but won't let the same person make a decision about having a kid? Go figure that one out. Do they base the abortion request on the opinion that the child might not have a good life ? I didn't know God made life attainable only for rich kids who have two parents. They would have to be rich, to provide a perfect life for their children I suppose.

rant and rave about those outdated rabbis of irrationality who force their medieval opinions on everyone and refuse to be tolerant of everyone and blah blah blah see, this is me looking at things from a progressives perspective

Single women or men should reconsider having kids on their own. They need to consider the kids. Yes, they grow up loving their moms/dads dearly, but they suffer in a one-parent family. I quote a young man going through problems who said is single mom gave him the best youth he could ask for, but all he ever really wanted was to have a dad. This is not an isolated case and goes both ways. With or without religion--kids need a mother and a father.

be able to raise children or have children at all.

To put Rabbinical authority approval on a request for a single woman to conceive out of wedlock is to abuse and misuse the power of God given to them. That does not prevent a woman from conceiving from sperm from a clinic or the old fashioned way. It simply denies the authority under God to encourage unwed mother pregnancies. The Prophet Malachi said God hates divorce because He wants righteous children. It is very difficult for children to be righteous after a divorce. It is equally or more difficult for children to be righteous when born to a single woman. What is the point in having children if one cannot offer them a family setting that encourages personal righteousness? Ishmael was born of an unwed mother named Hagar in the Bible and God said Ishmael would be a wild man who was against everyone and everyone against him. His descendants have that genetic trait, too. Ishmael was an angry person and his descendants continue to be that way, too. So it was a great mistake for the Patriarch Abraham to have a child out of wedlock. Jesse in the Bible had a child out of wedlock, too, a child that defied the odds and became a righteous man with a heart after God's own heart: King David, who said in Psalms that in sin did his mother conceive him. Jesse was David's father, but the mother was not Jesse's wife. So there is hope for a successful outcome for a single mother, but not much hope. Isaac had to be protected from the bastard son Ishmael who mocked the son of promise who was born in wedlock. There had to be a separation to protect the righteous son. There should be separate schools for illegitimate children to protect the righteous children who do not have the burden of illegitimacy. Why? The anger of the bastards is often directed at the children who are not bastards. My great niece was beaten up in a school in the first grade on the playground in Edinburg, Texas, because she was smart (top student in class), pretty, lighter skinned than the other children, and because she was not a bastard. It is shocking how many children are bastards and even children by the same single mother often have different fathers. That is considered normal in most places with 70 per cent of Black children born out of wedlock. 50 per cent of Hispanic, and 30 per cent of White children in America. This is destroying the moral fabric and foundation of the family in the nation. What is the answer? The Bible answer is to stone the woman to death who is found with child out of wedlock to rid the nation of the evil.

I am horrified at what you are writing- this sounds exactly like fanatical Islam. Bastards- are you talking about children out of wedlock or abandoned by their BASTARD FATHERS who leave a woman to raise xxx children alone? I bet the majority are children without a dad, because dad the jerk left the mother..... so do we stone women who have no husband? Isn't the 21st century a glorious time? Back to the Dark Ages....

Obviously no one told him this is the year 2009 and people are not bound by religious law and apart from that we now have alterantive famailies. If a single women wants to have a child thats her right as is the right of same sex couples. If the examples of the family unit we have been seeing lately in the media is anything to go by it seems they are the last one to be preaching to others. They are obviously so insecure and see alternative arrangements as a threat to their "Boy meets girl and has children" mentality.

