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PM: Unprecedented prosperity among Palestinians
Roni Sofer
Published: 01.11.09, 13:32
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31. Let's Consider the Endgame...
Mark ,   United States   (11.01.09)
Something along the lines of...two states, a contiguous Palestine defined by a long history before 1967, Jerusalem as a UN protectorate that neither side owns 100%, water rights, and security assurances...let's just go there and allow a new generation to grow up in relative peace.
32. To: Kate at No. 30
Sarah B ,   New York / Saviyon   (11.01.09)
Thank you very much, Kate, for your kind words. I always try to point out the facts. It's the least I can do. It does get tiresome, and I do get demoralized at times, but I will never, ever stop. Thanks again.
33. #2 - I'm sure you read history one time in your life
William ,   Israel   (11.02.09)
but just forgot about it as you sip from the Leftist kool-aid. Stealing water and land?? Well, for one, Pals receive water from Israel that comes from aquifers under Israel and from the Kinneret, also inside Israel. As for land, it's disputed and doesn't actually belong to Pals - never did. Their claim to it is a false premise of historical right, when the world who supports them does so only because they believe Pals have a right to a self-ruled State of their own. Until they agree to peace, they have NO land, NO State, and are in limbo - legally. Killing their children? Funny, one would think the IDF is just taking pot-shots at little Pal kids. And if that were true, how come they so confidently jump on IDF APCs in the West Bank without a fear for their lives? Something ain't right in your logic, son. Prosperity?? Yes, the West Bank economy has grown more than that of the US in the past year and Pals are citing new business, more jobs, and potential FDI influx into the region. That's more than Hamas promises the Gazans. As a top analyst from the Center of Foreign Relations said - the best way to peace is through economics, just as Ireland and Britain did, not through violence as the Pals threaten. Considering the violence and disruption Arafat has brought the Pals, I'd say today they are pretty content. The latest poll showing most fault Arafat with not accepting the peace agreement in 2000 proves this.
34. #6 - Correction: there is a just solution for refugees
William ,   Israel   (11.02.09)
The Pal "refugees" can continue on to live where they are, re-settle in a Pal State, or a 3rd country. They will be paid a reparation but have NO rights inside Israel. In the same fit of justice, those Jewish refugees who amount to many millions now, who were thrown from Arab countries, will be given reparations for lost property, wealth, and basic inconvenience. That's pretty fair when you focus on the real picture and not just Arab propaganda.
35. #31 - Mark - I would agree with you if the UN were trustable
William ,   Israel   (11.02.09)
For the past 60 years, the UN has shown itself as very biased and easily swayed by money and despots. In recent years, the UN objectivity is below zero. Having them have control over Jerusalem will be the same as handing the Arabs the keys. Just look at the efforts made by UNIFIL and UNWRA. Turning a blind eye to illegal weapons and in some cases, aiding the enemy. No sale!
36. :: Sarah B - It is not over yet
Matty Groves ,   Fairport   (11.02.09)
Sarah B you overlook one simple fact: Israel never ended the war with the Palestinian people. Israel is still occupying Palestinian land. Israel is still illegally colonizing Palestinian land. Sarah B the war Israel would not end is not 'over'. There are yet no winners or losers as per your simplistic mentality. Israel tried to colonize Gaza and it failed. Israel has not had Jerusalem recognized as its capital city. After decades Israel has only made piecemeal colonization of the WB. The Palestinian people and resistance has not gone away or diminished, in fact it is the 'biggest threat to Israel' today (after Iran's imaginary nukes of course). Like I pointed out above this 'war' is not over yet, everything is on the table. Sarah B you mention “a two-state solution” please give a definition of what exactly a 'state' is? After that note how this differs from the 'statehood' that Israel is permitting the Palestinians to attain? Sarah B regardless if you like it or not the Palestinians are entitled to statehood to the same degree as Israelis. If you are not willing to afford the same basic human rights that you expect Jews/Israelis to enjoy to other people then you can't expect other people to respect Jews/Israelis. Laughable! Do you mean 'improvements' in the WB like: Curfews and collective punishment? Apartheid roads for Israelis only? Illegal Israeli settlements where no Palestinian can live? The annual destruction of Palestinian olive groves and farmland? Or maybe you mean that big improvement that Israel made: The Apartheid Wall? You know the one, the wall that is cutting Palestinians off from their farmland/neighboring towns/schools/jobs/etc. Sarah B it is *without measure* that you would even try to 'explain' that the Palestinians in the WB are better off under 'enlightened Israeli occupation'! Any creditability you may have once thought you once had is out the window. For anyone to even suggest that the Palestinians in the WB better off because of Israel occupation is simply sad, and disturbing. I believe that *all* people (including Jews/Israelis and Palestinians etc) are entitled to basic human rights and more. I hold no credence to any religious faith. I don't stereotype people racially. And so forth. I think this is fair-minded. I guess we have a meeting of minds...
