so I understand one rabbi marries, the next annuls? What about the people who are victims of this incompetent practice. If there was civil marriage at least the innocent people would have some protection- If the Rabbinate is not competent and in charge- what good is it? If any rabbi can annul what the Rabbinate has accepted- there is something deeply flawed in the system-.

In Heaven's name stop this lunacy.

Is this what Judaism has come to? If someone wants to be Jewish, let her/him be! Don't mess around with people like this!

go to the mikvah?

can rabbis be declared insane? Who is in charge of conversions, the Rabbinate or some odd rabbi? Time for civil marriages to become the norm- then at least the State has some control instead of this waffling.... this is unfair to the converts- the rabbi who is so perfect ever though of the women, her children, her family etc.?

If this ugly sectant Sherman was ever converted? He's definitely not belong to Israel anyway.

'He also alleged'. Who is 'he'? Rabbi Sherman or the husband? The husband sounds as if he wants to get out of supporting her after the 'Get' and wants her to look insincere retroactively. Why don't they question the rabbi who converted her? Was it just for money or not?

This jackass of a rabbi does not represent Lithuanian Jewry or any rational and thinking orthodox Zionist Jew. He does represent a narrow minded ghetto mentality which is creating the seeds of a rebellion against his leadership and those of his generation

MOST NEWS REPORTS ARE ALWAYS SLANTED WITH AGENDAS. AND RARELY ARE NEWS REPORTS ACTUAL NEWS REPORTS. THEY ARE MORE LIKE CREATIVE WRITINGS WITH HALF A STORY. THESETALKERS WANT TO START A NEW RELIGION, a bagels and lox club void of Torah. Ruth was the daughter of a king. she had a choice of wealth of materiel world Or wealth of spiritual world. she had no other agenda other then to serve ONE G'D OF ISRAEL. COMPLETELY WITH ZTINUT INHERENT IN HER CHARACTER UNLIKE THE WOMAN WAS IT HER SISTER THAT BECAME went back to her father and became the mother of goliath... we dont need anymore erev rav goliaths in our nation, we have enough. IT SEEMS THAT DRUCKER HAS LOWERED HIS STANDARDS... mass conversions? lets face reality that its not a reality THERE SHOULD BE NO CONVERSIONS PERMITTED UNTIL THEY STUDY AS A NOAHIDE UNDER A RABBI FOR 2 YRS... GUARANTEED THEY WILL NOT EVEN COMPLETE THAT COURSE. THERE IS A COMMUNITY THAT NEEDS PROTECTION , MORE IMPORTANT THEN ONE POTENTIALLY FALSE CONVERT.

Erubin 21b. Whosoever disobeys the rabbis deserves death and will be punished by being boiled in hot excrement in hell.

thank you Rabbi Ashkenazi, I hope the majority of rabbis think like you do...... what happened here is very bad news for the family- and all those converts. The question arises: why would anybody convert to any religion, unless he was sincere? if they were forced- surely this would have been apparent. IF they were sincere why punish them because a weasel of a rabbi went through the conversion process with them- and did wrong. This does not reflect well on the spiritual leadership. Too many people in charge? Too much money involved? bribes? Whatever the reason- cases like this are a scandal. Hopefully the problem can be solved- all the converts that went through the conversion in good faith- and are now not accepted must be just devastated.

STOP TAKING OUT OF CONTEXT YOU ARE PUNISHABLE FOR STONING FOR TAKING OUT OF CONTEXT AND GIVING YOUR INTERPRETATION. OR WOULD YOU RATHER EXCREMENT... PLEASE STOP TAKING OUT OF CONTEXT... IN MATTERS THAT YOU DID NOT INVESIGATE EITHER THE LAWS FOR YEARS OF STUDY OR THIS SITUATION. BY THE WAY WHATS A BIBLE? LOLOLOLOL DACON9 jewswithviews@gmail.com

Why should people convert if not sincere , You asked . I think that they do it mostly to "officiallise" their "partnership" . Then they can be married by Israeli laws . I'm not talking of those who do it ONLY out of conviction .

