Opinion
War failure our fault
Amnon Levy
Published: 29.01.08, 19:00
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48 Talkbacks for this article
1. Israel public responsible for occupation and settlers
Chanalau, Tova ,   London, UK   (01.29.08)
Yes, its all too easy for your man or woman in the street to blame the army and blame the settlers and blame the government; however its the public put them there and that supports them. Israel, supposedly the sole great democracy of the middle east which means everyone there must either accept the guilt for the horrors that go on in Hebron and elsewhere or do something about it; you can't sit on you backsides and claim "we didn't know, its not us that did". Yes you do know, yes you are guilty.
2. The cause is Sharon with the whole Kadima
Norman   (01.29.08)
They threw out our brothers from Gush Katif. Instead of training the soldiers with a war against Hizballah they trained them to throw out Jews from Gush Katif. Olmert has to go.
3. Nonsense
Shai ,   IL   (01.29.08)
Probably the stupidest argument I've heard. Ever! Olmert himself couldn't have written it better.
4. The Boss did not ask the people
Sam ,   USA   (01.29.08)
5. Yes, the Israeli public wanted the war, OLMERT DIDN"T
Daniel ,   Formerly Israel   (01.29.08)
Olmert turned the second Lebanon War into a security operation. It was a haphazard series of raids and pointless bombings with advanced warnings. The Israeli public wanted war, and the situation required war, but Olmert didn't have the guts to wage it, THAT"S WHY WE LOST.
6. He's MY man. I fell. Dont arrest him
Gideon Reader ,   USA   (01.29.08)
A steaming load of horse pucky, and hold the cole slaw, Adon Levy. You are channeling the words of the battered wife, whose split lips, blackened eyes, hemotomas head to foot and broken bones, spoken as her fault; something she provoked. Not the abusers fault. Uh-uh!! Riiight. Errant nonense. The Wars failure is the fault of a series of events and non-events that are governed by specific persons and active events and actions by those who are paid , trained and kept for the purpose of governing exactly those things. Fault is easy to pin point, and corruption and incompetence alongside political malpractice can only be found at the political echelon; the PM's Office. The CoS and the DefMin, not the general public. However, I give you a B+ for carrying Olmert's water.
7. Wanting War and Failure
Joe ,   Israel   (01.29.08)
Assuming that the nation wanted war, the decision to wage war was taken by a government not by plebicite. It is the function of the government to weigh alternatives and make decisions. If indeed the commission finds that the government failed in its performance and conduct of the war, this has nothing to do with the will of the people.
8. This is bar none the stupidest article ever.
(01.29.08)
Ynet, you have totally lost it.
9. WHAT FAILURE !
steve ,   london, england   (01.29.08)
I don't believe the citizens of Israel should evaluate the Second Lebanon War as a strategic failure. One has to accept it was a tactical action that is part of a more general strategy called 'The Independent nation State of Israel'. The hope is more of them in Hezbollah will have learned the lesson that if they escalate their attacks upon Israelis such acts would be met with more devastating military response from IDF. We do not pray for the opportunity ton arise as they do. Israel has not failed. The international community has failed, is failing and will continue to fail in their humanity to Israel and to Lebanon so long as the international pressure is not exerted upon Hezbollah. That means public condemnation of Hezbollah's militarist strategy. Hezbollah have to learn there are billions against them. If the government of Israel fails to inspire, coerce, cajole and indict the world community to condemn Hezbollah, then the people of Israel must deselect that government. Nobody yet failed in Israel in the love of independence. Nobody failed in their hate for war as an instrument of foreign policy between nations. This seder we will taste the lekhem of affliction but in bitter morsels we shall recall our heritage and the mission of Judaism to the nations. Which is ...... to indict and to set at liberty. Righteousness between humankind and GOD being what it is, which is that it is a terrible state of affairs, the world around us is no more secure now than 1967. We will celebrate 60 years in the hope of our freedom and in the justifiability of our actions this year and we will each of us have our own part in the past to remember. But we can look forward like no other nation in our neighbourhood can look forward. We pray in different directions. We follow different rules. We hope for different ends. But our hope for our peace is as much for them to have peace. That's why they shall eventually have peace. They cannot work it out for themselves. So we must help them by showing them how, in humility and respect for their dignity. BY PRESSURING THE WORLD COMMUNITY TO INDICT AND CONDEMN TERROR GROUPS SUCH AS HEZBOLLAH AND HAMAS WHO CALL THEMSELVES POLITICAL SAVIOURS. They don't know what Palestine is. They want to find Islam within it. We know how they can achieve that ambition because we are a secular example to the world. AMEN ve AMEN
10. Blame the people?
Ezra   (01.29.08)
What a ridiculous article. Before assigning blame to the people, the issue has never been about starting the war, it's all about the mismanagement of the war.
