Opinion
Disengaging from reality
Shlomo Engel
Published: 12.10.07, 11:42
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25 Talkbacks for this article
1. Good Article
Moshe Reznik ,   USA   (10.12.07)
Peaceniks mean well, but they just don't realize that some people cannot be trusted and will always mean us harm.
2. What does Chabad have to do with this?
avi ,   gaza   (10.12.07)
Why must you defame Chabad? The Rebbe was and is 100% correct. Also, Arafat to you is not a "crazed Muslim zealot", but rather a "Palestinian president"?
3. very fine
RobertK ,   Jerusalem   (10.12.07)
Fine discussion of the psycho-world of the peaceniks. They will drag us down to hell. Resist them. ISRAELI VOTERS: DO NOT VOTE FOR LEFT-WING CANDIDATES. THAT INCLUDES LABOR AND KADIMA. THEY WILL DRAG US DOWN TO HELL.
4. Mr. Engel, it is you who is detached from reality
Khalid ,   The Netherlands   (10.12.07)
Opressing people the way you are shamelessly calling for have never provided a lasting long term solution to occupation and injustices, perhaps they can provide a respite for the oppressor but only for a while. History teaches you that the capacity of the oppressed to endure pain and suffering far exceeds the capability of the oppressor to inflict sustained pain over them. If your distorted logic has any attachment to reality as you claim, then India would have remained a British colony, Algeria would have remained a French coliony (we all remember the beligerent announcement of the french colonial authorities at the beginning of the Algerian revolution that Algeria is an unalienable part of France!), South vietnam would have remained as a vassal American satellite, and, and, and, actually beyond what your narrow minded logic can comprehend. Returning to the Israeli Palestinian conflict, just think for your self on whose side time is working when some years ago Golda Meir (Actual name Golda Arbatkov changed to a more Jewish sounding name on the advice of Ben Gurion) stated that there are no Palestinians. Now a Palestinian state seems more like a zionist demand than a Palestinian demand (judging by the latest speeches of Bush and Olmert) for the very simple reason of the demographic facts on the ground . So wake up from your sweet zionist dreams and tell us in your next article of any power you know of throughout history (whatever superior that power might have been at its time) whos has succeeded in subjugating a far weaker population group using the very realistic methiods you suggested in your article.
5. MMS is alive and well
Sol Landau ,   STL   (10.12.07)
saw him recently at the Bagel Factory on Olive in St. Louis, he ordered 2 dozen everything bagels.
6. This is NOT about the real pursuit of peace
Brooke ,   Canada   (10.12.07)
This is about corruption, bribes and lies. This is about taking the "Jewish" out of Israel. That is why archeologists, as I write this, are still not allowed to inspect the new findings & Jewish artifacts from the temple, the Waqf is destroying proof of the historical Jewish connection of thousands of years. It is for the elite intelligentsia (only in their own minds) dream of becoming part of the EU. It is the forfeiture of policy and self governance of Israel by her people to the dictates of the EU, America, Vatican & Britain. Shame on the gov't , past & present for the sell out of our inheritance and divinely gifted land---ALL OF IT!! Look closely and carefully, whomever has divided Israel has suffered gravely, both individually and collectively. Israel, if you do not rise up, you will never know the blessings G-d would bestow upon a strong & undivided Israel. B'H & Israel.
7. Great article!!
David ,   NYC   (10.12.07)
Thanks Mr. Engel !
8. It is silly
Mike ,   USA   (10.12.07)
to think that ANY of the countries and peoples surrounding Israel are in any way interested in peace. All they are interested in is the elimination of your country and people, and to keep trying to pacify them is foolishness.
9. Olmert only believes in saving his own skin and $$$$$
Malcolm   (10.13.07)
He has no lofty dreams of peace...First he needs to stay in office without being kicked out. After that , he wants international recognition which he can turn into millions of dollars, exactly like Barak did. The best way to get that "recognition" is to sell out Israel in some phony "peace" deal....exactly like Barak did.He and Aliza will then gather up their new millions, join their son and expatriate to Paris.
