Be careful what you wish for
B. Michael
Published: 07.02.09, 16:38
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1. Liberman is just.....
Bill Pearlman ,   New York, USA   (02.07.09)
a reaction to the actions of the Arabs in Israel. If they hadn't shown themselves to be a 5th column then he wouldn't be getting the support he is.
2. I have a question for B. Michael.
Terry ,   Eilat, Israel   (02.07.09)
You obviously don't like Lieberman which is your right. Then you go on & say that someone you consider to be wicked, evil, etc. is the true face of Israel. If this is what you think of your country, why do you stay here? You're free to leave, no one is keeping you here by force. Why don't you go to the UK where many share your opinion of us? Go to France, Sweden, Norway - they don't like us much either. I'm not being facetious or smart - this is a serious question. As to your article, surprisingly I must agree with you. The absolute last thing I would want to see is the IDF giving military training to Arabs. I'm not much on the loyalty thing either - I don't think it's even vaguely realistic to expect Arabs to be loyal to a Jewish state. You & I obviously differ on what to do about that question, most certainly. Lieberman is a most interesting phenomenon - I don't agree with many of his ideas but I'm glad he is politically astute enough to bring up some issues. These issues have been buried for far too long under wishful thinking liberal rhetoric & ''hide your head in the sand'' denial of reality.
3. #2 Terry, Eilat
Ofer ,   Kfar Saba   (02.07.09)
So according to your thinking, if B. Michael doesn't like the direction this country is heading, he should leave. So now you are the judge of who should stay and who should leave. Your negative posts here(often of people who have served this country with great dedication for many years) are constantly putting down this country. According to your own logic, perhaps you should be telling yourself to live someplace else.
4. Shtuyote Ofer(3)
Ari   (02.07.09)
"A Lieberman state does not deserve to have a well-groomed, polite, coherent and false face. It needs to get the face it deserves. To look just the way it is. Just the way we are. Because evil, just like justice, must be seen, not only be done." Read carefully ofer - "just the way **WE** are. Because evil, just like justice, must be seen, not only be done". Terry is correct. If the author - who is a fanatic self-hating israeli - thinks that a substantial component of the state is evil - he clearly says "WE" - than maybe he should leave. It is a legitimate question. Maybe yerida is the answer rather than remaining in Israel and inciting against/smearing whole segments of the population. Ofer, maybe you should join Michael. I hear the southern french coast is beautiful during the summer. You and michael can frolickle on the beach with all your PLO friends.
5. As an Israeli-Arab will be more than happy to join the IDF
Rami of Nazareth ,   Israel   (02.07.09)
on the other hand I expect my country to treat me as equal.... In the same determination that I fight Israeli's enemy.. i will fight those who deprive me my equal rights.... If you survey Israeli-Arabs you will find that the majority are for military/civil service...
6. ... What you wish for
Neal Rothner   (02.07.09)
Great idea! In the next war we can send them in first. For us it is a win win situation. Neal the Hasmonean
7. B. Michael's opinon piece
Robert Haymond ,   Ashdod + Edmonton   (02.07.09)
is utterly ridiculous. All Lieberman says about all citizens is that they should do national service in return for national insurance. There are no expectations about Palestinians joining the IDF. But I think this piece of fluff (which Michael's would like to pass off as Journalism) is written to frighten people into not voting for Yisrael Beiteinu, no other reason.
8. Disgrace
Conker ,   Israel   (02.07.09)
I see nothing wrong with "tens of thousands of proud Palestinian soldiers will go ahead and join the Israeli army. " . Why not ? We have thouthands of beduins and druzes protecting our country together with others minorities. Why arabs can't do the same and serve their country. Yes, its THEIR country as well,even tho they are minority. No wonder arabs feel like they are second sort citizens in Israel, its because of people with B.Michael's short sighted ideology are in power.You can't claim on one side that Israel is democratic and all citizens have equal rights and then deny arabs of their basic right to serve for their country, its retarded. B.Michael - you are a shortsighted fearmonger RACIST leftist idiot . Lieberman is NOT against arabs, he will in fact give them more rights , than they have now.
9. What's wrong with you?
Alin ,   Bucharest,Romania   (02.07.09)
To no.1 and no3...what is wrong with you?With the state of Israel in greatest danger ever, with worldwide antisemitism rising, with nuclear Iran at your gates, you are criticizing someone who wants to help you? If Liebermann will win the elections and will impose that law, most of the Arabs will flee.If, by Terry's supposition, some of them will be clever enough to claim allegiance to Israel, other measures could make them flee too. But indeed Mr.Liebermann is a courageous person who can stand his ideas and finally end the ostrich policy of modern Israel. The only danger for those who are criticizing him is that they will become a very small minority.....And don't worry about arabs receiving military training...they won't. More of that, Israel has a lot of supporters, most of them with large military capabilities, which outstands those of Middle Eastern arabs.The antisemitic wave is a wave; the supporters wave is a tsunami.Long live Israel!