11. Finally! FINALLY!!!
Willy ,   Israel   (01.29.08)
Finally somebody who tells the truth. The Israeli public overwhelmingly backed the war in Lebanon. But as they say: Victory has many fathers..... I simply cannot hear that "somebody has got to take responsibility" crap you hear everywhere! It is THE ISRAELI PUBLIC who not only voted for the current government (that would be to easy) but backed the war, sent their sons and daughters to Lebanon with flying banners!!!! So do us a favor and recognize your own bloody responsibility. There should also be a Vinograd report on the stupidity, naivity and arrogance of the Israeli public!
12. Blurb
Paul HT ,   Jerusalem,Israel   (01.29.08)
I wish journalists would grow up.They create nonsense complete with their own myopic opinions to create argument for the sake of their own pompous opinions. We all suffered during the war, War has never been a solution, but the invasion of a soverign state is criminal and cannot and should not be tolerated.
13. This article is morally reprehensible.
Terry ,   Eilat, Israel   (01.29.08)
Beneath contempt & intellectually indefensible as well. We went to war with the expectation of winning. We went to war to defeat & eliminate a threat to our country. We went to war due an unwarrented provocation by what can only be described as an evil enemy. We went to war to correct a situation that had developed due to our own neglect. We expected competence, expertise, & victory. What we got was Olmert & his cronies, lies & half -truths, incompetence, mismanagement, disarray, confusion, irresponsibility, & unaccountability. And to make any suggestions otherwise in an attempt to salvage the political career of Olmert is the height of cynicism & deception. For shame ....
14. war failure our fault
bear ,   zefat   (01.29.08)
There's only one thing wrong with this article: the author doesn't have the foggiest idae what he's taqlking about and if he feels thway he says, leave us out of it. His feelings are strictly his own.
15. Blaming the victim: A sure sign of Kadima's guilt
Joe ,   Los Angeles, CA   (01.29.08)
The war failure is not the fault of the Israeli public. It is the fault of Kadima, who, bowing to Western pressure, failed to finish its objective: the elimination of Hezbollah. Levy would like us to believe that "we wanted this war". Sure, Israel wanted this war like it wanted its soldiers to get abducted, its citizenry to spend quality time with their families in bomb shelters and its sons and daughters to die for a cause its government was only half committed to. The Israeli public wanted this war like it wants another hole in the head. Levy's analysis is nothing more than blaming the victim. It is opinion based on opinion with no substantive connection to reality, wrapped in pseudo-intelligent language meant to galvanize Leftists and Arabs into a round of condemnation of the Israeli people. YNet, why do you give this nonsense a platform? For the sake of appearing balanced and non-biased? For the sake of political correctness? So people like me will get incensed at what I read, then click on ads offering Major League T-Shirts in Hebrew? YNet, do you realize that if people like Levy have their way, you can kiss your company and country goodbye? For your sake and ours, stop giving defeatists like Levy a platform!!
16. Morons R Us seem to be the rallying cry
Al   (01.29.08)
of the so called intelligentsia in Israel today. I am sick and tired of having to stomach pseudo intellectual morons masquerading as mavens. In a nutshell.. Shut the blazes up!
17. WE DID NOT CHOOSE THAT WAR!!! NEITHER DID OLMERT!!!
Marc ,   Tel Aviv   (01.29.08)
Blaming Israel for that war is like blaming a fire on the fireman that extinguished it. We did not choose that war, and neither did Olmert!!! As much as I think Olmert handled the war terribly, and is not fit to be our prime minister, he did not choose that war. The responsibility of that war lays squarely on Hezbollah. They invaded our country, kidnapped our citizens, and fired hundreds of ketushas at our citizens per day. We had no choice but to defend our country. How can our self defense even minutely be equated to us wanting that war. Had Hezbollah not kidnapped our soldiers nor shot rockets at our citizens that war would have never happened. Hezbollah chose the war. Hezbollah chose to fight from Lebanon. Hezbollah is to blame for the war, not Olmert, and surely not the population of Israel. I think blaming that war on Israel is a slap in the face to all the brave soldiers that defended us.
