These are some smart Jews, it should be the persons choice, circumcision should be illegal for babies, even Jewish babies, who says they will grow up and want to remain in the Jewish faith. Thank you for letting your son choose.

not the parents body, not the parents decision

now, its bad enough that you mutilate baby's penises for religious reasons and force your religion on them, but don't go spreading bullshit about health reasons, there are no health benefits to circumsion, medical organizations do not recommend it

no, because his parents were looking after his health and let him have a choice in the matter, this parents were good parents, why should he be able to sue them, might I add 80% of the world is uncut and does not have health problems

it seems that not only are some people not content in not giving their kids a brit milah, but they want to force other parents not to give their kids brit milah despite the fact that they can be 99.9% sure that their kids would want a brit milah as a baby and not later in life, and would even be upset with their parents for not giving them a brit milah as a baby.

pleasure and sexuality and sensuality and brutish lust which is not love but a corruption of what God wants for the people HE created. HE makes the rules. Those who do not follow them are sinners unless they repent and the sins are covered by the Lord's sacrifices for them. YOU are out of your mind to want to live life outside the Torah guidelines, especially for sex in marriage. Your wife probably got cancer of the reproductive tract or many infections or you turned her into a BOB (Bitter Old Bitch) with your lust. I expect to see few males other than the Lord and angels in heaven. There is lots of room in hell for aberent males who don't want the Torah for their guidelines in life.

are basically good while the Bible says people are bad (sin nature inherited from Adam) and must repent and be saved (reconciled to God) to go to the heavenly Jerusalem instead of being eternally separated from God in hell and then the lake of fire.

outside the tent of God. If Moses at 80 did not die from being circumcised, then it unlikely a baby would. Better to go to heaven obeying God and bleeding to death than to go to hell in disobedience when one dies.

of the Lord. What a horrible choice you made for your children who should want and insist on being in God's camp under the protection of the symbol of the covenant of circumcision.

(Torahless) and are more likely to commit sexual sins than circumcised males who at least start out life in the tent of God and under the promises to Abraham with the circumcision covenant. To be Torahless (lawless) is to belong to the devil. The devil's people are more likely to be sexually immoral than those in the Lord's camp, although the Lord's people can and do sin but repent and turn away from sin because the circumcision reminds them of the Torah.

99.99% of your readership have never heard of Richard Dawkins

Thanks for some interesting reactions to the article to date. I wanted to answer a few of the points raised. On the health issue, my point is that for those who say it is a health benefit, why does it not apply to all men not just Jewish men? To Shawn Sanders: bottom line is that it is an active choice not to do it. For those who argue this is harmful, then I am suggesting that parents make all sorts of choices for the children. You may feel it is harmful for them to teach them religion at a young age (Dawkins et al calls this "child abuse"). I'd suggest that this is an extreme and unjustifiable position, with all due respect. Leonora: the rabbinic sources do say some negative things about arelim. Further uncircumcised Jewish men do have some restrictions (though not much impact in practice e.g. not being able to eat the korban Pesach!) Jean-Claude- fair enough, thanks, the article could have covered many other aspects Arieh O'Sullivan - I refer you the report I linked to from a recent Ynet article on decline in circumcisions amongst secular Israelis. The rift relates to the concept of Jewish identity - in religious Jewish terms this is fundamental, if in secular terms it is at best optional then there is a major disparity of view regarding what defines Jewishness. This is part of a broader split which would impact, for example, the extent to which Israeli Jews when they come to the diaspora would get involved with local Jewish communities. Jim T - see my article on fundamentalism which in part discusses the impact of biblical criticism I'd suggest this doesn't mean that the entire religion is without foundation!

