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Haredim, seculars clash in Jerusalem
Efrat Weiss
Published: 29.08.09, 20:04
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33 Talkbacks for this article
1. Use force
Lawrence ,   Jerusalem   (08.29.09)
These common, anti-zionist thugs should be stopped. Their shouting and protesting ruins shabbat for all of us who neither drive nor are ultra-orthodox.
2. The city is encouraging the violence
Mark ,   New York USA   (08.29.09)
The Jerusalem municipality is encouraging continued protesting by reacting so softly. If hundreds were arrested and kept in prison, the protests would stop. If not, use rubber bullets and tear gas. Why should police risk their safety when the city clearly does not have their backs?
3. THIS CRAP NEEDS TO STOP
Brian ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (08.29.09)
These asses are just disgusting, who disrespects Shabbat worse than these clowns? Calling Jewish police officers nazis disgusting, something needs to be done, why is this crap allowed to continue week after week? We don't have enough problems already? The Mayor of Jerusalem is absolutely useless, these rioters throwing rocks and disrupting the city need to be crushed. Not to mention they are a complete embarrassment. I am in no way prejudiced against the Ultra Orthodox, and in no way do these asses represent the greater Ultra Orthodox community, or any form of Judaism, these are fanatics and simply need to be crushed.
4. These haredim must stop desecrating the shabbat.
dave ,   uk   (08.29.09)
5. The Mayor and Police Chief
Sagi   (08.29.09)
should resign.
6. Stops these Huligans
Ruby Asuleen ,   Coral Springs Fl USA   (08.29.09)
The Jerusalem Police has a place for these HULIGANS..they need be in Jail not in the street. Since when Do we have other sets of laws? They beat our policemen..ON SHABBAT..Vandalize..etc... May peace come to Jerusalem...
7. As a USA resident......
Steve ,   NYC   (08.29.09)
As a outside observer i can not understand if israel is a jewish state how can the state allow shops and parking lots open on the Sabbath the Bible clearly prohibits this?
8. The thought of honoring Shabatt is Nonsense!
(08.30.09)
9. What is Shabbot?
Ezra ,   US   (08.30.09)
I mean, that's only for Torah observant Jews! Who in their right mind would think of acting Jewish?! The Untra-Orthodox need to purchase the land....quickly.
10. #7 Because it is 2009....
Rational Jew ,   Earth   (08.30.09)
....and we are not living in biblical times. Yes, as a Jewish state Israel should have some of it's religiosity and legal laws overlap, but what about the __% of Jews and non-Jews who are citizens of Israel and do not follow the 'gold standard' that the orthodox believes their view of Judaism is? If a state forces it's religious laws upon all citizens, that is oppressive to the secular citizens and therefore, as the bumper sticker says, "A religious state, there goes the state" No one gets hurt if the parking lot is open. But people can not do their daily routines as easily if it is closed. These ultra orthodox fanatics need to start worrying about the drugs, abuse, and neglect in their communities(we all know it's there) instead of a parking lot.
11. # 7 Steve
Ben ,   Monroe USA   (08.30.09)
Israel is a state for ALL Jews, not a Jewish state. There is a difference. One: not all Jews are orthodox. Two: there are Muslims and Christians who do not adhere to Torah law. Three: the herediim have no right to riot, especially if they are so religious; on the Sabbath.
12. Who is the real Meshiach
Isaac Hager ,   Monticello NY   (08.30.09)
Harav Shmuel Izik Popack from Brooklyn is the new Meshiach
13. iranian haredi link
Barak Omadoff   (08.30.09)
The polie should investigate the possible link between these anti zionist crazy haredi lunatics, and the iranians. I see a Iranian hand in all thes edemonstrations, taht begin, exactly when hitlerminajad fakes election being disputed by a majority of Iranian youths. Anyway, the cult leaders of these "haredis" have been seen more than once hugging, and kissing the iranian monkeymaster. I don't see why Israel don't send border guards to quell thes e rioters, who deserve teh same treatmant than palestinians. period
14. shabbat
colin   (08.30.09)
Why do the police continue to treat these scoundels with respeact. Use your stcks,poke out a few eyes.break the bones in legs and arms.ctack open a few heads.and the people of Jerusalem are with youofficers all yjr way. Stop the parasites monthly stipends to pay the damage but start use excessive force on this rubbish
15. #7 move here & understanding will come!
(08.30.09)
U c Steve it says in the bible that all Jews should live in Israel! If you are Jewish then move here and you will understand why Israel isn't a Theocracy!
16. Smokescreen for changes mayor is carrying out
(08.30.09)
these protests are nothing more than a cover for the mayor's right wing activities which go unnoticed because the secularists are being kept busy by the ultra-orthodox!
17. these are brave people for standing up for what they believe
yakov ,   jer is   (08.30.09)
i see no other sector willing to take blows from an overlywellming superior force. everyone is only interrested in their own good.the mayor is definatly anti-haradi. they're not doing this for no reason. and they'll win in the end thats what bothers secular people
18. To number 7 - Steve
Zanvele der Treger ,   Meah Shearim   (08.30.09)
The vast majority of secular Israelis could not give a Damn about the Bible or Judaism. They would jump at the chance to move to Europe or the USA. This is in contrast to secular jews around the world who at least have feelings towards religion and judaism even though they are non-observant.
