Culture  Sports
German-Iranian striker refuses to play in Israel
Eldad Beck
Published: 09.10.07, 13:10
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61. Johannes #53
Jane   (10.09.07)
Actually, Johannes, part of Europe's problem is, and always has been, a pretense of superiority predicated on having old buildings, some art and some music. Quite frankly, none of you have truly evolved and have not even been cognizant of the take over of your countries by a foreign culture that is on the brink of swallowing you up alive. None of this even mentions the second half of the last century specifically, though I'm sure, Johannes, you know to what I refer. #30 only speaks the truth that you do not want to hear. So tuck your grandiose pretentions away and go get a burka for your wife.
62. scr** him...he stinks anyway.
(10.09.07)
63. #33 Lying about Jews being racist against Iranian / German
Elly ,   Vienna, Austria   (10.09.07)
#33. You imply that Jews dislike this player because he is a German / Iranian and we are therefore racists. This is an antisemitic ploy. Very few Jews hate Iranian or German people as long as they show "good will towards our people." And why are you so defensive by saying "you are not an antisemite?" Were you accused of being one?
64. German Insensitivity
Albert ,   Geneva, Switzerland   (10.09.07)
I am shocked at the "insensitivity of some German posters" preaching to Jews how we should accept this insult.
65. What's the problem?
Josh ,   USA   (10.10.07)
This is quoted as saying today: "I have more Iranian than German blood in my veins, that must be accepted." The Israelies do't seem to get the message, he is saying as long as Israel is an accupying, racist aparteid state I do not wish to legitimize it with showing up and playing there. He is a brave man!
66. #61
Johannes ,   Berlin, Germany   (10.10.07)
Well, Jane, Europe is facing a kind of a dilemma. We can choose between a culture of fundamental Christianity and a culture of fundamental Islam. I am wondering whether it is worse to get my wife a burka or to teach my kid that God created the earth in seven days and that science is evil. You may feel free and comfortable in the U.S., however, to me a life in the U.S. seems almost as daunting as a life in an Arab country. Your mentality of “shoot first and then ask”, your concept of freedom and human rights, your idea of life seems very odd to me. Furthermore, #30 is referring to the Holocaust and quoting anti-German resentments because a German-Iranian player refuses to play in Israel. I would like to know whether you want to be blamed for the genocide against the Native American people or maybe for the unnecessary use of the nuclear bombs against Japan that still causes suffering. Do you want to be blamed for 1.5 Million dead Vietnamese people? Right. So don’t blame me for the Holocaust. I have been born 35 years after WW II.
67. JAY LENO JUST MADE A JOKE ABOUT ASHCAN
DEBRA ,   USA   (10.10.07)
NOT WANTING TO PLAY IN ISRAEL. ON HIS TV SHOW LENO SAID, "ONE SIDE OF ASHCAN, THE GERMAN SIDE, CAUSED THE HOLOCAUST. THE OTHER SIDE, THE IRANIAN SIDE, DENIES THE HOLOCAUST EVER TOOK PLACE." THEN LENO SAID HOW WEIRD IS THAT? GOOD FOR LENO!
68. His reason not to play is racially prejudicial
Obama ,   Washington DC   (10.10.07)
rather than fear. And his German team is deliberately blind to see that. Which brings to the conclusion that FIFA should ban this team from playing elsewhere. Sport do not belong to any race, color, country nor politics. The team should be punished to make precedent.
69. #66- Johannes, Jane said it all.
Cameron ,   USA   (10.10.07)
Had to smile reading your commentary and noting how you were trying to achieve some sort of Germanic/European moral high-ground. While every people and state has history they're not proud of, your people & culture are directly responsible for the worst catastrophe to strike humanity since the days of the Mongols. While you may frown upon our culture, events like the Holocaust arose directly out of the mindset and values that have always characterized Germany and the rest of Europe. Wonderful intellectual products like Fscism, Communism, Nihilism, Anarchism, ect., have arisen directly out of Europe, not the Americas. It's unfortunate that you'll have to wear the Holocaust around your neck like an albatross, but thats a historical legacy you Europeans are directly, and solely , responsible for. You'll be thankful enough for American culture when you & your family( assuming you Europeans are still taking the time to breed) step off the jet that you fled to when the Islamic social & cultural nightmare finally becomes more than you can tolerate in Europe. You Europeans do not have the desire, will, or strength of character to even seriously consider the growing disaster in your midst, let alone take any real steps to address it. Your own apathy and indifference will make an end of the Progressive European reality.
