If anything, children of Israelis who leave the country ("yordim") have an even higher rate of intermarriage than Diaspora Jews. They tend to be secular, and are often ignorant of Jewish, as distinct from Israeli, traditions. Coming from a nominally "Jewish" state, they've rarely had to engage with distinctly Jewish institutions. They're more likely to seek out other Israeli ex-pats, but their children, more often than not, marry out. This is what happens when the Jewish "soul" hasn't been sufficiently nourished before the Israeli ventures out into the world.

"This is what happens when the Jewish 'soul' hasn't been sufficiently nourished before the Israeli ventures out into the world. " This is the point. On the bright side, they have a Homeland to return whenever they wish. Forty Iranian Jews just landed in Israel -- isn't this wonderful? I wish I was there to greet them.

I am not condoning X-mas trees; but the rabbis aren't doing enough to bring the masses towards Judaism. Actually, what they are doing is alienating them from Judaism. Who says that 'Judaism' is only what some rabbi said 200, 300, 400 years ago. I believe a whole new - and fresh - approach has to be made with the Five Books of Moses as the base, finding and gleaning from it the wisdom that is there and which is intended to help us live better and more wholesome lives.

Being that I come from a secular Jewish family, I can say that is very alienating when having to see how the orthodox just give you dirty looks because you aren't like they are. In fact, the treatmeant that orthodoxy gives me keeps me further away from Judaism for the most part.

I've just received a Email from a friend of mine living in the USA . He told me that the tuition fee for his son in the Jewish kindergarten is US$ 13000 , for his first grade one 17000 . That's the problem ! not all the Jewish can , or want to , afford those sums , and they send their children to non Jewish schools = assimilation = mixed weddings = lost to Judaism . Youngsters who receive a Jewish education abroad , who have good ties to Israel , will certainly not assimilate so easyly . Xmas trees ? who needs them ? certainly not TRUE Jews , even if they are seculars .

There is a big difference between gassing children and burning their bodies compared to individuals deciding of their own free will that they don't find Judaism very appealing or fall in love and marry someone not Jewish. And it is people like Sharlo, who make these ignorant, ridiculous and highly offensive comparisons, who make Judaism LESS attractive to those who are already on the fence.

True Jews are NOT secular in any way!

This Tam i refer to , is one of the 4 in the Hagaddah . Yes , TRUE Jews can be seculars , and they live in Israel , THEIR country , It's not only by praying and wearing black suits that you are Jewish .

It was none other than his mentor Ovadia Yosef who supported divind the land of Israel, ceding Judea and Samaria to the PLO/PA, and who allowed the Oslo conference to go thru by abstaiining onthe vote. He remains in Olmert's goverment, and receives bribes fro it, ie funding for his institutions. So, Rabbi Amar, either stand up against your "wise leader" or stop your display of crocodile tears!

You wrote True Jews are NOT secular in any way! Thats your opinion and Ish Be'emunato ,yihyeh (each to his own).If you so lightly dismiss the jewishness of at least half of world jewery, then you are no better than the dark ages mentality of todays spiritual leaders we are Inflicted with. Had I lived In 1940tees Europe, my secular way of life would have not saved me..... As for jews In Israel buying christmas trees, I know of no one personaly, but I;m told that Russian jews celebrate the new year with a tree, thats how they did for generations, as the new year celebrations were the only celebration not censored by the authorities. It has no religios context.And Israel has brought upon Itself the rise In christmas trees sales, by Importing hundreds of thousands of non jewish cheap labor. If a resident from Ghana or the Phillipines wants a tree, no one should sanction or critisize them. We are not Saudi arabia, yet.

So because I had a bris and a bar mitzvah (even if it wasn't orthodox), you are saying that I am not Jewish? Just another example of the orthodox vemon that they spit on the rest of us Jews. Even after what I say in the original post, they can't seem to realize that this has caused so many Jews to shy away from Judaism. You guys aren't helping out your Jewish brothers ect. Man, what chutzpah the Haredim have.... They don't realize how much damage they are truly doing to the Jewish people, when the majority of us Jews won't have Jewish descendeants because of their lack of help in guiding so many back to Torah.

Not surprising that they push aside their brothers and sisters. The Chardeidim are hipocrites, in the fact that they do NOT practice Ahavat Yisrael. But... we know that hipocrite is a term glued to Chareidim today.

What is your original post ? Are you Tam ? Where did i say that you can't be Jewish ? I don't think that the charidim push the seculars away from Judaism . I think that the non Orthodox are not accepted because of the fast and easy way they convert non Jews . Don't you have non charidi Jewish schools in your town ? Can't you give your children a Jewish , non charidi education ? in my birth town , with around 15,000 Jews , we had such schools , and the result : a vast majority , 95 % , of Jewish , also the seculars as mine , children received a good Jewish education , have good ties to their people and to Israel . Tuition fees to high ? Make Alyah , here your children will receive a Jewish education for free [ or almost ] So don't blame the charidim alone [ i don't like them so much ] do also something for your children by yourself

At the root of the adoption of the Christmas tree, is the fact that true Torah holdiays are not celebrated on the level of false holdiays. Purim and hanukah are not true Torah holidays and these are the only ones that come close to the excitement achieved by pagan holidays. Sukkot was meant to be a week long feast and festival type atmosphere with much rejoicing where the community gathered together. There was to be food and drink as we danced before G-d and celebrated. Instead booths are built in each house and it resembles separation of the community into family home units. The booths were meant to be cetralized in a field. Do it like Torah wrote it. Bring rejoicing for Hashem back and elimitae the chet additions made by the Rabbis that make Torah expensive to embrace and boring to observe.

