Jewish Scene
70% of ultra-Orthodox men don't work
Ynet
Published: 12.11.07, 00:09
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1. is it just me or is this just another confusing article
Merle   (11.12.07)
50%, 20% ? what does it mean? is this even in English?
2. Numbers are depolrable and anti-Torah
Besalel ,   Kew Gardens, NY   (11.12.07)
The Torah requires every man to support his family and maintain gainful employment. All of the top Chachamim and Tzadikim of the past had some sort of vocation. Even the Chofetz Chaim operated a small business (grocery). This new phenomenon of not working is anti-Torah.
3. What's up with the funky headgear I always see..............
Cameron ,   USA   (11.12.07)
these ultra-Orthodox sporting? Considering how much effort they go to remain distant from the rest of society, is anyone surprised they are such a poor sell at an employer's office? So much for the ghetto-mindset.
4. Because they're involved in taking on responsibilites...
Avraham ,   NYC   (11.12.07)
most of the remainder of the nation is shirking: learning Torah and observance of mitzvos - this sets the Jewish people apart from the Nations of the World - not professions.
5. The disturbing sucking sound......
Andy ,   ramat hasharon   (11.12.07)
of money from my wallet going to people who DONT WORK is something I will never get used to.
6. Why??
mark ,   ca   (11.12.07)
Why they should work if state pays them?
7. Nothing wrong with study, but you have to work too
David ,   Boston, USA   (11.12.07)
You can have it both way, religious study and working and most should be able to do both.
8. People say stay at home Mothers don't work, either.
Rivkah   (11.12.07)
It depends on what your definition of work is. Is studying the Torah and praying for the nation work? Most people would not do that if they were paid to, but the Haredim do that WITHOUT BEING PAID. Ariel Sharon prays for Israel and his people since he can do little else. Is that work? Is that helpful? The ELS bible codes say, "HASHEM LOVES A (riel) SHARON." This was encoded into the Bible thousands of years ago. I would say studying the Torah and praying is work. It is hard work since it means not having things that are worldly because of poverty. Jesus did not have a regualr job after the age of thirty when his ministry began because that is the age of the High Priesthood. No one under that age could be a High Priest. Was Jesus helpful even though he was not gainfully employed or paid a regular wage or have a house of his own? I would say, Yes. He healed the sick and comforted the afflicted and cast out demons. He did what others could not do or were not inclined to do. He also led a sinfree life, the only person to do so. That was very noble and grafted Gentiles into the Jewish faith. Did the Gentiles honor their savior by keeping his father's Sabbath? Most did not and most will find God never knew them when they die and enter hell for afflicting the Jews and Saturday Sabbath keeper Christians.
9. Hmmmm.......
Yosef ,   Jerusalem   (11.12.07)
Now why dont i belive these numbers? if you go to the slums of Lod or Tel Aviv and asked 7,000 people there if they have work you will get the same results or worse, so by my estimate 80% of israelies dont have work!
10. stop paying to haredim
(11.12.07)
everybody has to work, no excuses accepted!
11. What's up with the picture?
David ,   New York   (11.12.07)
Why are you showing two chests of women for a piece about employment. That picture should be for breast enlargement in the charedi sector.
12. I just don't understand why Ynet prints this
Talula ,   Israel   (11.12.07)
YES, we hate the lazy haredim bastards and YES they should stop stealing money from the government, but we KNOW this, these articles just fuel the fires of hatred even more.
13. #12 Way to cool things down!
Josh   (11.12.07)
14. Look what the Rabbis have done to Am Israel...
Josh   (11.12.07)
...why do we let men corrupt Torah? Laying Israel low. If we really loved G-d we would seek the truth. Theyre not even close to teaching Torah. They build a cult like society and teach everyone what they need to know to perpetuate it. They have brainwash tach squads to apply pressure to conform. Hotlines so you dont have to think for yourself. Arranged marrigaes, so you must come to them, like you come to a cult leader, just to participate in this natural thing called life. They even wont let you look at a woman in public. THIS IS NOT TORAH! There were no machizahs in the desert. Yet despite how obvious that they are brainwashing techniques world know, everyone takes stock in these individuals as if they are unquestionable. Friars. They violate privacy just like the best of the cult leaders of the world. Separate you from anyone who could offer an opinion other than theirs. Taught you to ridicue and treat other nations in a poor manner. Despite that we read how the forfathers were friends with people who were not Israel. They cult clamps on so you cant think for yourself. Someone always assigned to speak in your ear things that are completly unrelated to Torah. You shall teach it on your way. To who? To foriegners. A light to all nations. These men are not prophets, thus they do not exhibit the quality needed to be acknowledged as speaking on behalf of G-d or interpreting his prophet Moses. Give us a sign or wonder Rabbis so we may know you speak for G-d when you add to Torah despite the prohibition in Devareem of adding or taking away a word. Lhadleek nir - ?????? So obvious people! Torah b'peh is chet. We can be a strong nation with Torah as it is written, as Moses delivered it in the desert long before a rabbi jump into the breach between Israel and Torah. The ultimate middleman position. Look at history at how well we were protected by their teachings and look how the Israelites were protected by listening to the words of G-d delivered by Moses. Big difference - proof something is wrong. The rabbis vision: All men who love G-d should be invloved in non-stop study of disected Torah. All people who dont embrace Torah, should be working to suppport the brainwashing of these good men. Yechezkel - Chapter 13 18. And you shall say; So said the Lord God: Woe to those who bind cushions on all armpits, and who make the veils for the head of people of every height, to ensnare souls. Will you ensnare the souls of My people and sustain your own souls? Figure it out people! Anything similar going on today? We lost the temple so apparently no one took Yechezkel warning to heart. These things were taken into disporrah. What did they do in Gan Eden - disect sentances out of context. So apparent yet still to this day so effective. Gematra, al tvashel gedi bhalav emo, etc. Out of context and only certain words that serve the Rabbi are keyed in on. Read the prophets, they confirm what has been passed down by the San Hedrin and the corrupted Temple. It is why we went into disporrah and it remains with us to this day. You dont need someone to go and get it for you. It is in your heart to do it. Certainly you can handle this Am Israel.