10. Give Warriors a Chance
Bruce ,   Kentucky, USA   (10.12.07)
Cogent and concise history lesson. Tragic that, like Olmert, so many peaceniks as well as the lazy-minded public at large inhabit a counterfactual "world of dreams and belief" when faced with the manifest evil of the Palestinians, Iranians, and jihadists in general.
11. Let us be reminded
Morty McMort ,   Alberta Canada   (10.12.07)
While at the same time, the Muslims dig up the temple mount, and remove as much evidence of Jewish presence in the past as possible. While we and the world stand idle.
12. Great Article
Yaarit ,   White Haven, PA   (10.12.07)
Very well said. It's kinda surprising that it was said on Ynet.
13. #1
Shimon ,   Cincinnati, USA   (10.13.07)
Moshe, I agree, this was an excellent article. I'm not sure that the Moslems will always be our enemies, but it sure looks that way. At any rate, Netanyahu is all talk. If he had responded with "The Hammer of G-d" at the time, and wiped Gaza and Ramallah off the face of the earth, Israel would be far more secure today.
14. Is it true that Ynetnews is shutting down for good?
Matt ,   Israel   (10.12.07)
15. Engel, Clear!, it's all about tourism, Not Holiness
observer   (10.12.07)
Take it easy, the US is ready to compensate. But with more exaggeration, the US might withdraw its offer.
16. So Netanyahu was right
(10.12.07)
17 soldiers died but the tunnel was opened. I guess that was a fair price. Why do you complain about Palestinian violence when you say that their threats of resistance are unworthy of attention?
17. FALSE HOPE???
al mann ,   Jerusalem, Israel   (10.12.07)
Politics involves manipulation, seduction, and the acquisition of that which endangers life and existence. It succeeds in denying and rejecting the past and all that is associated with it because that has no meaning any longer. The Kotel and its surrounding area has just become an archeological find having no meaning and significance to our politicians. It seems to have more meaning to those who would take it from us. The more they want it the more important is the meaning of it. To many of us it has become insignificant not worth fighting for. It's just a parcel of land on a mountain. We have a long way to go until the true Messiah comes. What will have to happen to awaken this people, Israel, to its purpose and mission in this world?
18. ynet shutting down
Chaya ,   Bat Yam, Israel   (10.13.07)
I read this in both the Jerusalem Post and Ha'aretz. I just send them an e-mail begging them to keep it open!
19. #2
i ,   jerusalem   (10.13.07)
What it has to do with Lubavitch, or at least with the vocal majority of dead Rabbi worshipers, is a common pathology of mass neurosis.
20. #13
(10.14.07)
AND YOU BLAME OTHERS WHEN THEY TALK IN SAME LANGUAGE TO WIPE OFF ISRAEL FROM THE MAP.
21. 18 - Chaya - we should start a petition
Diaspora Jew   (10.14.07)
Even if it's only a translation of the Hebrew site, with nothing extra, it should not cost too much to run. Just a couple of translators who could double as TB censors and an editor or two. It's a fun connection between Israelis and the Diaspora.
22. Excellent article. Too bad nobody in the government will
Reuven ,   Zikhron Yaakov, Isr   (10.14.07)
read it and take it to heart. They are cowards and dhimmis; afraid or unable to see the inevitable outcome of a fanciful premise.
23. I Agree.
Reuven Brauner ,   Raanana, Israel   (10.14.07)
24. why knock chabad?
selwyn ,   johannesburg south a   (10.14.07)
The writer has wasted a wonderful article by knocking Chabad. While do not neccessarly agree with all of chabads beliefs, i find that knocking them here has no relevence to the subject matter!. Knocking them for the sake of knocking tarnishes the authers credibility and sadly a good article loses its meaning when the article is seen to be written by a venemous human being who justs attacks for no reason.
25. You had me until...
David ,   Israel   (10.14.07)
You had me until you took a shot at chabad. Yes, their messianic faction is off the derekh, but the tactic you used remains an ad hominem attack (attack on a person or group; or an appeal to popular prejudice) and does nothing to advance your argument. Its hard to take someone who opens their article with that kind of counter-intellectual rhetorical jab seriously.
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