack bauer   (10.02.07)
Jesus was a rabbi He practiced as a religious Jew no that doesn't mean he wore black and a fur hat.....it means he followed the traditions and religion of his people. He said pray to our father in heaven. He never instructed anyone to break any of the commandments, in fact he told people to follow them. A Christian is someone who is trying to follow the instructions of the Christ. Not religious nonsense, traditions from pagan holidays,etc. 10 commandments and the golden rule- to treat others like you yourself would like to be treated. I don't know everything, but Christians and Jews should be friends not foes
62. Andrew from Miami, #19, spot on
Jake   (10.03.07)
I couldn't have said it better.
63. ARTICLE SHOWS BANKRUPTCY OF CRAZY RIGHT WING
David ,   Los Angeles   (10.03.07)
64. Thank you Elyakim Haetzni. God bless you !
Abel Shoni ,   France   (10.03.07)
Let us celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles like old friends, having love for each other. "Then the survivors from all the nations that have attacked Jerusalem will go up year after year to worship the King, the LORD Almighty, and to celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles." (Zechariah 14, 16)
65. 57 ER: No need to fear the Christian translations in the
Rivkah   (10.03.07)
interlinear Bible and King James Bible as long as the Bibles are based on the Textus Receptus manuscript and not the Alexandrian manuscript. Judaism and Christianity are ONE RELIGION with a scism caused by the Lord who blinded the eyes of the Jews and prejudiced the minds of the Christians. I cannot reject either covenant as you do. One complements the other. One fulfills the other. Both are valid.
66. no no no they must be shunned
Danny   (10.03.07)
they loom, they lurk, they sing, they dance, they prey on the vulnerable (especially those between ages 12 and 95) who have questions about G_d and the Bible, let's really show them we don't need them, Hey we don't need any friends who DISAGREE WITH US. //sarcasm off
67. i agree that xians should learn more
Danny   (10.03.07)
a lot of the ones interested in the jews for jesus movement satisfy themselves with very superficial knowledge, which is spiritually inspiring, but doesn't really cut the mustard as far as understanding Jews and the basics of historical (extrabiblical) Judaism. It's amazing how uninterested Xians are for example in knowing the Tanach in Hebrew, which is so very much richer and amazing that once you know it you could never possibly be happy reading the Bible in another language.
68. For Israel
Alin Giurca ,   Bucharest,Romania   (10.03.07)
You said well,we,the Christians are supporting Israel because he is the fundament of our believe. Unconditionally,without asking anything in return,we are on your side,Israel.If somebody is fighting against you,Israel,you can count on our support-not only moral or financial,but also with troops.Long live Eretz Yisrael!
69. To ER # 57 § # 66
Abel Shoni ,   France   (10.03.07)
The New Covenant Prophecy: Jeremiah 31:31-34 31 "The time is coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah. 32 It will not be like the covenant I made with their forefathers when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them," declares the LORD . 33 "This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after that time," declares the LORD . "I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people. 34 No longer will a man teach his neighbor, or a man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest," declares the LORD . "For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more." And Jesus is everywhere, in the Law and the Prophets, and in the writings. He has never gone off, he is here, living, omniscient and omnipotent, waiting for the moment when I Am who has begotten Him from all eternity tells Him it's now time I glorify you as You glorified me. Judgment is coming in those Messianic times and that is the good news for all who are truly seeking the Lord. We need each other because God is love. Rebuking those who have been grafted on one branch of the Tree would mean ostracizing them. No, no and no, God needs all men of good will to build His living temple, believers and not believers, Jews and Christians, stems and flowers. Only that : Let us follow the light path.
70. Rivka...enough of the KJV only stuff
John ,   USA   (10.03.07)
Textus receptus does not = KJV...KJV came from Textus receptus in which translators also used the VULGATE. The fact is that outright lies, translational errors, exagerations from Christians, have LED ISRAEL ASTRAY. Why do Christians still use the SAME FALSE JEWISH ASSEMBLY TERMINOLOGY, CALLED CHURCH, along with denial that Jesus was 100 percent flesh and blood (not G-d the son), and that denial of the Holy word that no man will be put to death for another mans sin, each man dies for his own? Because the spirit of anti-christ is ver subtle. Because THEY LEFT FOR ANOTHER VERSION OF A MESSIAH.
71. 69: I was just asking the Lord today, Where is Abel Shoni?