18. great artical , and its very , very true
dafer ,   jerusalem   (01.29.08)
19. Amnon: so we should have sat quietly and do nothing eh?
gabriela ben ari ,   jerusalem   (01.29.08)
20. Shame on Israeli Leadership - Olmert...
David Hes ,   Toronto, Canada   (01.29.08)
Intellectualize all you want, the failure for the Lebanon war has nothing to do with the people of Israel and the media and everything to do with a government that is run by novices. The Israeli intelligence apparatus was ill-informed of the enemy and the landscape. The government was not out for 'the kill' it was afraid of 'winning' or rather the cost of winning which turned out to be the very same as the cost of losing. Olmert must retire in shame. He is a leader with no realistic vision for his country. He is weak because he is afraid of losing. He is no leader for a country that is almost completely surrounded by enemies.
21. #11 and I think there is still backing for the war
Danny   (01.29.08)
just not it's conduct. The half-hearted initial fighting, the stop start, the different MKs talking nonsense, the promise to Syria it could do whatever it liked and be immune to attack, the promise that we are only there temporarily, the incompetent PR war and lack of goals - the list goes on. This is not the public's fault, this is the government's. I still support the war and will support the next one - just make sure we fight it properly.
22. Will the bitch #1 from londonistan shut up!
jason white ,   afula,israel   (01.29.08)
The only occupation is by arabs occupying Jewish land. Yes we are sitting on our backsides,but one day we will get up and throw the foreign occupiers out of of Jewish Holy land.
23. There will be many more failures - defeats, reather - if...
Persian CAT   (01.29.08)
ur not careful. For once the sugar daddies left it up to IDF to pull it off without rushing to help with money and arms - the illegal cluster bombs were delivered a tad late - and IDF's had was revealed to the whole world to see. Those who are dreaming about bombing Iran should take lesson.
24. what an idiot
Ben ,   Haifa   (01.30.08)
Everyone that I know culd see the lack of resolution and experience in our so called leaders. Olmert is a hack who fell into power on the back of a senile Sharon. No leadership, no stratedgy and no humility/remorse. Olmert Go Home!
25. Hizbullah was prepared for the war
Shachar ,   NYC   (01.30.08)
and Israel was not, especially in any way that matters, not one Hezbullah Arab is leaving his boots in the sand and running away, they are not shooting missiles into open fields or empty building, they do not care what some effete journalist has to say, they have no guilt that their cause it the right one, something the Israelis running Israel have a problem with, too bad the present Israelis power structure will lose a country that their parents and grandparents fought so hard for.
26. Drop it ! Go FORTH , MOVE ON !
ben ,   singapore   (01.30.08)
" What we will learn from this war " " NO BODY IS WINNER AT WAR " " IF MILITARY INTIMIDATION COME FIGHT BACK " " BUT DONT FIGHT WITHIN YOUR PEOPLE " " STAY UNITED " AND WHEN WILL WE LEARN IT ? THE DAY YOU LEARN FROM HISTORY - AND REMEMBER HISTORY ! ANYWAY ISRAEL is the Best DEMOCRACY in the ME ! cheers :-)
27. To#21 and other war supporters
George ,   Canada   (01.30.08)
I wish you comes and support the war from Israel not from far away luxury live in the US europe or whatever.
28. to #22 looks like the opposite happening
George ,   Canada   (01.30.08)
Mr extremist settler soon you will be leaving Sederot norther.
29. Poor Amnon Levy
George ,   Canada   (01.30.08)
Here ago again,one writer (think God is a jews)write something critisizing jews and the attack started on him .every body want to bite him ,call him idiot etc....Why don't you call him the dirty antisimit?
30. Hes got a point, sort of...
Russell ,   NYC   (01.30.08)
The public's fault is really with the new Israeli mentality. The current wave of selfishness, draft dogging has given birth to soilders who dont take their work seriously. Milumininkim who glorify lackadasical soildering. Ive seen all this first hand. The way they dont take care of the army's equipment. Why because they feel like "friarim". They feel silly to be in the army. Israelis need to honor their soliders for their hard work and sacrifices. Conscript all those draft doging tzfonim and make them clean Golinai latrines! I bet theyll be volunteering for sayerot in no time.
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