The mistake of our Patriarch was not to have the kid, but rather to throw him out. Ever thought this way, luv?

an out of wedlock pregnancy was stoned to death along with the woman before the birth of the child. Fornication was a death penalty offense unless the woman cried out when attacked and no one saved her. Then the woman's life was spared, but the male was put to death UNLESS the woman agreed to marry him and he could never divorce her because he humbled her. If the woman's father refused to allow his daughter to marry the rapist then the life of the rapist was spared but he had to pay a settlement which is now equivalent to the price of a house for the woman who was defiled. The woman and a child conceived from rape was not executed. You ask about the males who do not support their children or marry the woman who trusted them and was shattered. Rabbi Yeshua said through his follower Shaul that if any provide not for their own they have denied the faith and are WORSE than an unbeliever. That means eternal death. They go to hell after they die, not to heaven. King David supported every woman he seduced or raped or married or had as a concubine. The heavenly Jerusalem is called the BRIDE of the Messiah. I have wondered if that is because so few males go to heaven, Otherwise, the heavenly Jerusalem would be called the Groom of the Messiah or the Wedding Party. There is a wedding supper in heaven for the BRIDE of the Messiah, probably mostly women.

My sons grew up to be the best people of all the grandchilcredn on either side. My sons never got into any trouble, were happy, are happy and have loving relationships with everyone. Don't tell me G-d doesn't approve of us! I know many, many married owmen who are absolutely miserable and stuck. Don't tell me their situation is what G-d wants for women or children! These rabbis are all about keeping males in charge and cannot even fathom that it is possible to be happy and fulfilled w/o a penis ruling the house. These rabbis are the reason so many turn away from Judaism. My family is observant--without a rabbi!

Rivka, I think you're a bit confused. I'm not 100percent sure, and I don't have time to check now, but I believe that a woman who has a child when she's not married to anyone is not stoned. She has the child and raises him or her, and that's it. The child is not a mamzer. The problems arise when the woman is married , or officially engaged to someone other than the father of the child.

I am against these rabbis and their archaic way of thinking. This is also plenty of evidence showing a child in a loving single-parent house hold growing up well adjusted, and equally many, many examples of a child growing up in a two-parent household with a dysfunctional relationship growing up to pass on that dysfunctionality. So i ask you rabbis....should a woman rush out and get any man to marry in order to have a child? Seems like statistics works against you and the children I've seen don't do any better. But I suppose your answer will be to "become Orthodox, allow a matchmaker to find you a partner, then do nothing but push out babies while your husband recites Torah". A pretty high price to pay for the joy of parenthood.

if i was single i will never asked to have children .it is a big responsibility that it must be shared with other person which is the father but if iam married then for any cause the father was not presented by death or run away or divorced i will be interested to be a single with kids to take the high responsibility to grow the children .it is the only choice at that point

#13- Your situation turned out lucky but your attitude disgusts me. There aren't plenty of married men who are living a life of misery, for in a marriage only the man can be wicked and controlling? Seriously, this is the 21st century and it doesn't work that way anymore. Not only can a married man be suffering but a single man can be an incredible father and raise kids to be great, wholesome people. But I still believe the best situation is to have one mother and one father- something you apparently don't want, and favor single mothers. Look at the statistics- the majority of criminals, drop-outs, and other such people grew up with a single mother. I'm not saying a single father will do better, but having both parents is far better than only a mother. To #8- Maybe a majority of them indeed involve bastard fathers who won't raise their own children. But look at the attitudes of MANY, MANY women like #13. When a man really, truly wants custody of his child and wants to be a good father, often times his ex-wife will sabotage him and use all her power (often via false allegations of abuse!) in court to gain full custody over them, and then even deny him visitation rights. A LARGE, maybe not majority, but SIGNIFICANT percentage of children without a dad, are in that situation because their dad has been cruelly wrested from them by conniving mothers. Women are just as bad as men. We are in a new age, people.

according to "The Stone Edition The Chumash". The authors believe Keturah was Hagar. When Abraham died, both his sons buried him (Ishmael and Isaac). So they were somewhat reconciled at some point. But the spiritual blessing went to Isaac because he was the child of promise. That rankled Ishmael and his descendants. If Ishmael had been allowed to stay with Abraham as a child after mocking Isaac, that would have negatively affected the spiritual growth of the child of promise. The best answer is to do things God's way and have children that are conceived after marriage if the marriage is not adulterous. Divorcing a wife and remarrying is adulterous unless the first wife or husband was sexually unfaithful. Then only the innocent party can remarry without its being adultery. But Rabbi Yeshua said from the beginning there was no divorce and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery. He also said that whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery. So second marriages must be confessed as sin so the blood of the Messiah can cover that.