19. To number 15 - Liar!
Zanvele der Treger ,   Meah Shearim   (08.30.09)
It does not say all Jews must live in Israel - (aside from the fact that Israel is a brand new invention of the non-religious Zionists). Else all the Jewish leaders like the Chassam Sofer, all the Chassidic leaders, and sefardi leaders would have lived there! And who are you to talk about what is required to be done, if you keep nothing! Nothing!!!
20. To number 6!
Zanvele der Treger ,   Meah Shearim   (08.30.09)
The Israeli police are the biggest hooligans (learn how to spell btw). Look at the photos.
21. #7 Jewish State
Eliyahu ,   Yrushalayim   (08.30.09)
Because the term Jewish and "Bible" is clearly not synonymous today. . By halacha, one born of a Jewish mother is a Jew. After that anything goes. This truly is a Jewish state because in reality most Jews fit the description of having a mother that was/is a Jew. Now you must separate non-selective Torah observance from partial observance / non-observance. Only logic dictating halacha will solve this conundrum.
22. To number 21 - Elyiahu
Zanvele der Treger ,   Meah Shearim   (08.30.09)
What do mean "anything goes"? Jews have to keep the Torah. No ifs or buts about it.
23. to #7 where in the bible is mention don't drive a car?
ghostq   (08.30.09)
just let people park anywhere they want to cause they r not disterbing the peace, it's the haredim who make all the troble the parking lot is not even in their neighborhood. there is persobal fredom. this isn't Iran you know.
24. Zanvele , Seculat Atheists make Alyah too
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (08.30.09)
And not to return to Europe . I did it . Those charidim : in drerd zollen zie gayn ,
25. "Ultra Orthodox" thugs
Spencer ,   Israel   (08.30.09)
These violent demonstrators should not be categorised as "Ultra Orthodax". As far as I know real ultra orthoox Jews don't desecrate the Shabbath; they don't call fellow jews, especially those Jews who uphold the law and protect the citizens of Israel, "Nazis". Our police force should be armed with batons and instructed to show no mercy to these thugs. Wade in and smash them. Then arrest them and charge them. They will soon disappear into the sewers where they belong! ZERO TOLERANCE is the name of the game. Adopt this "zero tolerance " rule and clean up not only the street of Jerusalem , but also the rest of Israel. If it worked in New York it will work here!
26. #7 Steve here are some facts for you
Avi ,   Israel   (08.30.09)
You seem to be under the illusion that Israel is a state that is run according to Jewish law. Israel is a democratic state that accomdates all jews and has a democratic law, not relligious law as you seem to suggest. There are secular people, the very people who pay taxes, work , serve in the army and it is their democratic right to visit their capital on Shabbat if they feel like it. Jerusalem belongs to all Israelis and not just a fanatical anti Zionist sect who think that they can prevent freedom and democracy through violence.
27. # 22 sorry but i beg to differ
Avi ,   Israel   (08.30.09)
Sorry i maybe Jewish as my mother is Jewish but i do not belive in the Torah nor do i live by its rullings. if being jewish for means having apple cake at Rosh Ha Shana well thats my right. It is a persons basic human right to belive or not to belive, So have a nice life, be religious but you have no right what so ever to tell other people what to belive or to tell them to live a religious life according to a set of rules they neither accept, or bleive in. So please keep your religion of hatred and intlollerence out of my life thankyou very much. At the end of the day, religion is a belief a faith. But control our thought you do not.
28. My understanding is....
Steve ,   USA   (08.30.09)
My understanding is the the right that the Jews have to the land of Israel is because thats what G-D gave to the Jews, but if the jews meaning as #10 said "....and we are not living in biblical times" then what right do the jews have to steal the land from the arabs?
29. Haredim VS God.
jacques   (08.30.09)
As usual,the routine weekly riot, vandalism, mob action, by God's preferred sons takes place on Sabbes' as prescribed by HIM and revered by the " fanatic Black thugs "; under the benevolent, incompetent judges, the worthless Mayor, and the poor "lenient "cops under poor leadership. I think that our lawmakers are waiting to see when and how much blood is flowing in the street of our Capital (listed by our papers the dirtiest city in Israel)before deciding to have a meeting in order to decide the next course of action ----- next month !
30. being shomer shabbat
johanna ,   tsfat   (08.30.09)
doesn't include dishonouring shabbat by throwing stones, screaming at police etc. how is that an example to jews who don't yet keep shabbat i don't know. i wish all the rabbis would speak out against this desecration. after all, some of the people using the parking lot may not even be jewish and therefor don't have to keep shabbat. if the staff are non jews, what is the problem? i speak as someone who is shomer shabbat. if the protesters want to encourage people to keep shabbat, let them offer a kiddush, grape juice and cookies,and /or invite the secular into their homes to see how beautiful keeping shabbat is, instead of shouting at them and throwing stones.. no one would want to keep shabbat if they think that's what it is!
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