Rivkah   (10.03.07)
And there is your insightful reply, ever faithful in your attentions to YNET tb'er's who need your kind heart and knowledge and thoughtful insights.
72. Xn Translations: Misinformation Instead of Documentation
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (10.03.07)
Only 9 years before the pilgrims were embarking in the Mayflower, 1611 C.E. -- KJV (King James Version) was authorized by a misojudaic king of England who had just put the finishing touches on getting the last Jews out of England. 4 years AFTER the Mayflower, 1624 C.E. -- Greek Textus Receptus, corroborating KJV (what a surprise!!!) is published. Translating English back into Greek. Oh yeah, that makes sense. Now reject the Codex Alexandria (ca. 450 C.E.) because, although it's well over a millennium older, it's too recent. This just keeps getting better. These ignorami who spew Christianity the most ardently never heard of the Codex Sinaiticus or Codex Vaticanus (both, ca. 300-400 C.E.) or the earlier papyri; much less the tens of thousands of misojudaic redactions increasingly injected after 135 C.E. (documented in The Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible, The Netzarim Reconstruction of Hebrew Matityahu (NHM) and in Who Are the Netzarim? (WAN)). The more recent the ms. the more misojudaic the text. Conversely, the older the ms. the less corrupted and misojudaic. If they'd bother to read WAN and NHM they'd know these things. Candlelighting times for all locations at chabad.org. PS: the most popular Israeli Jewish newspaper not publishing candlelighting times on Erev Shabbat and Erev Khag in its on-line counterpart is a disservice to Jewish readers and a disgrace to Israel. Even ha-Aretz publishes candlelighting times. Paqid Yirmeyahu Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il
73. Re: Jer. 31.30-33
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (10.03.07)
Christians quote a page of Scripture and then slip in a bogus non-sequitur by nakedly ASSERTING that J*sus is the subject. What kind of fool swallows such a stupid assertion? Anyone who wants to know how to irrefutably debunk the Xn claim concerning Jer. 31.30-33 will find the analysis at: www.netzarim.co.il => History Museum => the "135 C.E." room. Then follow the "Displacement Theology (Christian & Muslim) Misojudaic Perversions of Scripture" link and click on Yirmeyahu 31.30-33. (BTW, irrefutable disputations for all Displacement Theology perversions of Scripture are found here.) Candlelighting times for all locations at chabad.org. PS: the most popular Israeli Jewish newspaper not publishing candlelighting times on Erev Shabbat and Erev Khag in its on-line counterpart is a disservice to Jewish readers and a disgrace to Israel. Even ha-Aretz publishes candlelighting times. Paqid Yirmeyahu Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il
74. 70 John: There are translational errors in the King James
Rivkah   (10.03.07)
bible because the translators were under the penalty of death for a mistranslation. So they used more general terms like kill instead of murder in the commandment not to murder,hoping not to be put to death. The Old King James Bible does NOT pass the ELS Bible code test for authenticity, but it is a version available to the masses that is keyed to reference dictionaries (concordances) and is a less worse translation than the New KJV, the NIV, the NASB, etc. The Peshita ARAMAIC text does pass the ELS codes tests for authenticity. I do the best I can which is not sufficient for you. I do not have to suffer the consequences of your beliefs, only my own.
75. Rivka....if the KJV is good enough for Jesus
John ,   USA   (10.03.07)
It should be good enough for you. If a person studies at all, he can start to see the BIAS. For instance, you still believe in a physical death penalty, and a god requiring a substitute to kill in your place. Where do you think that came from? Calvin on the writings of Anselm. Not everyone is just going to swallow what you write hook line and sinker. Some of us already know better.
76. Rivka, please don't use me as your guilt substitute
John ,   USA   (10.03.07)
Jesus is supposed to do that for you. Because I might point out something that might not be very righteous, does not mean you are suffering because of me (righteous suffer, unrighteous are punished). But at any rate. You be blessed this day, try not to enter into judgement.
77. misleading
Chelsi Mueller ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (10.03.07)
I makes no sense to use a picture of a person in Catholic clergy garb, holding the Catholic rosary for this story. The Christian Zionist movement is not Catholic, its a movement of Protestant Evangelicals. It's time to start acknowledging the difference.
78. 75,76 John: No one forces you to read my tb's or to take
Rivkah   (10.03.07)
what I say to heart without checking it out. Sounds like you are looking for a person to lash out at for no reason. Work got you upset? Wife? Children? Neighbors? False friends? The Bible says there is only one friend and the is God and that God only promises food and clothing to those who love Him. Perhaps you are expecting too much in life which is upsetting. Lower your expectations. Never expect to get out of debt. Then drink some beer or wine which have lots of nutrients and will calm you down.
