Haredim block murder investigation in J'lem
Efrat Weiss
Published: 31.08.09, 08:48
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1. Why is this terror allowed to continue?
Oren ,   Or Yehuda   (08.31.09)
Instead of releasing 450 jailed terrorists for Shalit, we can offer them these people
2. Seems that Civil war has begun
Avi ,   Israel   (08.31.09)
Just when you think these charideem thugs cant sink any lower they surprise us once again. Enough is enough they know they can get away with anything, dont work, dont pay taxes , dont serve in the army dont obey the law, would this be tollerated in the USA ?
3. This is becoming insane.
Roman ,   Lod, Israel   (08.31.09)
I can understand the fear of the body being autopsied, which doesn't seem required in this case as other means of clearly identifying the cause of death for a court of law are available, but this? This behavior is Hillul Hashem, quite frankly. There are other means to prevent unnecessary autopsy, means that don't require vandalism and assault.
4. Also, to add to my previous comment,
Roman ,   Lod, Israel   (08.31.09)
as usual I am left quite tired of the quality of writing on Ynet. "Haredim" prevented proper police investigation by starting a riot? As in all Haredim, all around? Any self-respecting journalist would provide more accurate clarification regarding the event and its participants rather than simply identify the people as members of a religious group. This is *exactly* the same as writing "A Jew embezzled funds on Wall Street" regarding Bernard Madoff. Yes, he's Jewish, but that's not why he embezzled funds, and nor are Jews inclined toward such actions - the above article quite openly implies that Haredim *are* inclined toward violence as a rule, and that crosses the line of impartial and accurate journalism and into bias.
5. 1
Glorya   (08.31.09)
Wonderful idea!
6. Why don't you mention the reason for the protest?
Because these reshaim are insisting on an autopsy. What do they need an autopsy for if they know the reason for the death other than to steal some body parts?
7. Harediim in Jerusalem
Barbara ,   Haifa Israel   (08.31.09)
Oren - I agree - Let's move them to Gaza or behind a border or even better give them their own ghetto. They seem to want it.
8. The police grab the body to defile it and then they wonder
A Jew   (08.31.09)
why they're being called Nazi. What do they need to make an autopsy for? The hareidim are absolutely right. That's the only language the police understand. Whoever doesn't believe that there is police violence REMEBER POLICE VIOLENCE IN AMONA.
9. # 4 Roman time to face reality
Avi ,   Israel   (08.31.09)
'The charideem are inclined to violence" Well duh !
10. murder in J'lem
jo moor   (08.31.09)
Excuse me/ slicha bevakasha!!!!! In any civilised country death from unnatural or suspicious causes requires scientific investigation which more than likely requires an autopsy If you dont respect the law of the country that you live in, then leave ..... the sooner , the better. Defile not the ground that you stand on etc etc
11. I Don't Understand Why ..
Christy ,   Boston, US   (08.31.09)
this is tolerated. Why aren't there mass arrests? Why aren't police using water cannons, etc. to stop the rioters? I can't imagine what it must be like to live there and have to put up with these riots every weekend!? Think of the non-rioters trying to live peacefully near these rioters!! Many who are Haredim have written and said they are disgusted with these riots also. They've been asking for more aggressive tactics by the police to stop this. So why is the mayor (and the police) not being more aggressive with the rioters and stopping the riots by mass arrests? Why aren't there more arrests? Why do the civil authorities seem so reluctant to act against these rioters in a way to discourage future riots?
12. 4 , YES , it were charidim who attacked the police
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (08.31.09)
dispatched to this hostel , before there was any question of removing the corpse . It are those guys , and YOUR reaction , that made me become intolerant towards all of you . And this i will NOT forgive you .
13. they don't have any morals at all
ghostq   (08.31.09)
murderd abuse mothers and violent riots. they r buying the express way ticket down and by down I mean hell.
14. #9 Sorry, Avi, but that's BS.
Roman ,   Lod, Israel   (08.31.09)
That's like saying "Seculars are inclined to violence" by looking at Bel'in protests. Or taking youth crime statistics and saying that, because some secular youths are criminals and are part of gangs, then *all* seculars are inclined to violent crime. As in naturally inclined. Without exception. And that, Avi, is nothing more than a generalization based on bigotry.