10. @ Ari (4)
Rowan Berkeley ,   London, England   (02.07.09)
The expression "a fanatic self-hating Israeli" doesn't explain a single thing. It doesn't even sound convincing, since what you obviously wanted to say was "a fanatic self-hating Jew". I will always defend B Michael, one of the few opinion writers in the Israeli press who thinks for himself.
11. #3 some jews seem to stay here against their consciousness
they think the arab claim for this land is stronger then jewish claim, maybe anti-jewish propaganda wins them some point somewhere. since the arabs are healthy enough to want israel as well as the rest 99% of the middle east, so maybe these jews should just give them the keys to their homes in israel?
12. beware of (CFR) Lieberman
avi   (02.07.09)
13. #3, B Michael seems to just hate Israel
Danny   (02.07.09)
He seems to think that somehow we are the scum of the Earth, racist, war criminals so why stay here? Why not go to a blessful equal society like the UK that has no issues whatsoever with it's Islamic minority. PS My problem with B Michael is that he is simply a liar.
14. Excellent
zeev ,   switzerland   (02.07.09)
I think that all Israeli Arabs should join the Israeli army. In case they consider the war Israel is waging is unjust, they can drive their tanks on the direction they consider the more appropriate: Israeli arsenals, airports and Dimona Atomic Center. This is what can be called: cook the fish with its own fat. Excellent idea. I invite all Israeli Arabs to join the Israeli army.
15. #4 southern french coast
Pfer ,   Kfar Saba   (02.07.09)
Thank you Ari for the suggestion. Been to southern France already but in terms of lwhere to live, I think I will choose Israel. Perhaps you and Terry can start a one way travel agency to send away all Israelis who critique the country. I purposely did not comment about the B. Michael article and my political views in my previous post because they should not be relevant in terms of supporting free speech. But just for your information, i do not agree with B. Michael and my views are probably with the majority of the country. So your last comment about frolicking on the beach with my PLO friends just demonstrates that you are just an ignorant person.
16. #3 Ofer, Kfar Saba.
Terry ,   Eilat, Israel   (02.07.09)
I didn't say he SHOULD leave, I ask why he stays - which, given his attitude, is a legitimate question. I would honestly be curious to read his answer. I have read this expression, ''Israel shows it's true face.'' several times lately re: Lieberman's rising popularity & it's starting to sound like the ''party line'' from assorted anti-Israel sources. I believe it is copied by Israeli leftists from Arab sources (where I've been seeing it). Gideon Levy used the same expression in an article in Haaretz as well. I know that I would not stay in a country that I considered ''evil'' so I naturally wonder why B. Michael chooses to remain in this terrible place (in his opinion). My comments are not always negative but of course I'm more likely to comment when I disagree or when an article is patently absurd or one-sided. I don't ''put down this country'' - I put down people who, in my opinion, do not serve the interests of this country. It is true, however, that I have a very low opinion of Israeli politicians & our political system. I doubt I am the only one with such views.
17. You obviously don't understand how politicians think
Imanuel ,   Beer-Sheva, Israel   (02.07.09)
This slogan serving him as a method to communicate with average people. Lieberman is not as stupid as you think he is.
18. Come on Terry....
Mikesailor ,   Miami, FL   (02.07.09)
Explain your vision of Israel. Is it to be an apartheid state? A binational state with equal rights for all citizens? Is the idea to not only steal Palestinian land but to disenfranchise all who are not Jewish? Is it to continue a vision of 'Lebensraum' where "Whats mine is mine and what's yours is mine also'? And how about those loyalty oaths? Are they meant to engender loyalty to a 'Jewish' state? Or is it merely a tool to disenfranchise not only 'Arabs' but also any 'self-hating Jew' who might disagree with your or Lieberman's vision? Stop being a coward Terry and answer those questions which you and your fellow right-wingers continually try to obfuscate.l
19. #5 Rami of Nazareth, Israel
Terry ,   Eilat, Israel   (02.07.09)
I don't think the facts bear you out. While Druze & some Bedouin serve in the military, I don't think more than a handful of Arabs do. There is great opposition even to any form of National Service, forget the military. Your community's political leaders have been adamant in opposing any & all cooperation with the ''Zionist gov't.'' & have actively discouraged Arabs from participating. I think that it is necessary to separate the concepts of ''equal rights'' from the concept of ''community rights'' - equal rights apply to the individual & this is not at all what your leaders advocate. They see themselves & thus portray your community as a separate nationality within the State. This is unacceptable in our context. If, as it seems, you are a separate nationality, then logically, you do not belong in this political entity. Under normal conditions, I would be far more tolerent of such a state of affairs but our circumstances are far from normal.