70. Soccer Player with 2 left feat...
Efi G ,   Washington DC   (10.10.07)
His career is dommed. He should not play for the German National Team. He should also be stripped of his german nationality. FIFA should toss him out completey. Teams will not take him on, maybe weak ones. Now to the stupid remarks from some of the desktop warriors: Get your facts and then write. Weirdos with no life should find something better to do...
71. Johannes (66), that was an embarassing display.
sk ,   USA   (10.10.07)
Sometimes I despair over the lack of knowledge of my countrymen, but then I consider the deplorable state of European education. "Well, Jane, Europe is facing a kind of a dilemma. We can choose between a culture of fundamental Christianity and a culture of fundamental Islam." What a ridiculous false "dilemma." (It actually wouldn't be a dilemma even if it were true.) You do not have to become Evangelical Christians in order to reject Islam's conquest of your continent. You simply have to value Western culture and civilization and insist on preserving it. But you hide behind stupid jabs at the US and false alternatives. Specifically, to halt this conquest, you should begin by stopping all immigration from Muslim countries, including all of those fake "family reunifications." There is no need for you to believe that science is evil (which is a laughable characterization of Fundamentalist Christian positions anyway). Here's a tip, though: just because two groups are called "fundamentalist," it doesn't mean that they are equally wacky. Islam is hostile to science in a way that Christianity of any kind is not, and, unlike Christianity, it does not recognize any separation of church and state. "You may feel free and comfortable in the U.S., however, to me a life in the U.S. seems almost as daunting as a life in an Arab country." Let's see. You can spew your stupid anti-American prejudices on our street corners and encounter, perhaps, some jeering. If you so much as hint a criticism of Mohammed in an Arab country your freedom (such as it is) and even your life would be in jeopardy by the mob AND by the police. You would have few rights in court. In fact, though, as a non-Muslim, you would always be second class (or lower). BTW, our urban crime rate is the envy of London and Paris nowadays (perhaps Berlin as well). " Your mentality of “shoot first and then ask”, your concept of freedom and human rights, your idea of life seems very odd to me." Well, the reason why there ever was a West Germany is because the US protected you against the USSR. I suspect that there are still parts of Berlin that will show you what you owe us. Your "freedom and human rights" are totally a result of our bravery. Oh, and by the way, your democracy is very young, but it is based on OURS. If you don't understand our concepts of human rights and freedom, perhaps you need to read more about them from OUR writers. "I would like to know whether you want to be blamed for the genocide against the Native American people" The Indians and the early Euro-Americans fought for land just as everyone else has always fought for land. This was 150 years ago, on the frontier, against a people that no one then around regarded as quite human. Nazi Germany, in the heart of "civilized" Europe, some 60 years ago, totally rejected an evolved Western heritage for a race-based, totalitarian, genocidal one, targeting Jews everywhere who had just a few years past been integrated into German society. Prior to this, and unlike the American Indians, Jews were not regarded as semi-human savages, and they were not attempted to murder "Aryan" Germans. In your various comparisons of what the US has done and what Germany has done, THAT was your "best" argument, and it's preposterous and contemptible. What exactly do they teach? What did your parents teach you? "So don’t blame me for the Holocaust. I have been born 35 years after WW II." If you were born in 1980, let's assume your parents were, say, 22 years old when they had you. If so, they would have been born in 1958. What did THEIR parents tell them, so soon after Germany's disgrace? And what could they have conveyed to you?
