Jewish Scene
MK Ravitz: Positive discrimination needed in religious schools
Neta Sela
Published: 23.09.08, 07:17
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
32 Talkbacks for this article
1. In Chabad this is not an issue
Moshe ,   Brooklyn   (09.23.08)
In Chabad Asheknaz and Sefardic boys and girls go to the same school and marry each other.
2. a Jew by any other name is still a Jew, stop discrimination!
3. Jews are Jews, all united.
Zion   (09.23.08)
4. So What Positive Discrimination ?
Yitzak Ben Shlomo ,   Singapore   (09.23.08)
Positive discrimination needed in Religious school ? There is another version of statement avaiable in secular school, it is called POSITIVE DISCRIMINATION TO REACH FAIRNESS. In Malaysia secular education there is POSITIVE Discremination in getting a place in the University, in certain faculty, especially, law, medicine, dentistry,accountancy, economic etc. You want know why? Well it is the MUSLIM ( bumiputra) that get it all despite their incompetence and low exam results.During my earlier youth my chinese and indian brothers are subject to POSITVE DISCRIMINATION TO REACH FAIRNESS.As such no university places is available for our choice of area of studies that we favor much. The Article 8 of the federal constituition of Malaysia proclaims ALL ARE EQUAL UNDER THE LAW.And Article 8 being the federal constituition, shoul be the higest law of the Land BUT IT is NOT the CASE, There are other by lawswhich have the SUPERIOR OVERIDING POWERS that MAKE Article 8 subject to the SO CALLED POSITIVE DISCRIMINATION TO REACH FAINESS. Every oppourtunity is read subject to the Positive Discrimination Rule. It is not written anywhere as a LAW BUT a CONVENTION or a conventional rule. Failure of observance is siad would cause repercussion in the administration and society it seems. Well as jews we cant hold lands- even visit our jewish cemetry in Penang where the reamains of our grand are.Now what have you in Israel to complain? I am save and happy here in Singapore, At least I am a free jew at last.Why do you idiots want to BREAK and DIVIDE among the Ashkenazi and Shephardic- Ultra- Ortodoxy and Chabad. Why cant you there live happily like us here in Singapore.Cut the crap the worst place for us Jews are in Extremist Muslim Nations. When I am in Singapore I dont feel discriminated, because Singapore is founded on MERITOCRACY.dONT MIX UP RELIGION AND SECULAR SCHOOL,. They are two diffrent sparate instituition subject on the merits of their own separate fundementals. My only concern is the religious schools must ensure they teach relevant subjects for career and advancement. but not only teach religions. From the schools i have seen , the religious school are very holistic and complete unlike the Islamic religious schools that promoted blindness and spirit of animosity.So please try to sink into the shoes of the Jewish Schools System as the formation of such school are not of yesterday, It is one from the days of Noah, Avraham, Rabbi Moshe Rabiyanhu,....the names in succession cannot be stopped as it is our jewish heritage .And even the gentile like our education, As such why do you idiots fight over trivial matters.You idiots like it or not, we are TEACHERS and we carry such duty on our shoulder, it is a choice, burden, detriment and a joyful demand. The solution is RETURNING Jew must not expect the Isareli Jews to change for modernity BUT IT is for the RETURNING Jews to change an fit in. If yOU cant do that dont GO TO ISRAEL !
5. Let them become totally private schools
Maskil ,   JHB (ZA)   (09.23.08)
The solution is to let Haredi schools become totally private schools. Let them admit or deny who the hell they want, but let not ONE AGAROT of public (taxpayer) funds be spent on them. We’ll see how attractive the Haredi education system actually is when the playing fields have been levelled, i.e. they are not being funded to the detriment of the state educational system and out of all proportion to their contribution to the state purse.
6. Charedim
Nira ,   Israel   (09.23.08)
These Ashkenazi charedi schools would not let in the children of our forefathers in the Torah since none of them were Ashkenazim.
7. ???
Jew ,   Israel   (09.23.08)
Ashkenazic Jews with last names like Epstein, Blumenthal, Horowitz and a few others were Sefaradim 500 years ago and today they are Ashkenazim. Would their children be eligible for Ashkenazic schools??
8. wow
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (09.23.08)
ashkenazi against sepharic, secular against religious, left against right... seems like if it weren't for the external existential threats facing israel, there would be civil war within.
9. to Mike Judaism is plural
trumpeldor ,   eurabia   (09.23.08)
which explains diversity of opinions,origins,social behavior etc... would you prefer muslim unanimity ???
10. #1 Chabad kindergartens are delightful
gefilte ,   Israel   (09.23.08)
here in Israel. One super one in Givatayim. Our little grandson came home asking Ima for a rosh dag for the Rosh Hashanah table. It will be there, never fear. K'tiva v'Chatima Tova to all, to sephardim and to our own shameful ashkenazi community here in Israel too.
11. 9 - does plurality include messianic jews?
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (09.23.08)
no, of course not. that would imply that there is real, not superficial, plurality.
12. to #1
Susan ,   Kfar Saba   (09.23.08)
That's just the point. They don't want their kids to marry Sephardim.
13. Reality check
Mikesailor ,   Miami, FL   (09.23.08)
For Mike #8, you are correct. Israel is a conglomeration of different ethnicities etc. who all dislike each other and would devolve into a complete civil breakdown if not for the 'existential' threat of the outside world. But then the question would have to be asked: Is there really an outside 'existential' threat or is the threat more manufactured than real? If you read the Israeli media, or listen to the government, Israel and the Jews are always at the brink of some precipice and the 'world' is always against Israel, not because of the policies of the government but because everyone hates Jews. That is why 'peace" talks never get anywhere. Most Israelis have come to beieve that without the hatred and fear of the outside 'other', Israeli society will fall apart. The problem is...they're probably right in that assessment.