79. 41/73 Using the sources together!
Shiloh ,   Jerusalem, Israel   (10.03.07)
Using the research of Yirmeyahu with the resources of Jews for Judaism would imho absolutly crush the great lies of Esav. Unfortunatly when power is involved it will never further Derech HaShem. Having J4Judaism use and distribute the books/research materials of Yirmeyahu, while Yirmeyahu does not attempt to create a separate sect outside of legitimate Orthodox Judaism would be incredible ammunition against the messianics. Not only that, later, it could be used along in the churches, oversight by that of Orthodox Rabbi's teaching them Torah as opposed to the 'pastors' teaching replacement theology. If the goal is to further the truth by uncovering the lies, then it would be in the best, for humanity, to work together. Chag Sameach
80. #32
Paul ,   Concord, USA   (10.03.07)
Isaiah is plain. My correlation is simple. It is accurate. G-d's truth will always stand on its own. Science, history, and life will always reflect His truth. The "example" of water is simple also. You get it, and you are infuriated that you do. YOU are trying to make something MORE of my beliefs than I do for YOUR purposes. G-d did not "limit Himself" or "violate Himself" by the life in Jesus Christ, He fulfilled Himself! When He stayed the hand of of Abraham over Issac at the altar, He reserved to Himself the right to "spare not His Son, as blood sacrifice for all all sin for all time FORWARD! G-d has not cannot and will never break His Covenant with Israel!
81. #65 Rebecca---As I Thought
ER ,   Canada   (10.03.07)
You are very much mistaken! The origional Hebrew bible has nothing about Jesus, or anyone else, coming down from the clouds! This is all added by Christians to make Jesus sound legit! I say again, get rid of the Christian bibles, they add to scriptures! Your interlinlear uses wrong word translations! Is is junk.
82. Abel--And your point is?
ER ,   Canada   (10.03.07)
We are looking forward to those days!
83. #52-ER
Paul ,   Concord, USA   (10.03.07)
What contrivance...please explain? I believe Jesus is the messiah- You believe(most scholarly Jews) that Jesus was "Messiak ben Joseph"-one who came in poverty to teach...You(Jews as I understand it) are awaiting "Messiah ben David.. i believe they are one in the same... Very little difference in our bliefs in that light....I simply BELIEVE G-d IS ABLE to enter the human condtion, WITOUT refuting or dimminishing Himself..He IS G-D after all! Jesus is my High Priest forever in the Order of Melchisedek...G-d is ONE. He is "all of the corporate facets of Himself revealed to man, and "still as far above our understanding as the stars from the sands of the desert Father's." A magnificent G-d...OUR YWHW...
84. #41: Rabbi Bentzion
Ariel ,   London   (10.03.07)
Your response seems to indicate that all Christians have no respect for Jews unless they accept Yeshua. Let put this as nicely as I can. I am sure there must be some latitude for you to accept that there are Christians who genuinely respect Judaism though we may disagree with certain aspects of it. Though we may never agree on the identity of Mashiach, does that mean we don't respect Judaism? I know that within my own evangelical organization, the Pastors often resort to Jewish commentaries to broaden their understanding on certain subjects. I personally have as part of my Bible study material, various Jewish literature, and a Jewish Study Bible. As for the term 'completed Jew' not every body uses it as you seem to imply. I hope that this clarifies things somewhat.
85. #70 about KJV
Paul ,   Concord, USA   (10.03.07)
When compared to the "Dead sea Scrolls" the KJV has less than 15 verses that vary somewhat, and NONE are significant to doctrine. Emphasis of words, (you suggested dilution) has been largely either "manipulated by dogma in the pulpit", but not unilaterally accepted for any thing other than the implicit meaning. The rabbi's cannot have it both ways! Either all men, including them, are capable of skewing meaning to suit their "working model", or noone is.Of course, oral discourse is different than "oral recital". I understand this. but to imply that "only Christians are "contriving" when it comes to religious "manipulations" is just bigotry. I know I have LEARNED MORE from Hebrew /Jewish scholars on Torah, that I have say, "denominational authors in Christianity", but there are Greek/Hebrew Christian scholars with extraordinary insights as well. I rest in this...The same Holy Spirit that inspired the writing of theWord, is the same Holy Spirit that "convicts and conveys" in the study of the Word! Old and New Testament are by Jews, about Jews and to Jews, regarding the constant, consistent and cummulative history od G-d's revelation of Himself to man, G-d's Providential Hands in the human estate, and G-d's prophetic calendar for the race! I know Messiak will be a Jew, ruling and reigning from Jerusalem, and G-d's Kingdom WILL BE established on the earth. glory to HIS NAME!