There is no such thing as fornication in the Torah, that's a word invented by the Catholic Church. The Torah recognizes that people are human. Consensual sex between a man and a single woman is not forbidden anywhere in the Torah. There are financial penalties for a man if he has sex with a virgin and she refuses to marry him, and he's required to provide for all Jewish children he fathers even if it's with a single woman who refuses to marry him. There are no penalties for a single woman getting pregnant. Chava is right, the only penalty for a woman is if the woman is married or officially engaged and has sex with a man other than her husband. That's the Torah definition of adultery and both the woman and the other man are put to death ONLY IF they were warned ahead of time in front of witnesses AND there are 2 witnesses. It's almost impossible to be found guilty. Women are never penalized for rape, the situation will affect the severity of the man's punishment. The ideal in the Torah is that one man marries one woman, neither having had premarital sex, they only have sex with each other, have a family together and stay married for the rest of their lives. While divorce and premarital sex are not considered ideal, they are not forbidden or penalized.

The child is only a mamzer when the mother is an adulteress, meaning she's married but she slept with another man and conceived as a result. Children of single mothers' are not mamzerim. Get your facts straight.

I realize now that your ideas are clearly from Christianity, which according to the Torah, is idol worship. There is NO Rabbi Yeshua, you are quoting the Christian Bible (what you erroneously call the new testament). You are falsely presenting yourself as one who is knowledgeable in the Torah and Jewish Law when you are really a heretic trying to mislead people into following your teachings. Your misinformation does not match what is says in the Written Torah and Oral Torah (Talmud) or the Midrash. Nearly everything you wrote is in opposition to the wisdom of our Honored Sages. Spreading such misinformation is also a violation of the Torah since you are effectively "adding words" to Hashem's Torah. Telling misinformation is a Killul Hashem (desecration) since it spreads lies about what the Torah (Written and Oral) teach us and their meaning. When people read this they ridicule the Torah and it pushes them away from Hashem. The Torah has no prohibition against a divorced person remarrying. Under the Torah a proven adulterer (Torah definition not Christian definition) must be killed so the point is moot. There are thousands of Halachically sanctioned marriages each year where one partner was previously divorced. They are approved by all Orthodox Rabbinate in Israel, the US, and around the world. This Christian is passing herself off as a Torah observant Jew and is spreading lies about the Torah based on Church doctrine.

their own eyes. That does not make it right in God's eyes. The body is the temple of God. Fornication or adultery is defiling the temple of God. Some say fornication is repeated adultery without repentance or perversions of some sort. Others say fornication is sex between singles and adultery is unlawful sex when one of the people is married or both are, but not to each other. Rabbi Yeshua said fornication is grounds for divorce, so sex between unmarried people establishes a one-ness that should be exclusively for marriage which is a kind of half-marriage which is as binding as an engagement or a legal marriage. That is perhaps why King David supported or married and supported women he raped or seduced. There was a duty to the woman and he did not want the Lord to accuse him of not providing for his own which would have kept him out of heaven. Since so few males provide for their own unless there is a legal marriage, I think few males go to heaven. They will be utterly suprised at their exclusion. Even sex with a harlot is a half-marriage or concubine marriage since the two become one if there is semen sex in the vagina which oral contraceptives and IUD's and diaphragms, etc. enable. I also believe that most marriages that are legal are not viewed as a marriage by the Lord since God's plan is one man one woman one marriage for life. I believe King David knew his one and only legal wife before God was Michael, King Saul's daughter that he detested and did not have children by. So, David confessed the subsequent marriages and infidelities for what they were to God's divine standard: sin. He confessed the sins to have them covered by the blood of the coming Messiah. That way David could go to heaven. The problem with most people is that they do not confess a remarriage or marriage after sex with another or assaults, or infidelities as sins. They prefer to think they are right than to confess they are wrong and have the sins covered with the blood of the Messiah whose names in the ELS Torah codes are Yeshua which means salvation (www.biblecodedigest.com) and Menachem Mendel which means comforter (www.arkcode.com). Yeshua said he would send the comforter (Menachem Mendel) to his followers. There have been many with the name Menachem Mendel, so it is more likely a spiritual being. Rivkah