And might I add, that as a woman (with no medical training, I presume), you have no right to preach to me about what should or should not be cut off from my penis. I don't think you would appreciate very much if I or any other man forced YOU to go get your genitals mutilated. THAT would be barbaric, now wouldn't it!! (And for the record, I believe that any parent -- male or female -- has no right to amputate a part of their child's body without OVERT medical necessity.)

the books by Mary Walsh. You ranted about hating Ethiopians and other blacks and claimed that a black physician's assistant deliberately tried to kill you... I imagine ynet has your old posts in their archives. Do you need me to publish the quotes and dates to make them easier to find? If you're not a Scientologist then you are, by your own admission (want me to publish the quotes?), the Scientology-books pushing poster girl for "born Jew" Christians. Why am I not surprised? You and Mike are brother and sister in your "Christ"!!!

Contact details for celebrants of Brit Shalom (Brit B'li Milah) are at http://shalom.notlong.com. The list includes some 14 rabbis, so "From a rabbinic perspective, circumcision is central to Jewish identity" can not be entirely true. The fact that it is done to a non-consenting person is increasingly troubling as our understanding of individual rights develops. It raises questions about how "identity" can be imposed by one person on another.

Not orthodox, have one son, was circumsized. Have 2 grandsons, both were circumsized. When grandchildren have sons, guarantee they will be circumsized. There will always be those who want to be different and above it all. Maybe they don't want to be Jews. It's their loss.

hundred years ago. Scientology was invented by sociologist Ron Hubbard in the 1950's and later became a religion. "Dianetics" was Ron Hubbard's cornerstone book on Scientology or what became Scientology. If there is a Mary Walsh who is a Scientologist, it is not the author of the essays about the truths of God and the counterfeits of Satan in the Roman Catholic Church she was a nun for for many years. I hate what Blacks have done to me and to my family such as attempted murder and perjuries and felony vandalism. The Bible says in the last years of the Gentile World Era before the Jewish Messiah comes that nation would rise against nation and kingdom against kingdom. Nation means race and kingdom means government. It is wise to beware of people of another race in these perilous times because race hatred against White people especially is being illustrated daily in the poisoning of food and medical malpractice and other devices to kill those of another race or religion. That is what God said would happen and it is happening. Whenever I trust people of another culture or race or religion I get disappointed and robbed or lied to or attacked the more I try to help them. So I don't help people now unless I am certain they are godly since II Chronicles 19:2 says helping the ungodly brings a curse and helping the godly brings a blessing. You think Blacks and Hispanics are godly as groups? Then why are half the people in prison in America Blacks and a third are Hispanics? There is a genetic disposition toward sexual and criminal attacks by Blacks and Hispanics that is disproportionate to their percentage of the population. Even Jesse Jackson said he gets nervous when a Black man follows him down a street. The Bible says, "My people perish for lack of knowledge." Understanding that most people are not your friends and never will be or can be because they hate God is a strong defense from their evil devices.

You do not believe the Lord is your master, so God's commandments do not apply to you. You are free to do as you like and to ignore what God likes. There is a price to pay, however. When you die you will be consumed with terrors and your torment will be neverending since separation from the Lord you despise will keep you from peace and comfort and eternal life.

What's odd is I don't remember my circumcision, brit milah, and I doubt any of you do either. If you want to say cutting of a piece of useless tissue is barbaric I will not argue with you. But if you want to remain in the covenant of the Jewish people then sorry there is no other choice. We done it for the last 5770 years so why change now.

with attorney, judge, jury, and executioner pakeed the convert. the only court where discussion is limited to pekeed's randomly generated rules and arbitrary definitions of terms that he, and only he, has final say about due his divine "authority" which originates from his (self-composed) "signature block". wa-ha. lighten up, anger boy. you should see someone about those demons that are haunting you. you're taking this WAAAY too seriously.

there is no excuse to mutilate the genitals of children and thsi is an example of how religion makes people say and do disgusting and evil things

With all the edicts like stoning disobedient chidlren, avoiding mentruating women, having raped virgins marry their attackers, impregnating your dead brother's wife, etc., which we manage to largely ignore, why must we cling to this one barbaric human rights violation? Let the owner of the foreskin decide as an informed responible adult. How much more meaningful that would be. The procedure is riskiest in infants (just Google circumcision damage or circumcision death). No national medical association in the world (not even Israel's) endorses routine infant circumcision. On July 16th, it was announced (quietly) by the researchers in Africa that the men they circumcised - while less likely to acquire HIV heterosexually - were 50% MORE likely than intact men to pass on HIV to their partners. Clearly condoms are still the best way to avoid HIV transmisison. To be frank, foreskin feels REALLY good. It's his body and morally it's his decision.