20. Let B. Michael B the stalinist he is
Ilan ,   Ariel   (02.07.09)
Some dogs do not know how to learn new tricks, so if he sounds like a tired old soviet agent from the cold war, just accept that he doesn't go with the flow and is unable to find the creative ability to change his tone.
21. #5, you enjoy full civil and political rights
Alex ,   Haifa, Israel   (02.07.09)
in this country, care to explain how exactly you are treated unfairly by the state? I may agree with you on the fact that Arabs are sometimes discriminated against by private businesses when looking for emplyment, for example, although it rarely has any racist motive behind it but a simple matter of familiarity with the Hebrew language. There is a certain level of Arabophobia in the Israeli society, but it's a natural reaction to witnessing the pro-Hamas demonstrations in Umm-Al-Fahm and Sachnin. Why won't you and other Arabs who are willing to pledge allegiance to Israel raise their voices and publicly denounce these displays of hatred? That would ease the minds of many in Israel and show them a side of the Israeli Arabs they haven't been aware of before.
22. to 5
tFighterPilot   (02.07.09)
in that case, you should stop voting for Balad\Ra'am Ta'al.
23. #18 Mikesailor, Miami - FL
Terry ,   Eilat, Israel   (02.07.09)
You certainly throw words around with careless abandon. Israel is far from being an apartheid state so I assume you use this word as a form of propaganda without any understanding of it's historical context & the practices associated with it. Israel, as a great many other states, was established as the political entity of the Jewish people. Given our circumstances, a bi-national state is out of the question. I don't think this needs any explanation. I am not in favour of disenfranchising anyone, not for any theoretical reasons pertaining to ''democratic values'' but because of the practical consequences. I do not, however, believe in coexistence for the simple reason that it is not working. I have said many times that my opinions are not based on any idea of an ethnically pure state - I have no problem with Druze, Bedouin, Cherkessi, Hindous, Buddhists, Christians, black people, brown people, blond people, any people. I have a problem with hostile enemy people. I base this on evidence & nothing else. Does that answer your questions?
24. B. Michael
Mohammad ,   Jordan   (02.07.09)
I take my hat off to the author. The author and all Israeli liberals are the real strength of Israel. If the political arena is left to the maniacs "the rightist" Israel would collapse within few year.
25. Which "Palestinians"?
Igor ,   Cologne, Germany   (02.07.09)
'On July 9, 1954 the State of Israel issued an order for the army enlistment of "minority groups," which applied to about 4,500 Palestinians.' I'm sorry to have to inform you, but there were no "Palestinians" in 1954. In the sense of "Residents of the British Mandate Palestine" they have ceased to exist with the end of the Mandate. In the sense of "Arabs who, or whose at least one ancestor, at some point in time lived for at least two years on the Mandate territory" they haven't had formed by 1954.
26. How many of you actually served military service?
Conker ,   Israel   (02.07.09)
I will go to miluiim in 2 days (golan), and i honestly can say that i'd rather do it with arab poster #5, then with self-hating nutjob like B. Michael . Why people are so surprised israeli arabs are refusing public service and generally express anti israeli views lately, when our stupid leaders ALLOW islamic incitement on TV and papers, as a part of election campaign of certain arabic parties ? We certainly need an israeli analog of PATRIOT Act , and as soon as possible.
27. A request for Terry
Genuine Tosefta ,   Tveria   (02.07.09)
It may be somewhat off topic but I would like to have your opinion on this article: http://www.newmediajournal.us/staff/silverberg/2008/09282008.htm Although not complete I think it is brilliant on the aspects upon which it touches with truth in every word. It can serve as key to what works and why certain policies do not work in the Middle East. You mentioned somewhere else that you come from an Arab country, so your opinion will be valuable here but also for your thoughtful and nonsense approach.
28. Agree with #25,palestiians were called
Mike ,   Haifa   (02.07.09)
leftwingers (Jewish). Arabs never called themselves"palestinians". Don't be silly B. M. they like only one guy, and it is not Abbas. Have you ever taken a but and listen what they talk about.
29. as an israeli arab
israeli arab ,   occupied palestine   (02.07.09)
i would defenetly join the army , and in a heart beat without even thinking about it , and that is not because of the unconditional love that i have for israel , but for the unconditional hate that i have for the arab leaders , who abandoned us for the past 60 years and are expecting us to protect there stuiped aqsa and stuped jerusalem , while they sit around in there big comfortable chairs watching the palestinian children getting killed and all they have to say is "we condem " this and that ... if leiberman , which i despise can gurantee my enrolment in the army . then i would defenatly vote for him ....
30. sorry ofer
Ari   (02.07.09)
I was too harsh. this author just gets me really pissed off, thats all.
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