I am an Orthodox convert with a high-tech job, ideas for a new startup, and am interested in moving to Israel because that's what Hashem wants us to do. But reading about arbitrary annulments like this, you can see I would have to be slightly crazy to do that. My children would never be safe from authorities like R.Sherman. I would be monitored, and if I missed Shacharit once, some Rabbinate representative would rip the Mezuzah off of my door and cast me out. It pains me to say it, but it is safer in Galut than in Israel for Gers right now. Is that what Hashem wants? Is accepting the convert a suggestion to be ignored rather than the rule now?

Charles, this seems a high price to pay- conversion is a long and painstaking process- I cannot believe anybody would go through this so they can be married by Israeli law- how about the people who go to other countries? Aren't those marriages recognized by Israel? If anybody really WANTED to cheat there are probably a number of ways- rather than go through an official conversion- and it seemed to have been official if it was accepted by the Rabbinate. Why were there so many conversions overruled? How can one Rabbi overrule the decision of a Rabbinate, that was my question? Who is in charge, who makes decisions?

Yes , people can go abroad [ Cyprus !!! ] get wed there , and have their union recognised . But to have their children recognised as Jews there could be problems if the woman is'nt Jewish .

are you seeing things? If there are no converts and the members of the community begin to doubt the spiritual leaders- how do you survive as a group? Potential converts? There is talk of many whose conversion has been annulled- how many? Thousands it says- is this a death wish? Maybe the solution would be to have conversions supervised by qualified teachers and spiritual leaders instead of any Joe who calls himself- what? A student of the scripture?

after a second thought; sure!, you aren't but Khazarian convert.

If G-d wants you to move to Israel - who is Sherman to stop you? But study what is *really* going on here. You may not like it.

WE SURVIVE AS A '''GROUP''..? YOU MEANT TO SAY, MORE ACCURATELY........ TO SURVIVE AS A *NATION*... A TORAH NATION.. WE SURVIVE BY BYAND MAKING BABIES BUILDING FAMILIES COMMUNITIES,, HOMES, AND PRAISE OUR WOMAN, RAISING OUR TORAH CHILDREN.. RAISING THEM WITH KNOWLEDGE OF TORAH IN THEIR FOOD AND WATER. and i dont nessassarily mean hasid..i am not hasid WITH EACH JEW PRACTICING AS BEST AS THEIR TRULY CAN.. REMOVE THE LABELS CATAGORIZING and separating JEWS LEVEL OF OBSERVANCE I AM A TORAH JEW, WE ARE TORAH JEWS OR WE ARE NOT JEWS AND STOP ALL CONVERSIONS UNTIL YOU GATHER THE LOST JEWS IN ALL THE CHURCHES AND TEMPLES IN YERUSHALAYEEM. until you gather the lost woman >forced into arab savery >married into arabs POTENTIAL CONVERTS HAVE TO BE WEIGHED ON THE INDIVIDUAL MERITS AND NOT AS A ''GROUP'' CONVERSION. #18 DO YOU KNOW WHAT HAMOR MEANS? YOU DONT? LOOK IN THE MIRROR.. ____________ #14 CONVERTS HAVE TO BE AS PERFECT AS POSSIBLE FOR WHAT PERIOD HAS OUR RABBIS OF OLD RULED? IS IT ONE YEAR..? DID YOU CONVERT TO COMPLAIN OR TO ACCEPT? AND #14 your comment is WHY MANY COMMUNITIES DO NOT ACCEPT CONVERTS. you are unhappy dissatisfied and complain wanting to change or accept a LESSER WAY. #14 dont make it sound so cold. Rabbis would interview you for your reason of not going to your morning prayers. Supposedly you accepted that heavy weight on your back because you wanted to serve THE ONE GD OF ISRAEL.... least you forgot THANK YOU DACON9 jewswithviews@gmail.com

From my understanding a conversion was never really a transformation of any sort into a Jew. It is instead a test to see if you do or do not have a Jewish soul. That's something you are born with and can't acquire. Observing the mitzvot is taken as an example of the person's sincerity. The theory goes that someone who really feels Jewish will yearn to do mitzvot. It is unfair and not a perfect test. But what is? It seems unfair that we have to test them this way, but it also seems somewhat precarious to take someone just at their word. They say actions speak louder than words. Especially when through marriages and the course of time generations could be misled into falsely believing they were Jewish. It is a difficult situation with a less than perfect solution. The truth is none of us will know until the moshiach comes..... And please don't attack me for this. This is just what I have learned from various Rabbis. I am not saying it is one hundred percent correct. It is just what I have been taught. I am always trying to grow in my Torah knowledge and this is just what my current understanding is with the info I have been given. I am open to any insightful respectful comments correcting any misapprehensions I may be laboring under.

