Jewish Scene
Rabbi Aviner refers to Baruch Goldstein as saint
Tzofia Hirschfeld
Published: 03.03.09, 15:03
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87 Talkbacks for this article
31. To #15 John
Texas ,   US   (03.03.09)
Yes, John, you can go to South Arabia and kill 30 jew, if you find any. So, when there will be no enemies on the Land of Israel, there wil be no need to kill them. It is allowed to kill in war, and as far as I know Israel is still in war with many (do not know the precise number) Arab countries.
32. Yes, James, as in every conflict there are 2 points of view
GZ ,   USA   (03.03.09)
Arabs are right but so are the Jews. Their positions are mutually exclusive. Arabs know what they want, don't question their cause and fight with all the means available. If only we were doing the same the conflict would be over long time ago. Instead, as evident by these talkbacks, too many Jews try to be nice and super moral. They "understand" the position of the enemy while failing to understand where they stand themselves. Decisive uncompromising action would spare both Jewish and Arab suffering.
33. Saints Don't Murder.
David ,   Marietta USA   (03.03.09)
Self righteous hubris! The abridged version of the Torah-the 10 commandments includes the mitzvah: "You will not commit murder." Not "you will not kill" as our goyish friends have translated, but rather, you will not murder. And for a doctor to murder makes the crime even more reprehensible.
34. Good heavens, stop justifying that murderer
Matityahu ,   Slovenia   (03.03.09)
Imagine one of your dear ones would fall under his shots and then try to understand his actions.
35. #23 Well, nothing
Dani ,   Israel   (03.03.09)
You are todally right, I completely against acts like these no matter from which side(Though I haven't seen that condems when terror is applied from the Palis-but I dont expect either). However, I todally disagree with you about what you call 'occupation', should I reming you that there has been Jewish settlement in Hebron for 3000 years? But since the Hebron Massacare in 1929 they got expelled till they returned in 67, so please dont bullshit about 'occupation' just because your'e convinced by the Arab violence, and justify the aggressor, just because they dont like to see Jews in their eyesight.
36. murder
Pierre ,   Canada   (03.03.09)
Thou shall do no murder. No execption, no excuse. Amen
37. #5
GP ,   NY, NY USA   (03.03.09)
Sales Dude, that is all that they are interested in. In the USA it goes by this saying... If it bleeds it leads
38. On "righteousness"
Marlene N. ,   New York City   (03.03.09)
Why not also say that Hitler was a righteous man, he just "erred" by happening to kill approximately 18 million people. In Israel "righteous" takes on an entirely distinct meaning.
39. Pseudolous smiles
Gideon Reader   (03.03.09)
The holding of one individual in reverence is a totally personal matter. Deeply held beliefs are the most personal thing any human can have. Closer and more intimate that the love of a woman or child. I do not begrudge any person their core belief. Those who revere Hitler or his positions are entitled. As are those who revere the God free marx or Lenin. Similarly, Baruch goldstein is a whollyy appropriate figure for reverence and respect of those whose sould are freed by upholding his actions as gold. The same goes for Yigal Amir. heroes are a personal thing and no one should intrude upon them. However if one wishes to invite debate by expressing those feelings, it should not be expected that full agreement and silence will ensue. The key is individual expression and the ability to say what you want.
40. The only saint...
Mizrahi ,   London   (03.03.09)
...Is the person to desecrate Goldstein's grave
41. rabbi didn't say he was a saint, as dr goldstein took lives
he said he was wrong   (03.03.09)
42. ynet, jews& israelis arent popular but not cause of religion
because they exist   (03.03.09)
43. to slaughter or not to slaughter?
charlot   (03.03.09)
Goldstein a saint?.And for Aviner the issue is complicated?I think that your head is complicated Aviner. Pol pot cracked ,so he killed millions. Mao cracked, and he ordered millions to be lilled. Stalin cracked, so he slaughtered millions. Do we have more crackpots of that magnitude? I think some Jews are getting crazy. And for all the righteous Jews, we don't have to emulate islam.
44. So many Arab terrorist from Purim time how would TBers react
if they were ,   glorified like this?   (03.03.09)
45. Goldstein and those who support him...
Mark ,   New York, USA   (03.03.09)
represent such a small minority of Israeli society they are not even worth talking about. However, in the Arab world those like Goldstein are celebrated and revered. That should tell you all you need to know about the deference between these two tribes.