72. ashkan, the german-persian Stinker
Jim Steed ,   Munich, Germany   (10.10.07)
just won this week's ashklown award
73. Hey Johannes, quit bashing the USA!
Got History? ,   USA   (10.10.07)
I find it astounding that someone from Germany has apparantly and unwittingly swallowed a full tank of anti-American propaganda. You seem to have skipped your history lessons in favor of revisionist crap, sir. It's time to turn off the PanEurabian Media Network now and take a GOOD LONG LOOK at history: Compared to the millions and MILLIONS of people killed in the two World Wars inflicted by your country on the Western Hemisphere, America doesn't even come close to contesting Germany's record for crimes against humanity. That makes YOU a descendant of the worst genocide-perpetrators in world history. If President Reagan hadn't come to your hometown and taken Gorbachev to task in a certain famous speech,---which you are obviously too wet behind the ears to remember--- you would still have a rather large WALL to contend with; so, why don't you just shut up now and have yourself a very gutes Tag!
74. #63
Chris ,   Germany   (10.10.07)
..no, the point is, that not me was supposed to be an anti-semite. in a dialogue, people easily know who's an anit-semite and who's not. I just critisized the 'talkbacks' insulting some people because of their citizenship. That's racism, but I would never say that ALL jews or Israelis think in that way about germans or iranians. I wouldn't be able to judge someone like that -that's what I would call racism! I hope, I could make it clear...
75. #64
Chris ,   Germany   (10.10.07)
...if it was meant to my posts, I'm sorry. It shouldn't be insensitive; I understand that it is a wrong message, nevertheless we should try to seek the problem in Iran and not in the person of a very young player. Nevertheless, we should expect more reactions by th officials about this case... I'd just say that it's important to talk about the facts ant not to spread hate and prejustices....
76. #63
chris ,   germany   (10.10.07)
..maybe not for an austrian person (??), but for a german it's sometimes quite helpful to make it clear, in a few but clear sentences, that you're not antisemitic, especially critisizing an Israeli person. I have jewish friends, I've seen so many cultures, I don't share any racist idea! That's why I blame it and I won't stop to fight against every kind of racism...
77. He worrys about his family in Iran
Israel Supporter ,   Germany   (10.10.07)
The problem here is the Iranian regime and not this soccer player. He can´t play in Israel because it would be impossible for him to visit is family in Iran with a Israeli mark in his passport. And he´s scared that something could happen to them if he plays against the Israeli team. This has nothing to do with race or antisemitism (on his side). Blame the Iranian regime and their law, not this poor guy.
78. thank U ashkan.
saman ,   tehran _iran   (10.10.07)
he refused play against israel to support palestine people. israel is gone with wind., because this base regime is on the blood.
79. On 2nd thought and taking #77 into consideration
Obama ,   Washington DC   (10.10.07)
he is excusable!
80. #2: No indication of "islamist"
Tobias   (10.10.07)
Johnny, nowhere is written what political or religious believes he has. You assume that he is an islamist --- maybe true. maybe not true. Maybe he is neighter religious nor antisemitic and has no problems with Israelis, but just wants to be able to visit his homecountry again, and also wants to protect his family and relatives. What do you think what would happen the next time he enters Iran, when he now played against Israel in Israel? What can happen to his brother and his other family members and relatives, who live in Iran? He has reason to fear the consequences of playing in Israel - not because of what Israelis do, but because of what the Iranian authorities do. He doesn't want to endanger his dear ones because of a soccer match - why should this make him evil? You don't know what his reasons were. Please stop spreading prejudices. And - "outspoken islamist" is wrong - if he is an islamist (what we don't know), he clearly isn't outspoken about it. He didn't mention religious reasons, he didn't say that he didn't like Israel, etc. --- According to what has been reported until now, he is not an outspoken islamist.
81. Ashkan isn't racist
Kaveh ,   Sweden   (10.10.07)
You people judge him without even knowing the facts. He is not racist and islamist as you say. The reason he wont go to Israel is becasuse if he does then he cant go back to Iran, and since he has family there you can understand that he doesnt want play. With an Israeli stamp in his passport he will never be able to enter his native country. Do you get it now ? His family is far more important then any football game, so dont talk so much if dont know the facts.