David was despised by Michal, not the other way around, 2 Samuel 6:16. I believe your referring to the Holy Spirit also called Comforter, Helper, the Spirit of Truth. John 14:17&26

Michael despised David when she saw him dancing naked after winning a battle, that is true. King Saul knew her nature and hoped she would be a snare for David he was jealous of. But David also despised Michael or he would not have forced her to leave her second husband to return to him as his first wife after he gained the throne. King Saul had given Michael to another man in David's absence. But because Michael despised David and also because David knew the scriptures that once there is a divorce the former husband cannot remarry the woman, David did not have sex with Michael so she was childless her entire life except for her handmaid's children who were fathered by King Saul. Those six sons were slain to appease the Gibeonites who wanted seven males of Saul's seed to die for offenses against them to end the drought sent by God. King Saul was cruel to the Gibeonites who were from Jericho and they asked God for revenge and He sent a drought. Knowing droughts are a judgment from the Lord, David went to the Prophet after three years of drought to ask what the Lord was upset about. He said the Gibeonites were offended. Tell me. If your husband would not have sex with you to father children because you objected to his public nudity after a battle, became an enemy to your father who was jealous of him (not the husband's fault), then forced you to leave a second husband you loved when he became King, and then slayed the six sons by your handmaid your father provided for a family for you because your husband would not have children with you...Tell me, would you think your husband despised you? Loved you? King David did not pray for his enemies and his first wife was an enemy. He asked God to avenge him on his enemies and he was certainly avenged on Michael. David's claim to the throne was his annointing by a Prophet AND his marriage to King Saul's daughter. God cut off that line in the Davidic throneship because God hated Michael, too. Some Bible translations call her Michal (soft i and sh sound for ch), and others Michael (same as male name).

has a name: Menachem Mendel with Menachem meaning Comforter. The Messiah's name is Emmanuel (God with us) and Yeshua (salvation). The Christians believe the Comforter (Menachem Mendel) is inside the heart where the Commandments (Torah) are written. Better translations of the Bible indicate the Comforter (Holy Spirit, Ha Ruach) is WITH people where two or more are gathered in His name. My personal experience is that the Menachem Mendel is WITH me in catastrophic times such as the death of a beloved pet, the near death of me in a hospital, the near death of my husband, in a few churches or congregations like Koinonia House in Hanford, California, and B'Nai David Congregation in Visalia when Yosef Friedman was still alive. I have felt the Menachem Mendel (Holy Spirit in the form of a human) on the porch or near my door or in my house sitting on a chair or standing. I saw the spirit of an 18 year old beloved cat that died rise up and was a white color into the arms of the Menachem Mendel who was standing with my husband and me as the cat passed. Rivkah

What should a unmarried women do if she is raped and becomes pregnant? The whole article is just plain nonsense

raped who cried out and no one rescued her, who then conceived, to live and have the child. The child and its descendants could not enter the Temple or Tabernacle for a number of generations. The rapist was put to death unless the woman agreed to marry him and her father allowed that. A rapist could never divorce his wife because he had humbled her. If the woman's father objected to the marriage of his daughter to the rapist, then the rapist was still allowed to live since the woman was willing to cover his sin by marrying him. But the rapist had to pay a settlement that would equal to the price of a house nowadays.

The sages HAVE added many things to our tradition and now these issues are presented as if they were "Torah". How about the rabbinic restriction of keeping teh niddah days according to ziv'ah definition (which has caused the problem of "halachic infertility)? How about the added days of mo'ed which have been added by human beings (yes, the rabbis ARE mortal humans!) against the clear prohibition of the Torah itself to add or diminish it? You're right about Rivkah and her masquerade as a Jew plus Torah-learned person. But our tradition has many of man-made elements and it is a crime to state they're from HaShem.