We have so many beautiful holidays of our own, so why should we celebrate those of other religions? Kids with a good Jewish education and identity will not be interested in having a Xmas tree.

Are the seculars really going to celebrate the man who said he came to bring the following for Fallen Jewish Israeli families?: Matthew 10:21. The brother also shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the son; and the children shall rise up against their parents, and shall put them to death.” Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.” Luke 10:35. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. Luke 10:36. And a man's enemies shall be they of his own household. Luke 12:49. I am come to cast fire on the earth. And what will I, but that it be kindled? Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation. Understand he is talking to the Jews that are living in Israel (Israelis). when he says he is going to burn up chaf, he is talking about fallen Jews. These are not innocent non-religious items and parties, they are false g-d parties. I feel humiliated seeing Jews racing to the booze troughs to ring in a new Jesus year. Since he is an admitted punisher of the Jews, it just seems all the more surreal that any Jew would rejoice on the anniversary of his birth. Jesus came to punish the Jews and test the Jews for the sake of Hashem.(Devareem 13). Why would one who is Jewish and secular revel in the pagan creation of Jesus as a messiah and a g-d? To have this Horse (Hasus) knocking at our door states something about our current status. It is not a good sign. These are the symbols of the dead first begotten son that are hanging on the wall. The Israeli secular Sylvester and Christmas partier hung them there. Who after all is really the first begotten son? Did not G-d give Israel this label? I recommend all Jews and Judeo-Christians return to the straight reading of Torah and respect that is not an empty thing. There will be no peace, except that Hashem delivers it.

"Do it like Torah wrote it. Bring rejoicing for Hashem back and elimitae the chet additions made by the Rabbis that make Torah expensive to embrace and boring to observe. " The drab attraction of Judaism has truly failed the majority today. This is an issue with most religions nowadays because of the fact that modern society, conflicts greatly with religion on many prime levels.

See www.netzarim.co.il/Museum/Sukkah09/Christmas.htm PS: the most popular Israeli Jewish newspaper not publishing candlelighting times on Erev Shabbat and Erev Khag in its on-line counterpart is a disservice to Jewish readers and a disgrace to Israel. Even ha-Aretz publishes candlelighting times. Paqid Yirmeyahu IIsraeli Orthodox Jew Advancing Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming Jews & non-Jews www.netzarim.co.il

And its sad to see that there are so many intolerant Jews ! Live and let live, ever heard of that ?

This josh knows his christian scriptures "be al pe" , he quotes them everywhere . But it's not amazing , he is a christian .

Jews in the diaspora? What about israelis trying so desperately to be cool, while alienating themselves from their true identities (whether israelis, jewish or both). I lived in Israel for 12 years, so I know how israelis emulate anything that is practiced in "chul", including including spoken slang. Judiasm is beyond a religion - it is a culture, a history, a heritage... Unfortunately, it stems from self-hatred.

Being a GOOD Jew means praying!

I went out on the 25th for a drink in Herzliya and there behind the counter was a giant animated Santa Clause manikin. It really was freaky looking and was a promotion by Guness. It bothered me enough that I turned around and walk right out of the restaurant. So I went to another nearby bar, this one had "Santa Clause" girls dressed in mini skirts and they were setting up a Christmas tree for decoration. Again another promotion of a liquor company. For the past week I have not set foot in Herzliya to patronize any of the nightlife. I hope others follow the lead and make these places ghost towns during their pagan promotion for profit. Maybe if we can cause a loss of revenue will get them to rethink about participating in Pagan celebrations. The Rabbis and the state better get creative in finding ways to spice up the Jewish celebrations to compete. They should make Sukkot the Festival it was intended to be. They talk about kids being mall rats, but this was the idea behind Sukkot, everyone went to a central location (the fields) to socialize, eat and celebrate Hashem with food and drink. A festival like this could blow the doors off of Sylvester. Instead we sit in 8 x 8 individual huts not because its fun but because the Rabbis force it upon people with laws they added to Torah. The focus is on the must and not on the "joy" for Hashem. One is falsely commanded to do boring things in the Sukkot under an over interpretation of the "dwelling" aspect. It so clear it is festivious in the orginal text. Sad thing is I bet the bars were packed on Sylvester. Do Israelis realize Jesus said he came to put an ax to the root of Israel to make war with our families. This is a reference to the curses of Torah that state G-d will eliminate all but a remnant (a root). So to see these macho men celebrating this man's holidays really shatters the image of "cool" they want to purvey and replaces it with "fool". How humiliating to celebrate the one who wishes seculars war and death. Who came to make people like them (fallen from Torah) deliver their brothers and mothers to death. If they would read, there would be a turn around and see like Baalams donkey that the punishing angel is standing a hairs breath away. Quoting from the new testament: Matthew 10:21. The brother also shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the son; and the children shall rise up against their parents, and shall put them to death.” Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.” From these quotes it is clear its not just the Jews, but the whole earth that suffers war. Why are people celebrating? I wouldn't call it self hatred, because they don't know. I rather call it hoaring for recognition, rebellion and disloyalty to G-d. TV has helped a lot in degrading values and popularizing rebellion, gays, tattoos and pagan values. TV propaganda seeks to rubber stamp western Christian culture and formulated self-arrogance over top of the Jewish nation. We can see the family values in the US degrading in the general sector, yet Israel which has fairly good family values, seeks to copy the culture that destroys discernment. These are the seeds planted among the children that will grow into wars.

I thought by your were going to give us a history lesson on the CHRISTMAS tree, from your perspective of course.