15. Can someple please explain
Haredi Jew WHO WORKS ,   Bet Shemesh   (11.12.07)
Palestinians have a 95% unemployment rate and Israel provides them with free electricity, medical care, and ever more concessions to terrorism. And we have a constant flow of articles in YNet explaining why we should give more and more "humanitarian aid" to people who are determined to murder us, but religious Jews (and other Haredi that I personally know DOES WORK) are somehow less deserving of YNet "humanitarian compassion" than terrorists.
16. I can just see
Rivka ,   Shomron   (11.12.07)
the hordes of hilonim bashing the whole religious community in one basket, never ever learning (or wanting to learn ) about the difference between national religious and hareidim. Wait for charles, sas,ss, michael haifa, michael tel aviv, ect for their grandiose show. {Wait for them to wake up, it's just before 8 am} One thing I cannot understand is why do some (most?) hareidim need to disrespect the state of Israel. Never ever a state put their tax money to enable them to study all day. Now they get some from us and yet show no signs of gratitude. To the point that the boys that don't succeed in studying and choose the army put heir families at herem and themselves off limits. I personaly have no problem with some bunch of hachamot / min really studying at my expense, what I do have a problem is with a holier than thou attitude (and with a chauvinistic attitude not really rooted in Torah) too. But since Ynet raison d'etre is to fest hatred against hareidim and zionists, they wont get me (at least) to elaborate a lengthy opinion
17. #1 Not Just You
Paqid (16) Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (11.12.07)
Most of the other Ultra-Orthodox / Khareidim are as ignorant of high school math and statistics as you. Get an education and a life so you won't have to beg. Begging and living off of the gov't dole by choice (note, critics who can't read well) is a khilul ha-Sheim. Real Torah keepers work and serve in the Tzah"l. PS: the most popular Israeli Jewish newspaper not publishing candlelighting times on Erev Shabbat and Erev Khag in its on-line counterpart is a disservice to Jewish readers and a disgrace to Israel. Even ha-Aretz publishes candlelighting times. Paqid Yirmeyahu Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il
18. #15 Aparently your the exception - working 6 days
Josh   (11.12.07)
..as Torah commands. Six day you SHALL work. You SHALL not kill. Proof how the Rabis ignore words they dont like.
19. disgusting, chauvinism,jewish parasites
secular woman   (11.12.07)
eat & drink on women's backs 1 NO NATIONAL DUTIES ONLY BENEFITS ! SHAME ON you no wonder there is antisemitism in the world where jews don't work just SHNOR !!! and demand !! YACH
20. #17 Work? Like you work? By logic then
John   (11.12.07)
you are not a real Torah keeper. Such a hypocrite.
21. What's the problem?
Shim ,   Jerusalem   (11.12.07)
According to the first paragraph, only 20% of secular people work. It's lucky we have the literate, educated, secular ynet employees to keep us informed.
22. #15 Explanation
Paqid (16) Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (11.12.07)
First, I respect Khareidim and Ultra-Orthodox who work AND serve in Tzah"l. Did you serve in Tzah"l as well? I don't agree with the Khareidim / Ultra-Orthodox fabulizations, superstitions and subordinating fellow Jews to their blinkered focus on minutiae. But at least, if you work instead of beg AND serve your part in Tzah"l, we have a shared basis in recognizing the validity, legitimacy and authority of Torah -- shə-bəal peh as well as shə-bikhtav as the eternal core of Israel. Concerning the gov't aid and abetting of Gazan Arabs (don't call them "Palestinians," they are Paleban), aiding and abetting the enemy is treason. Two wrongs don't make a right. You cannot argue that treason by our leaders justifies the gov't supporting Khareidim / Ultra-Orthodox to live on the dole. However, I understand your ignorance of such logic since the Khareidim / Ultra-Orthodox shun logic, math and science as being an evil influence. After all, most of those who leave the Khareidim / Ultra-Orthodox ghetto are the ones who have pursued logic, math and science and gotten an education -- like Ramb"m. PS: the most popular Israeli Jewish newspaper not publishing candlelighting times on Erev Shabbat and Erev Khag in its on-line counterpart is a disservice to Jewish readers and a disgrace to Israel. Even ha-Aretz publishes candlelighting times. Paqid Yirmeyahu Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il
23. #4 No! Because Khareidim/Ultra-Orthodox Are Shirking Torah!
