G-d bless the efforts of Messianic jews ========= augustine e johnson-usa

Yes - they do hate Jews. Why else use deceitful means to convert Jews from their heritage. I have fewer issues with Christian missionaries or Muslim missionaries. At least they are forthright and honest. Jews for Jesus and the like are sponsored, ultimately, by non-Jewish churches to fulfill their Chrisitan messianic dreams of converting the Jews. They are using subterfuge to pretend that they are 'fullfilled Jews" and not Christians. You cannot believe in Jesus Christ as G-d and still be a Jew - you have become a Christian. This raping of Jews' heritage by trickery is anti-semitism, Rachel. It is violence against Jewish culture and its ultimate goal is to destroy Jewish culture and beliefs. They should open a Church and come out of the closet. Then I will treat them as a neighbor. And Rachel, when you go on a Jewish missionary trip to Mecca to convert Muslims to Muslims for Moses, then tell me all about the tolerance you experience. When you go to Rome and start your Christians Without Christ movement, please tell me about how welcome you are made to feel. It's all about deceit.

Eric - The Lubavitch don't pretend to be something that they are not. And even those among them who have too strong a reverence for the Rebbe that they think him to be messiah, do not believe him to be a Deity like Christians believe Jesus is and was. In any event, Jews for Jesus pretend they are Jewish but are run and financed by Christian missionaries out of the US South. Lubavitchers are not decietful about who they are and their heritage is that of more than half of Jews alive today. So Eric, you are off base.

It's not religious freedom - it's religious deceit. Simon - if Mormon missionaries come up to me and try to convert me to their belief that the Jews mystically migrated to America 2,000 years ago and that this was revealed in copper scrolls found in Upstate New York in the 1800's but only seen by one person, then I am fine with that. They are telling me the true story of their belief and I can take it or leave it. Jews for Jesus and their ilk prey on unschooled Jews to make them think they can join the world majority of Christians and still be Jewish. They pretend to be Jewish and pretend not to be backed and supported by non-Jewish Christian missionaries from the American South. That's deceit. So I am insecure about them because I don't trust people who use deceit to rip the vestiges of a rich culture from Jews. When they stop usurping my religion and taking my name as a Jew, then I will accept them as honest missionaries for whatever craziness they believe in. But it's like Syrians calling themselves Israelis and coming to Tel Aviv to take what's theirs as an "Israeli". It's the dishonesty that is troubling and dishonesty is not freedom.

This is the problem, with this whole situation. When you believe in Jesus, you cannot be Jewish. No matter how much you try and justify it. That is fundamental. Why call yourself Jews, because you like to wear the costumes. Stop trying to play both sides of the fence. This is like being bisexual, pick one already and get on with your life.

But so is the covenant of God with Yeshua. The counterfeit Christian Sunday churches with their counterfeit sabbath and counterfeit holidays and history of persecuting the Jews should not be confused with the Messianic Saturday Shabbat and Jewish Holy Day churches of the Messianics which is a true church that does not persecute the Jews.

There is no difference between a reg xtian and a messianic. They both believe that jc (wasn't just the messiah)but that he was and is G-d. They believe they have a commandment to convince every person that this is true and use lies and deception to accomplish this. I am curious though why no one has protested King of Kings, the biggest messianic "church" center which is in the top of binyan Clal? There is no freedom of religion in Israel according to the Torah.

It seem´s to me that all the talk about Israel being democratic is at least in that part of town just rehtoric and a lot of hot air. No different than the mad Hamas Sorry folks wake up, we are in the 21.century, or are we ?? Greetings from Austria

Messianic Jews are born to Jewish mothers, they are Zionists who are faithful to the Jewish State of Israel, they pay their taxes to the State, serve in the army, celebrate all Jewish holidays, keep kosher, rest on Shabbat, circumcise their sons, have mezuzot on their doors, identify as Jews and daven from the siddur in their own "synagogues"... and they also believe that Yeshua (Jesus) is the messiah, that the G-d of Israel is a triune being and that the Brit Chadasha (New Testament) belongs in the Jewish Bible, along with the Tanakh. Maybe their are heretics. But isn't rejection of the Oral Torah heresy as well? We do have Karaites in Israel. Do they deserve the same treatment? What about those who are heretic because they don't believe halakha has binding authority (Reform), or that they can adjust halakha (Conservative)? Whose next? Please, stop this hateful and ignorant crucade against peaceful Messianic Jews.