15. #2 They work, pay their taxes, and thousands of them serve
Roman ,   Lod, Israel   (08.31.09)
in the army now that the army actually bothered to set up programs for the Haredi public. Some of them are violent. Some seculars are also violent. It's not Haredim who run crime families in Israel, but does that mean that I should paint all seculars with the same brush? Talk about how "secular criminal behavior" would not be tolerated in the US? And yet you see no problem with the reverse, because it's *you* talking about the *other*. Well, that stuff goes both ways, and it's people like you who make insluar ultra-Orthodox living in Me'a She'arim fear state authorities, and think of the police not as people who protect them but as people who come to snatch the bodies of their dead to Abu Kabir. Because when they complain about it, you couldn't care less. Quite the contrary - you find their problems to be laughable, and seem to revel when they suffer. Well, congratulations - you're part of the problem.
16. dress rehearsal for the big show to follow
Move over Madonna/Esther. We have our very own toldos aron sadistic mother act coming very soon. Poice will be wimps there too. Pretend theyr'e Gush Katif people you big police guys...
17. just wait and see whats going to happen
chicago   (08.31.09)
first it was the palestinians , now the haredim , next the ethiopians , after that the russians , and then the africans , and i wouldnt be surprised if the police came out and started rioting . this is israel , a country full of hate and racisim , even against each other
18. #12 Read my comment in #3.
Roman ,   Lod, Israel   (08.31.09)
I don't approve of violence in this case at *all*, Charles. I don't approve of riots, or vandalism, or assault. But it doesn't look like you care. You're just making excuses for your intolerance instead. And not only that, you twist the facts as stated in this very article - it clearly says that the conflict arose when police tried to remove the body from the crime scene, which in itself is clearly due to concerns of autopsy. By all means, Charles - I'm the cause for your intolerance. My reaction of condemning violence *and* saying that the article as-written generalizes against an entire public and implies that it has an inherent affinity to violence is why you act as you do. Yeah, objecting to violence and objecting to bigotry... it is indeed the recipe to be hated by those who *already have a bigoted world view*. At least you finally admit your intolerance instead of trying to pretend it isn't there.
19. Interesting that Ynet forgot the run over of a "haredi"
m   (08.31.09)
by a police car. Also the way this article is written minimizing the real story that an Arab KILLED a Jew again (not terror attachment =not important) is a non story for the hating religious people Ynet.
20. Demographic threat
Aviva ,   Jerusalem   (08.31.09)
Why is it then when Israelis hear about an increase in the Arab birthrate (no matter how exaggerated it turns out to be), they become frantic to create a new state for them, to give them everything they want. While an increase in the Haredi birthrate makes them frantic to want to defeat and crush them. Meanwhile, those of us Haredim who have university educations, professional careers and send our children to perform their duty in the IDF, are called by the derogatory name of "Mustards" and then we are completely ignored as though we don't even exist.
KACH 613 ,   Judah, Israel   (08.31.09)
When will we learn??? Everyone is missing the point, the hedline of the story should rea ARAB EMPLOYER MURDERS HIS JEWISH BOSS. But Ynet will just fucos just on hate of Charadim.
22. #15 Torah teaches us we are NOT to obstruct the truth.We are
wrong in this & need ,   to admit it. Rueben   (08.31.09)
23. Way to go Roman, Lod!!!!!
Andy Kutnofsky ,   Jerusalem Israel   (08.31.09)
Well done for the great comments - I'ts clear that the very large majority of Hareidim totally disapprove of this kind of behavior. They see it as intolerable, crazy and want it to stop as much as the police and everyone else. This violence is one small part of one small group and although many Hareidim may agree as to what the issues are that caused the riots - they totally disagree about how these violent mobsters are behaving and wish it would stop. The real askanin are working behind the scenes to calm everything and solve the issues in a respectable manner
24. It's difficult NOT to run over a Haredi with a car
Allegra ,   Jerusalem, Israel   (08.31.09)
I see Haredi riots from my windows in Jerusalem every week-end and I'm actually amazed that they don't get run over by a car more often., These people are completely insane, they shout hysterically and run frantically everywhere and literaly jump in front of cars, including police cars. The worse being that they also encourage their children to do the same. As for Haredim who do work and do pay their taxes... what about organizing peaceful demonstrations in Jerusalem every week-end to protest the behaviour of the other Haredim?