37. To: No. 36
Sarah B ,   New York / Saviyon   (11.02.09)
You refer to an "occupation." You refer to "colonization." Even the United Nations refers to them respectively as "disputed territories" and "settlements." However, the Hague Conventions govern, not United Nations resolutions. Israel ceded back Sinai in exchange for peace (which has more or less worked) and Gaza, allegedly in exchange for peace. Hamas had other ideas, and sooner or later, Israel will have to take it back. Gazans are, after all, citizens of Egypt. They can go there. Two-state solution means exactly what it says. Two nation states co-existing side by side. Three times, this was rejected by the Palestinians, who preferred to go to war instead. Curfews and most checkpoints were imposed only following the rash of suicide bombings and attacks upon Jews. The intifada exacerbated that. Prior to the renewed violence on the part of the terrorist elements, most West Bankers worked in Israel and crossed freely into Israel. The Wall put an end to suicide bombings and terrorist infiltration. I call that a success. And it isn't nearly the eyesore that is the wall along the U.S.'s border with Mexico. There are some thirty-odd Palestinian terror organizations, each purporting to be the true representative of the Palestinian people. A fractious lot, indeed. The common element that each of these organizations share is the fact that each of their charters calls for the destruction of the State of Israel and the extermination and/or expulsion of the Jewish people. Why on earth would Israel "negotiate" with any organization bent on her destruction? It may suit YOUR political agenda, but it doesn't suit that of the Jews or Israel. We have fought (and won) six wars, and combatted sixty-one years of unrelenting terror. That has hardened our resolve; not weakened it. Over the intervening sixty-one years of terror and six wars, the Palestinians lot has not improved significantly. They were kicked out of Jordan, kicked out of Lebanon (only after managing to destabilize that lovely peaceful country -- you will remember that it was Israel that came to the rescue of the Maronite Christians in the South who were being massacred by the Palestinians). The Palestinians have been kicked out of Egypt, out of Tunisia and even out of the Emirates and Kuwait. Seems no one finds them particularly good citizens. Israel built six universities on the West Bank, Israel built eight hospitals, a host of medical clinics for both adults and children (which in Israel are separate clinics). They built highways, they built a sewage system (no more cholera outbreaks), they brought irrigation systems and forested a land that was relatively bare and unproductive. Israel was the best friend the Palestinians ever had -- until the intifada and the increased terror. The Palestinian Authority has allowed everything Israel achieved for the Palestinians to reduce to rack and ruin. The PA has not maintained the infrastructure; they have done nothing to bring industry to the West Bank, and unemployment -- which was less than 2% while West Bankers worked in Israel -- is now approaching 40%. This despite the billions of euros and billions of dollars in cash aid that has been bestowed upon the Palestine Authority. Nothing to show for it except some hefty foreign bank accounts and lavish homes in Europe for the so-called Palestinian "leadership." State? State? These people couldn't organize a meeting, let alone a State! We will never have a meeting of minds. You are far too polarized in your view and narrow in your scope. I suggest you just kick back and listen to some Fairport Convention (yeah, I caught that; it wasn't all that clever).