86. ER, Canada # 82
Abel Shoni ,   France   (10.03.07)
Those days would never come if Jesus had not been the sacrificial Lamb, the paschal Lamb, who takes away the sin of the world, my sins and yours.
87. # Paqid and Shiloh
Abel Shoni ,   France   (10.03.07)
Paqid, You have been a Baptist Minister. You have believed in Jesus and now you are belittling those who will never abandon their faith based on the Rock and not on human evidence to the contrary. God is God and does He not know better than you who the true Messiah is ? The same repetitive argument is no new evidence. I am humble enough not to be offended by your harsh assertions. Misinformation is curable, bad human (too human) documentation rejecting God's purpose is the path to hell. The key to understanding the teachings of both Jesus and Paul is to rightly understand the New Covenant that Jesus instituted by His death when He became mankind's sacrifice for sin. Even a slight misunderstanding of that covenant's intent and purpose is sufficient to confuse and bewilder most individuals. And some, sad to say, play with the replacement "gadget". Dear R. Rivkah and Paul # 80, and some others here, may the Lord bless you all for your patient, loving and wise replies. # 79 Shiloh Give me the name of one, only one French priest teaching this replacement doctrine. Jews reject the new Testament and Yeshua, and distort Paul's writings. Jews distorting another Jew' s (Paul) teachings, is it really new ? Look how Orthodox Jews harass Paqid. Who is the winner ? You speak of ammunition, we speak of love not of war.
88. Marcel...do you see it?
John ,   USA   (10.03.07)
You can't make Jesus a symbolic lamb with literal sin removing (cause and effect) blood, when there is no Holy Word that says that? It either is or it isn't? G-d either suthorizes man sacrifice or he doesn't? Thats not what it is about (magic blood and flesh), so you can live without your WAGE (spiritual death).
89. the Apostle Paul and Judaism...
Paul ,   Concord, USA   (10.03.07)
It always baffles me that Saul of Tarsus, the apostle Paul, is so lambasted by Judaism. Then I remember his autobiogrphy as recorded in the gospels... 1)highest ranking student of Gamaliel (to even be a student you had to commit the ENTIRE TORAH TO MEMORY!) 2)Chief persecutor of Christians and champion of 'death squads"... 3) A "Jew amongst Jews" and "a "Pharisee amongst Pharisees" 4) while his "conversion" is recorded as happening on the Damascus Road (which is correct) I believe with many others, that his coversion was "sealed" at the stoning of Stephen, and as a direct result of Stephen's "monologue on Judaism" just before his death, because the accuracy and the spirit of his willful submission unto death was so "filled with the spirit and letter of the LAW, and the Prophets" Of course, one must remember 2 very important FACTS! 1) Juaism per se only came into existence post Malachi. while universally accepted as proper term today, Torah is actually the written record of the Hebrew peoples and all twelve tribes. The evolution of the Preisthood and "the letter of the LAW" Pharisee and Saducee domination is what led to Jesus confrontation with "blind leading the blind." Much the same as most of "denominational Christianity" has skewed discipleship today. 2) There are NO CHRIST-KILLERS! John 10:18, Jesus speaking..."NO MAN TAKES MY LIFE!!! I lay it down because the FATHER WILLS IT!!!" The irony of the day is this...in Jesus time the big theological argument was "do you have to be a Jew to be a Christian?" now it seeems the "scholars" have tried to turn the tables, and the big todoo is, "do have to be a Christian to be a Jew?" What a joke on everyone! The simple truth is we must seek to obey G-d with all our heart, soul, mind and strength..and have NO OTHER G_D before HIM... Keep ALL 10 COMMANDMENTS....they are not optional...
90. M Hartley
charles ,   petach tikva   (10.03.07)
Your # 37 is great . If we have 7000 friends who come here to support us , what's the problem if some of them have other goals . One rotten apple don't has an impact on the whole crate . We can only appreciate them , even we have'nt to agree with their religious beliefs . With true friends you have'nt to share everything . Let me only say to them : ברוכים הבים And to you : let us have the pleasure to read you many more years
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