Born again christians love the Jewish people because we know they gave us the Bible & the Savior of the World, "The Lamb of God " came from Jewish people. After Ezekiel 38 & 39 are fullfilled (VERY SOON) many people will start searching the scriptures with a desire to know HIM.

ALL Christian sects are supercessionist toward Judaism. They believe that they are the "New Israel" and that they will buld a "New ZIon" and that they are "Circumcised of the Heart." In other words, they believe Judaism MUST be replaced by Christianity, i.e. belief in Jesus as a Messiah and or God. MIssionaries propagate that decision, an by so doing, are involved in Cultural genocide against Jews. MIssionaries were the cause of the destruction of Countless cultures and religions in the New World, the Philippines, Africa, etc. Whenever you believe that your religion is superior and that therefore ALL must adhere to it, you are on the path to CULTURAL GENOCIDE.

We praise the Evangelicals for their support; these folks are no different! Both are Christian groups trying to convert Jews to their religion.

I believe Israel is a cosignatory to this declaration even if this fact seems to be unknown to several talkbacks. Article 18. Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance. Article 19. Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers. Article 20. (1) Everyone has the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and association. (2) No one may be compelled to belong to an association.

Looks like Ezekiel's dry bones are beginning to come to life. See Ezekiel Chapter 37.

Why then are there TWO separate terms? Christian and Messianic? These are two VERY different faiths, with fundamental differences, hence the two separate terms. I suggest more research for you.

the term "Messiah" or Moshiach is of semitic origin. It represents a specific type of annonting, involving HaShem. the terms "Christ" etc., are derived from a Greek word meaning "to rub or smear" which has absolutely none of the appropriate i.e., priestly, torah-related implication.

# 15 : No, christ = arisen, Messiah = annointed They do NOT have the same meanings as you say. Mosiach in Judiasm is not necessarily a part of god- as christos is in cristendom

For me, a Messianic Jew is as much a Jew as a secular Jew or a religeous Jew of any denomination and a Jew who is not even aware he/she is a Jew. Jews are Jews. G-d's chosen people. Leave those Messianic Jews for what they are. They don't use any violence I promise you. If you are afraid of the truth you probably hate these people. If you love the truth, you love these people.

The truth is that believing in Jesus automatically falls outside the realm of Jewish law. These people are not bad people and they are loyal citizens. My issue with them has always been that they have a huge identity crisis. They can wear the costumes and run the long list of Jewish ritual, but believing that Jesus is the messiah IS NOT JEWISH. I blame liberalism for these sorts of problems. Because liberalism preaches no boundaries, everything goes. Unfortunately this is the symptoms of a liberal secular society. Jews need to strengthen Jewish identity within the family. This has been lacking for a long time now. Unfortunately, Israels secular progressive movements have done many things to destroy the identity of the TORAH and Jewish traditions. The messianic Jews are a result of the Israelis conveniently choosing when and where to be Jewish.

I have no problem with a Christian sect buying property in Israel and trying to convert Jews to Christianity. As long as they don't violate local laws and statues they could do whatever they want. However I do have a problem with those people calling themselves "Jews" and presenting themselves to other Jews as being "Jewish". Just because you have a large, round stomach, and toddle when you walk doesn't make you nine-months pregnant lady - same thing with being Jewish - a mezuza on your door doesn't make you Jewish - Jews do not believe that Jesus Christ was the Messiah. Period.

Surely the headline should read: "Frightened secular Jews stir controversy in Jerusalem." ? Because it's easy to hear the fear that stokes the anger - fear that they might actually have to start thinking about matters of the spirit.. Come on guys - are you so weak in your Jewishness that a small group of peaceful fellowJews moving into your community, yes and even practising their faith, can unnerve you? Or is the person accurate who said the upheaval was probably caused by an "outside" group?