14. Apple versus Pear
shrinkDave ,   Miam Usa   (09.23.08)
At the very least, if either one cult or the other had anything on the ball, this might be interesting. But to get into it over who's witchcraft school will or won't accept who and why? Please. Go have your little internal war, irritate the rest of the world until they can't stand you any more, and let history repeat itself.
15. Oy Veh
Ben ,   Monroe, USA   (09.23.08)
Stupidity in the name of religious hierarchy. When will these "religious" fools ever learn that what really is being taught is hatred of the the Jew by another Jew. We see each of these little worlds define their mores as religious Judaism while blinding themselves to the real world. They are the reasons why shoahs are possible. SICKENING !!!
16. It would partly defuse the problem..
P ,   Philadelphia   (09.24.08)
If universal public education were mandatory for everyone, Sephardim, Ashkenazim, and even Christians and Muslims. Let religious education happen voluntarily in peoples' spare time - secular education is both higher quality and leads to more understanding in society as everyone has to rub shoulders.
17. #11 - mike, No such thing as "Messianic Jews"...
Joe ,   Ramat Gan   (09.24.08)
No such thing as "Messianic Jews". Anybody who believes Jesus was G-d is a Kofer. If you believe G-d was nailed to a cross and died 2000 years ago, you are engaging in Avoda Zara. End of story.
18. secular schools are infinitely worse - hothouse of depravity
Frumek Shmalzer ,   Lodz Poiland   (09.24.08)
which is why secular products haven't an inkling of jewish tradition only communism / homoqueer and Israel the secular country is about to drop dead .....
19. 17 thank you
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (09.24.08)
my point exactly.
20. # 13
What the hell is your problem anyway? Every one of your talkbacks sounds like some kind of anti-Israeli Tourette's Syndrome.
21. Why is this question being asked to MK Ravitz only?
S Judah ,   london   (09.24.08)
It is astounding that this article which attempts to investigate the apparent discrimination by some Ashkenazi religious schools against Sephardim has no input what so ever by a Sephardi authority. Now that is discrimination
22. #19 - mike, Cut off your hands...
Joe ,   Ramat Gan   (09.24.08)
Cut off your hands, your typing talkbacks is leading you to sin.
23. 22 grrrrr!
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (09.24.08)
the truth shall set you free. try it some time.
24. #22 Joe
David ,   USA   (09.24.08)
Cut out your brain and your tongue. They are making you sin. Sin is violation of Torah. Torah requires you to love the stranger. You may not agree with Messianics but you must love them. Talking hate toward them is far from honoring Torah. If the Messianics are wrong, then try to lovingly correct their error instead of spouting your hate. Do you fear them Joe? Are you afraid to sit down with them and have a good old fashioned Torah study, or do you need the permission of your Rabbe? Do you have a mind of your own Joe? Can you show me in Torah Shebichtav that you are correct? Continue to follow the Babylonian teachings of what you call Torah Shebaal-peh to your own destruction. Mashiach is Mashiach whether you believe in Him or not. No one claims He is HaShem, but He is Eloheim Yeshua HaMashiach! In case you don't know Hebrew Joe, that means He is the Power for your Salvation, the Messiah of Israel.
25. #24 David, you misuse the term Messianic
Nachshon ,   Philadephia, USA   (09.24.08)
The term Messianic Jews is wrongly applied to Hebrew Christians. Three times a day, a Torah Obrservant Jew prays during the Amidah the desire for the restoration for the Beit HaMikdash, and the coming of Mashiach. Torah Observant Jews believe in Mashiach and desire the start of the messianic age. So, we are "Messianic Jews". As far as Torah discussions, where do you find in Tanak that Hashem is a man? I can show you where Torah says he's not. Now is the time for teshuvah David.
26. #23 - mike, The truth has already set me free...
Joe ,   Ramat Gan   (09.25.08)
The truth has already set me free, mike. You, as well as any other seeker for truth, are more than welcome to do Teshuba, accept the Sheba Misvot Bnei Noah, and worship haShem and haShem only.
27. #25
David ,   USA   (09.25.08)
You obviously misunderstood me. I never said HaShem is a man. I said no one claims Yeshua is HaShem. I said Yeshua is Mashiach. Read it again. Also, I know what a Messianic is. I happen to be one.
28. 26 - how kind of you to prove my point yet again
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (09.25.08)
falling back into the ol' singularity of thought, eh? old habits are hard to break. all support is appreciated, though.
29. Now, class...
Ahavah ,   East Coast, USA   (09.25.08) this article over again, except this time every time you see the word "Ashkenazi" say "White," and every time you see the word "Sephardi" say "Black," and see how that sounds. It should be apparent even to the most intellectually dishonest person that the meaning is heinous racism and nothing else.
30. #24 - David, Cut off your hands too...
Joe ,   Ramat Gan   (09.26.08)
Cut off your hands too, for they are also leading you to sin. I will not cut off my hands because this commandment has no halakhic authority. It is a figment from the rich imagination of a 2nd Century CE scribe. However, the Tora requires me to sweep the evil away from my midst and that is exactly what I am doing. This may be a news flash to you but Jesus never existed. The New Testament contains numerous historical anomalies such as the visit of the Magi to King Herod after visiting Jesus (Herod died in the year 5 BCE) and the Slaughter of the Innocents that never took place. Outside the New Testament, the only "evidence" of Jesus' existence was fabricated by the Church. Now is the time for Teshuba. You may fool yourself into believing that you can run and hide from the Aboda Zara that is Christianity, but you should know from Whom you are hiding...
Next talkbacks
Back to article