#23 Yonatan, I understand what you are saying- and I am wondering about this. why even accept converts? There seems to be a lasting suspicion- those are people who convert of their own free will, they go to great length to learn and adapt. The moment they make a mistake there conversion is questioned? I am seeing a certain parallell to the conversos during the Inquisition: they were of course forced to convert, but years and generations later the church was still watching them, waiting for them to trip up and show their Jewish ancestry. I am probably going to get an earful about anti-semitism etc over this, but IF you demand conversion when marriage is involved, trying to keep the 'bloodlines clean' so to speak- then annulling conversions retroactively exposes a very imperfect system. IF the 'Jewish soul' is so crucial- and you believe that a 'conversion is never really a transformation into a Jew', then refuse to accept converts since they will never be truly accepted- this would be more honest- and fair.

The basic Halacha for conversion follows the model of Ruth the Moabite. The convert needs to assert that he/she will follow the laws of Judaism, women must go to the mikvah, and men must be circumcised. In the past living among the Jewish people was sufficient. Today all of the streams of Judaism have added the requirement of study and approval of a Religious Court. Once someone has received the approval of the religious court there should be no retroactive cancellation of the conversion, even if the convert does not follow all the laws Judaism, who really can follow ALL the laws. These acts of conversion nullification are not only inhuman but also go against the rulings of previous Rabbinical Courts which in the end will lead to complete chaos. These nullification should themselves be nullified.

Don't let the fringe stop you. It's wonderful here and really, 100% of the people you will meet will welcome you with open arms!

thank you Norman, this does make sense to me. I am just following this discussion and the article obviously raised many questions and some doubts. I understand that there are rules to be followed- the discrepancy of why converts have to follow the rules to the t- and Jews that are not religious, but have Jewish ancestry, should have advantaged a convert does not have, seems unfair.. Like having a big C mark on your forehead- once a convert- always a suspicious person? Like Jews having a guaranteed lifetime pass- and converts never really accepted? Your explanation is clear- and I hope this sort of see-saw does not happen again. It reflects very badly on the leadership, or lack thereof.

Although born a Jew (Ashkenazi) in the USA and educated (Reform) as one, I learned to be ambivalent about my heritage, at times antagonistic, at other times quite ashamed but always aware. I am the worst kind of Jew possible, rarely following our holy precepts and only occasionally contributing to the community. Nonetheless, I consider myself a Jew and, if challenged, would say: "I was born a Jew, have suffered as a Jew and will die a Jew. Neither you, no matter who you are, nor anyone else, can take this away from me!" Now let's compare me to someone who makes a conscious decision to become a Jew, studies for two years, practices in the way in which he/she was taught and is then converted in a Beit Din. What happens in Israel is that that person's Jewish conversion can be annulled whereas my status as a Jew is unassailable. It appears to me that there is something very unfair here, something completely unjust. Can any Jewish scholar explain this to me?

Whatever happened to the first law of a conversion – that you are never supposed to remind a convert that he/she is a convert. In fact, in numerous places, the Torah stipulates the legal equality between born Jews and Jews by choice in all laws: “There shall be one law both for you and for the convert that lives with you. This is a law forever for all generations, as you are, so shall the convert be before God. One Torah and one law shall be both for you and for the convert (Numbers 15).“ How many secular Jewish women, who were born of Jewish mothers, go the mikva and then get their Jewish identity torn from their souls?! According to Jewish law, any convert has all the obligations and privileges of any Jew born of a Jewish mother. This rabbi, if you can even call him that, is in blatant violation of both the letter and the spirit of Judaism when he discriminates against converts.

I wonder how this mad sectant can proof he's Jewish?