My friend, you are sadly quite ignorant. Not ALL, in fact, not even nearly ALL, Christians hold to replacement theology. Only the lunatics who don't know their Scriptures follow that idea. And the good news is that more and more are waking up to the folly of that idea. Non-Jewish believers in Messiah Yeshua KNOW that Israel is the wife of Adonai, never to be abandoned, and that they themselves are wild olive branches, grafted into the root of Israel by the chesed of HaShem. As such, they honor Israel and stand with her against a hostile world. Don't be afraid of them. And while you're at it, give some slack to the Jewish believers in Messiah Yeshua, because they have the same mandate - to love and support their fellow Jews. May the G-d of shalom give you His shalom.

I did not equate the beliefs that the messiah is divine in the Lubavitch and Messianic Jews. All I am saying is that even if the Jews for Jesus are right and he was divine this fails to meet the test of a Jewish messiah. We still have war, we still have no temple, we still have no king - therefore both groups are preaching and trying to convert people to their mistaken beliefs that a Jewish Messiah has come. And if you think about it that Jewish heritage you refer to covers more than 60% or the world when you consider it is the same heritage that Muslims and Christians base their beliefs upon. Even so - the is not and has not been a Jewish Messiah. So these groups should stop preaching that he came already.

Sheesh -- so much for Israelis being champions of the oppressed in the world.... Why such fear, Rabbis?

Wow, an example of Jews discriminating against themselves. Sounds like Jews ARE like everyone else.

The picture in the print version was of a building on the corner where I live (Rechov's Ussiskin and Narkis) this is not a mostly secular neighborhood but rather is across the street from sharei chesed! A mostly charedi and orthodox area, as well as a moments walk from wolfson towers also predominatly observant and nachlaot no less teeming with religious orthodox jews. These "ex-jews" do not belong in rechavia or anywhere in jewish jerusalem, perhaps there is room in arab jerusalem for them. Jews for jesus is like saying PETA activists for the wearing of fur! It is anthema to all of our belifes as torah believing jews both orthodox or otherwise, the first commandment of which is "I am G-d and you will not have any other G-d's" and that includes "son's" of G-d.

This is a rough crowd. BTW, to find out who is Jewish, look to the Torah, not to the man made religion of rabbinical Judaism which is about religion, power and control rather than about loving HaShem and loving one another. (read your own hateful comments if you disagree) God chose judges, prophets, priests and kings, and never chose even one rabbi. That's interesting, isn't it. The word 'rabbi' is not even in the Tanakh. But in the absence of the Temple and with the help of the wisdom of men, the Talmud, rabbis have redefined "Judaism" for all (yes, even liberal reform Judaism)

Trust me, they are the best alies as you can have. Real patriots,good people and always ready to help.Behind them are evangelical christians who will always support Israel and its cause.Just like other Jews they believe in God The Lord of Israel.

You know, I've never been bothered by anyone from this messianic group, but the Lubatavich missionaries are on every corner, every store, with tacky yellow poster plastered all over the country displaying Scheerson photo (hey, looks like idolatry to me). They've even come to my house. They are driving me nuts!

"Whenever you believe that your religion is superior and that therefore ALL must adhere to it, you are on the path to CULTURAL GENOCIDE" I guess someone forget to tell Elijah that before he went and slaughtered the prophets of Baal. I have never met a Christian, gentile or otherwise, who claimed that everyone HAD to believe as they did. People are free to believe as they wish, and most Christians believe that. You also said: "MIssionaries were the cause of the destruction of Countless cultures and religions in the New World, the Philippines, Africa, etc. " Do you mean things like foot binding in China? or maybe widow burning in India? What about ritual murder and cannabalism? Yes, those are all things that dissapeared when Christianity spread to the regions of the world where they were present, and that is a GOOD thing. Christian missionaries are also responsible for more schools, hospitals, orhpanages, etc. in the poverty stricken parts of the world than anyone else in history. You, and many other talkbackers on this thread are disgusting. Are some professing Christians liars, deceitful, even violent? Of course, but millions have been decent, hard working people who sacrificed their money, time, health, even lives to help others. Lumping them all together as liars, etc. is a disgusting act of bigotry, and everyone making such comments should be ashamed of themselves. Its no better than some bigot talking about "big nosed, blood sucking Jews who all want to steal money." Any decent person, whatever their religion, condemns such language, even when leveled at people they dislike or disagree with. Grow up. Unless a person is physically attempting to force you to convert then they are free to believe as they wish. If you do not want to hear it close your door and say no thank you.