46. Saints and Sinners
Marilyn ,   USA   (03.03.09)
Within our family, my mother describes the relatives as a collection of saints and sinners. Even with the more saintly members from the past not everyone agrees on this, cause they also had some rough qualities. Now with the Jewish people, it is more like almost every Jewish person in history is perceived as more of a saint, no matter what.
47. 38
Rachel   (03.03.09)
You have no room to be talking! While what Goldstein did was totally horrific. I sure never heard people like you ever condemn the Palestinian suicide bombers who murdered Israeli babies and their grandmothers at icecream parlors,or the suicide bombings of the elderly Holocaust suriviors celebrating Passover and other religious holidays. In fact,I often hear you excuse these murders because of the awful way the Israelis treated the poor terrorists families.
48. 43
Rachel   (03.03.09)
I agree,it saddens me to read some of these tbs especially where some Jewish/Israeli people excuse, or even condone this kind of indiscriminate,cruel violence and murder.
49. #18, LIKE THEM? LIE DOWN LIKE A DOOR MAT AND BE KILLED?
SICK LIBERALS ,   ..............DACON9   (03.03.09)
50. #12, you are incorrect.
JewishDragonfly ,   Torrance, CA, USA   (03.03.09)
He was stabbed. It wasn't right to stab him, he was already subdued, but he wasn't shot. There is no evidence of a cache of guns at the scene.
51. What he did was wrong, plain and simple, worse
David ,   Boston, USA   (03.03.09)
Worse beause he was Jewsh and it is wrong to do what he did in Judaism. What the Arab terrorists do is a crime against humanity. I condemn both, and wait for Arabs to condemn the crimes their brothers commit against Jews. When they do, peace will be possible instantly, but I doubt it will ever happen in large enough numbers.
52. #8, wtf, how sick. That is NOT the Jewish way
David ,   Boston, USA   (03.03.09)
This is not what Judaism is about hence there are only a handfull of people like this, unlike the MILLIONS of Muslims who act out and believe this way. Jews condemn what he did. I wait for Muslims to condemn their terrorism around the world. World peace will be acheived THAT day.
53. This shows how mentaly ill you are .
(03.03.09)
54. Thug praising thug.
Sammy from jordan ,   Amman, jORDAN   (03.03.09)
This Rabbi is a thug who is praising another thug. As they say, birds with feather flock together.
55. #31, those were CIVILIANS, bird brain!
John ,   Europe   (03.04.09)
56. AVINER
DAVID ,   HERZLIA   (03.03.09)
AVINER IS NOT A RABBI, HE IS COMPLETELY NUTS, TELL THE OLD GOAT TO SHUT UP AND STOP TALKING NONSENSE.!!!!! BARUCH GOLSTEIN WAS A MURDERER: PLAIN AND SIMPLE. SOMEONE WILL COME UP AND SAY THAT HITLER WAS SUCH A NICE PERSON, HE LIKED WOMEN AND ALSO LOVED DOGS, AND JUST ONE PROBLEM WITH HIM, HE MURDERED MILLIONS OF JEWS, GIPSIES, HOMOSEXUALS., POLITICAL OPONENTS, MILLIONS OF POLES, RUSSIANS AND OTHERS... SAME APPLIES TO DR. MENGELE.... BARUCH GOLDSTEIN WAS A MASS MURDERER.
57. glory for the undisputed terrorist
observer   (03.03.09)
58. YNET twists rabbi's words
Eli ,   Jerusalem   (03.04.09)
I think it is shameful that Ynet uses that headline when it is clear from his words that Rav Aviner said that what Baruch Goldstein did was wrong. Ynet, however, needs to find whatever headline it can to make the religious community look bad, so it came up with that headline, taking the Rabbi's words out of context. Ynet should be ashamed of its continued antisemitic propaganda against the religious community.
59. What can one expect.. when Israel has such
RJBH ,   Methil   (03.04.09)
a Succession of War Criminal leaders?While Demonising Palestinians is routine, Collective Punishment is a Normal Condition and The IDF Does more to murder and Kidnap Children than inflict casualties on a ragtag band of Freedom fighters.
60. #29 a detail
A Pole   (03.04.09)
This may seem like a small detail, but details tend to be important. The phrase "Polish death camps" is vague and prone to misinterpretations. Those were German death camps. Established by Nazi Germany and operated by Germans. On occupied (or, as in the case of Auschwitz, flatly incorporated into the German Reich) Polish soil. Therefore, a different choice of words (e.g., "travel to Poland to visit the death camps") would be most appreciated. Especially in the light of the TBs on the other two recent statements of R. Aviner... Cheers
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