82. What's the connection?
Fred Stanley ,   Oxford, UK   (10.10.07)
what is the connection of this iranian to The Jewish State of Israel ? seems like this moshlem is over-reaching and making little sense has he been psychologically evaluated?
83. #81, I think plenty of people here made the same connection
hello from ,   usa   (10.10.07)
You hardly know the "facts" more than anyone else, so don't pass off your speculations as if you had some special access to this player's psyche. Most of the defensive talkbacks are directed toward stemming the tide of anti-US and Israel bashing, which always seems to sneak in no matter what the subject is. What you've said affirms the likely reason for the player not participating, but many other talkbackers have already brought up the same idea.
84. #66 Johannes
Jane   (10.10.07)
Johannes, I am Israeli. As to your view of America, well, I cannot emphasize strongly enough that whatever America has done is in the name of good intentions and freedom and, of course, self-interest much like any country. Europe, on the other hand, was responsible for the Crusades, the Inquisition and the Holocaust. I would not be so proud and self-righteous if I were you which, that G-d, I am not. So, Johannes, what did your parents do during WWII?
85. #71, You don't know that much yourself.
Richard ,   New York, USA   (10.10.07)
"Stop all immigration from Muslim countries.."? We have quite a few Muslims here in the US, and are bringing in more. How can you recommend to Europe what we ourselves are not even doing? There are about a million Muslims in Israel. What would you recommend there - mass-murder? I think a peace deal with the Muslims would be far better for Western Civilization than the continuous warfare and hatred that Zionist leaders are trying to promote. And talking about fundamentalism? Have you read the Talmud and the Zohar lately? The Jewish fundamentalism in those books is not much better than in Christianity or Islam. And while fundamentalist ideology may be hostile to science, the everyday living of people is another reality. If you look at a country like the United Arab Emirates, you will see that that country looks nicer than in Israel. So Muslims are working very well with the most modern technology. Another thing you are not aware of is that the concept of separation of church and state is not so clearly defined in other countries as it is in the US. In Israel and Germany, there is no real separation of church and state as we know it. SK, the reason why there was a West Germany is because Anglo-Saxons (although no longer homogeneous) are descendent from Germany, and they were not about to let the Fatherland go down to some Russian communist thugs. In addition, America was the number one foreign investor in Nazi Germany, and when they saw that the Germans were getting beat by the Russians on the eastern front, they had to get out there right away to protect their investment. Wealthy Americans and Europeans (Jews and Christians) financed Germany and Russia in World War II, and I blame them for the deaths of millions of people in that war.
86. Jack in SD,
Nini ,   Amsterdam, NED   (10.10.07)
Spoken like a true American...
87. Got History??
Nini ,   Amstedam, NED   (10.10.07)
Hey man, Reagan!?? It was Hasselhoff who took Gorbatchev to task ;-) Don't you think the East Germans themselves had sth to do with it. Reagan is as responsible for it as Hasselhoff, get a clue. Reagans little speech was nice, but the developments that brought the wall down came from the Eastern part of it not from the West! Know your History, sir.
88. Surprised
Nini ,   Amsterdam, NED   (10.10.07)
I'm surprised, no I'm ashamed how many people in here don't know the boy or his motives but without hesitation come to their judgement about him. As long as you didn't talk to him you just don't know his motives so everyone who's bashing him is a pretty dumb human being judgement on press reports. Yeah, maybe he did it for political reasons but maybe he is just afraid for his family in Iran! Fact is: WE DON'T KNOW. The REAL anger should be directed to the Mullah regime in Iran who cause all this - not against a 21 year old Football player for gods sake...
89. #84 Jane
SP ,   Germany   (10.10.07)
So, if America managed to slaughter the native inhabitants and enslaved africans for the plantage, if America managed to bring havoc to other states this was okay for you because America had good intentions? Good intentions for whom?
90. #84
SP ,   Germany   (10.10.07)
Gues what, the Crusade and the Inquisition were based on good intentions. They fought for freedom of christiantity and the souls of the sinners. Was not so bad, wasn't it? At least they had good intentions!
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