The Obama administration is promoting circumcision for adults to prevent HIV/AIDS and is considering adopting a program for infants to prevent diseases in the future. Circumcision gives a 10 percent benefit for urinary tract infections, 60 percent for HIV and 50 percent for human papillomavirus. My nephew's mother refused to have him circumcised as a baby. At age 15, he had infections and ended up being circumcised in the hospital under general anesthesia. It was embarrassing for him as well as painful and he lost over a week at school. All this could have been avoided had he been circumcised as an infant. It amazes me that some are arguing against circumcision when as we speak, there is a massive campaign by (secular) health organizations to promote circumcision in Africa and other countries for stopping the spread of HIV/AIDS. Israeli doctors were asked to travel to Africa to help perform the procedures.

Who got circumcised. he said it was hard to keep clean, and they had medication kept him free from pain. My father can only retract the foreskin enough to urinate, I shudder to think what's under there. Women who have circumcised men for partners have less incidences of cervical cancer. I heard a black comedian say "you men that aren't circumcised, get that thing cut off, it looks like a turtleneck."

Dan, you ask: "On the health issue, my point is that for those who say it is a health benefit, why does it not apply to all men not just Jewish men?" And for those who say it is an identity issue, why does it not apply to all Jewish people, and not just men?

"For those who argue this is harmful, then I am suggesting that parents make all sorts of choices for the children." Almost all sorts. There is NO other choice they make that involves cutting off an integral, functional, healthy, non-renewing part of his body. In fact there's no other integral, functional, healthy, non-renewing part of his body it's even legal to cut off, and no integral, functional, healthy, non-renewing part at all of hers. Nor does any other choice they make have quite such an irreversable impact on him as an adult. He can learn another language, repudiate their beliefs, go to bed when he wants, but he can't grow back his original foreskin (only a simulacrum with rather less functionality). You may argue that this is trivial, but it's still a substantial assault on his autonomy.

Here's the result of studies,done in Africa, as to how much of an impact circumcision has had in reducing the spread of HIV. The results are so impressive (60% reduction in spread) the CDC may recommend circumcision as a way to stop the spread of HIV. The HIV spread reduction rate of 60%is for male to female transmission. However, there are indications that there may be a small reduction of spread in male to male transmission. A small male to male reduction in HIV transmission, due to circumcision, had been seen in men not taking highly active antiretroviral therapy (HAART). There is quite a lot of articles on the web about this. Search for circumcision and HIV reduction. Here's the URL for the study mentioned above: http://www.healthnews.com/medical-updates/circumcision-on-cutting-edge-aids-prevention-or-is-it-just-skin-deep-3631.html

discuss here , it's not their problem . Rivka at least does'nt hide it , while this guy from Raanana is still trying to deceive everyone by telling lies about himself the ribi yeshua [ = jesus ] believer

Charles, please don't dump those 2 on unsuspecting "goyim." Some of us are pretty decent people. I'm starting to think that they're secretly working for the Muslims. I can't think of anyone else, who makes you want to run from Judaism, Christianity, from whatever other flavor is out there, or makes you hope that there is no God to punish you for occasionally doing vile things unto one's fellow creatures. As for the subject at hand, here's one for you: Two 4 year old boys are in the same hospital room. David asks Billy, “What are you in for?” Billy says, “They took out my tonsils and I can’t wait to get to eat all that ice cream.” David says, “Boy, are you lucky! When I was a week old, they had me in here for a circumcision. Not only did I not get any ice cream, but I couldn’t walk for almost a year.”

thats not the pattern. Don't worry about it.