Paqid (16) Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (11.12.07)
Ramb"m was highly educated in logic, math and the sciences. The Sages taught -- by example -- that one should have an honest and honorable trade or career. Whereas Khareidim/Ultra-Orthodox rabbis teach to avoid education and work as evil, teaching instead to beg and live off the dole. Your presumption that you are the reason ha-Sheim spares the Israel you disapprove of is not only the oxymoron of fools, it's delusions of grandeur. It is moderate Torah-keeping Jews, who work and serve in the Tzah"l, who love Israel, who place the welfare of their fellow-Jews above fanatic-rabbinic obsessive-compulsive minutiae -- it is these who form the minyan that ensures the survival of Israel. You shame the example of Ramb"m and the Sages. Don't exacerbate your evil by the khilul ha-Sheim of attempting to dress your evil in Torah. When Khareidim/Ultra-Orthodox beggars come to the door they should be turned away with the admonition to get an education, get a job and get a life. (This tzedaqah is most efficiently, compassionately, unselfishly, uncorruptedly and elegantly achieved through the many gemakh funds in our batei k'nesset.) PS: the most popular Israeli Jewish newspaper not publishing candlelighting times on Erev Shabbat and Erev Khag in its on-line counterpart is a disservice to Jewish readers and a disgrace to Israel. Even ha-Aretz publishes candlelighting times. Paqid Yirmeyahu Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il
24. josh and his favorite sport
charles ,   petach tikva   (11.12.07)
Attacking Rabbis . This of course as a complement to his rot disgusting writings and soul [ if he has , but if he has , certainly not a Jewish one ]
25. Rivka
Charles ,   petach tikva   (11.12.07)
This morning i waked up at 6h20 , but have other things to do than sitting on my PC . Well my dear [ sorry if i confused you with this Goyish rivkah ] what can i add to your tb ? I don't agree with you when you write that Ynet hates charidim and Zionist . They write facts about the charidim , will you contradict this study by van Leer institute ? Will you contradict me when i say that the towns with a vast quantity of them are the poorest ? Will you agree with their behaviour in buses ? You are also writing against the charidim , not ? [ those boys who serve the IDF ] So don't accuse others , you bash the charidim by yourself .
26. Besalel , a question
charles ,   petach tikva   (11.12.07)
Is the proportion of not working charidim also high in your country ?
27. #17 talk about no math
Josh   (11.12.07)
As a Jews for Jesus freak who portrays being a Halakhic athourity, you can talk about poor math skills? You still haven't figured out the first commandment. One G-d. Three does not equal one. A man who has no power and is possessed by a fallen spirit is not a g-d, but a posessed man. Only a separate entity would ask "Why have you forsaken me?" So learn your math, 1 does not equal three. Trinity BS
28. To #4: That's the point!
Leah ,   Tel Aviv   (11.12.07)
As an observant secular Israeli, I can tell you that we can hardly observe the sabbath if WE WANT TO! We pay so much taxes in order to support so many sectors who DON'T need it (as well as those that do). Our average work week is nearly 50 hours. Both spouses have to work more than 5 days a week. It's getting to the point where if you want to have a decent life for your kids you have to work so much you're lucky if you can get shabbat together in time. The haredim are not only taking food from the mouths of the REAL needy. They make it even harder for non-haredim to study Torah and be observant.
29. #20 I work. no Khareidi/Ultra-Orthodox gov't funds
Paqid (16) Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (11.12.07)
I also served in the Tzah"l. My daughter is presently an officer in the Tzah"l. And, most importantly, Orthodox Jews don't answer to goyim Christians, John! PS: the most popular Israeli Jewish newspaper not publishing candlelighting times on Erev Shabbat and Erev Khag in its on-line counterpart is a disservice to Jewish readers and a disgrace to Israel. Even ha-Aretz publishes candlelighting times. Paqid Yirmeyahu Israeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il
30. #24 My favorite sport...
Josh   (11.12.07)
...is exposing you as a Christian. My next favorite is bringing out the truth which includes the sport you mentioned. How are you getting along in the closet with your glow in the dark Jesus? Fumbling around a bit with those ackward hands of yours to get the door closed, so people wont see that your really not a Jew but a Chistian?
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