25. Haredim, Haredim ....
Salomon MOYAL BLOCH ,   Zürich, Switzerland   (08.31.09)
Mr Weiss, Just laughing at the style of your article. You belong to the kind of media who are totally biased at reporting about the Charedim. Sometimes I do wonder how far you are really from Dr Geobbels's style and his Stuermer. As soon as you are talking about the Charedim you Israeli are become insane in the membrane, irrational, and totally out of control. The profound hate which is innoculated into your children from the earliest age is something which is gonna to backfire at yourself. You can choose the methods of the nazis but never wonder about the Swedish press. The medias in Israel are a lot worse. The medias in Israel are spoiling the whole image of Israel throughout the World. Your definition of Journalism is something you will find in the third world countries by most of the moslems countries like Iran...For this kind of journalistical performance and science it's a pure waste and a pity for the money invested in the israeli journalistical universities. Your level is extremely low even if your fassade defends some vague similarities or ressemblance with the left. I am always extremely sad about the number of potential readers reading your lines... You call it information. I am calling it pure propaganda in best Goebbels style. Best Regards Salomon
26. #1 your proposal is the result of reading israeli papers
Salomon MOYAL BLOCH ,   Zurich, Switzerland   (08.31.09)
Mr Oren, You don't really need to consult. Just reduce a bit the quantity of isreali papers you read. If you can help it just go to work BTW is Shalit not too Charedi, in that case just let him there. Keep well Salomon PS: the traumatical event of the charedi woman is better documented in the free world abroad.
27. #1 Efrat Weiss, you achieved what you wanted
Salomon MOYAL BLOCH ,   Zurich, Switzerland   (08.31.09)
Seeing your reaction Mr Oren, i think that Mr Weiss must be proud of his work. Talking about violence I don't want to offend you but the Israelis are really mostly 'loaded' of let's say a lot of destructive energy! You just need to trigger with that kind of article, the reaction is coming!
28. Roman , Not you specially are the reason
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (08.31.09)
It clearly states that the conflict arrosed when the police tried to remove ....? Not as i have read the headline . 1] police arrive at scene ... 2] haredi throw ..... 3 ] set police cruiser ablaze 4 ] try to block removal .... [ numbers are mine ] So Throwing stones and setting cruiser ablase occured BEFORE the police tried to remove the corpse . Listen , those extremists have made me becoming intolerant towards them . You too disapprove many of their acts , i'm a step farther . Generalise . Did we hear some of the Charidi leaders condeming them ? I did'nt see any in the secular press .
29. lets see both sides...
C. MOORE ,   JERUSALEM IL   (08.31.09)
theres always another side but yet the foolish are always quick to point fingers! Obviously the police must follow their orders and also prevent protest's turning into violence. However haredim are not violent or irrational people and when we see them going against their usual peacfull principles we must ask ourselves, why? In this specific case the reason for protest was that the body of this murdered man was to be cut open for autopsy which is against halacha and completely unnecessary in the case of a stabbing, which would seem to the religiouse public as an anti-semitic and disrespectful action... The protests were to save the discrace of the poor victim of this terror attack, and definately not to simply block the murder investigation! (As stated in the heading) Thank g-d there are still some people in ths so called JEWISH state that actually stand up for JUDAISM!
30. #28 Charles, don't you know article structures?
Roman ,   Lod, Israel   (08.31.09)
Inverted Pyramid - The most essential and interesting parts of an article are placed at the top, and the article then continues to expand on that with supporting elements in diminishing order of importance. Nowhere does *chronological order* feature. And I should think that the full stop before the last line of the first paragraph clearly marked the two events as *parallel* matters, where the last detail in the paragraph was used to further elaborate on the previously mentioned details. That's basic reading comprehension.,7340,L-3769534,00.html Here's the original Hebrew article, should that be easier for you. Please note that there, also, it is quite clear the chronological order was not "Haredim protest for the heck of it when they see police, police try to remove body, etc.", but rather a clear matter of starting a (violent) protest in an attempt to prevent what they perceived as desecrating the deceased body. This is in no way a justification of violence - merely the facts, nothing more. Also, Charles, when do you ever see religious leaders in the secular press, unless they hold official titles of the state? The answer is almost never. Have you perhaps considered that the secular press isn't actually trying to interview Rabbis at all? They tend to speak out quite clearly in those places people *do* bother listening to what they have to say, which is why you'll see more than enough of such criticism in religious newspapers.
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