38. Sarah B - More rubbish?
Matty Groves ,   Fairport   (11.02.09)
. Even by your second sentence in you posting you are incorrect. The UN *does* refer to 'occupation', eg: "the Israeli *occupation* remains a major obstacle for Palestinian women" http://www.un.org/ecosoc/docs/2008/Resolution%202008-11.pdf Also the likes of Res 242 doesn't anywhere mention "disputed territories" rather it mentions "territories occupied". Sarah B you would have much more creditability if you stopped making this rubbish up. Likewise every other paragraph you have written in your post is flawed or simply the opposite to the actual truth. LOL! A total fallacy. Gazans do not hold Egyptian citizenship. Again to point that Israel has never been willing to grant the Palestinians anything remotely closed to statehood thus negating this notion/pretence of a Two *State* Solution. I won't bother rubbishing the rest of your comments as it is just too easy. If you have actually anything intelligent to say take it to a newer thread.
39. To@36 The loud mouthed woman:
Kate ,   Israel   (11.02.09)
To the loud mouthed woman who persists in her lies without having set foot in our Holy Land speaks volumes. Since Sarah B has already put all the relevant points with all its intricacies pertaining the situation it remains for me to tell Matti ( moron) to desist in her unwarranted accusations. Wonder if she is married to an Arab/Pal in view of her maladjusted comments, which bears nothing to the truth within her post. She holds no credence to any religious faith? Who cares if you do or…This is not about faith,but the survival of Israel. Sarah B has made a good point and you twisted it for your convenience. Whether you believe that the West Bank is occupied and not disputed territory is your problem not ours. Why have you not written on the Gaza problem? When Sharon (in his folly)decided to cede that den of vipers,when successive Israeli Govt’ encouraged our Jews to settle there. Having stayed there for over 40+years working side by side with the Arabs without any problem. The Arabs benefitted not only by working there,but also free to enter Israel proper freely. When we ceded Gaza(Gush Katif) the settlers left all the infrastructures and the amenities they had left a viable city,and made it bloom. Plus were given the “hot houses” to improve their life further. Their contribution was an example how a decent people behave.They worked like Trojans as all our early pioneers did in the 1800. to live Result? Your charming Arabs destroyed everything and turned the whole place to lob their qassams against our civilian population. You are a dolt madam,and have no understanding at all bar you deep hatred toward Israel. It behoves you to read the whole episode,rather than paraphrase inanities written in Arab websites.
40. Arrest Bibi
ChasE ,   USA   (11.02.09)
I think someone should arrest Bibi, if not for war crimes, then for the use of illegal drugs because if he thinks Palestinians are enjoying great prosperity, then he MUST be on something.
41. Farewell speech
X ,   Dallas, USA   (11.02.09)
I would prefer that my government follow the advice in George Washington's farewell speech.
42. Are you really that stupid
mick ,   nz   (11.02.09)
" The Palestinians are pulling every trick out of their sleeves, to avoid going to peace tricks. " "peace tricks" this is the truth since the start of the nekba.
43. #37
Bob ,   Canada   (11.02.09)
hahahahahaha. Consider Israel leaders lucky that ''the Hague Conventions govern, not United Nations resolutions. '' because your country would be in deep trouble, given the number of resolutions IsraHell spitted on, especially when it comes to inspections of your nuclear facilities.... Next time think before u throw up your propaganda like that.... BTw I see the HAsbara dogs are on the loose...
44. So much left for so few
Paul ,   Cairns Australia   (11.02.09)
I suppose Israel has "cleansed" the region of so many Not Chosen Ones, that there is more "wealth" to spread around among those not "cleansed" (yet).
45. To Bob the ha,ha,ha Man who??
Kate ,   ISRAEL   (11.02.09)
Who instead writing in a decent manner descends to hilarty.You sound more like an arab rather than a Christian NOT! Most probably a disaffected islamofascist with A spurious moniker.Hey,no mater how you disguize your true self IT SHOWS A MILE AWAY. Sarah B has made true and valid points which obviously does not please you? TOUGH BABY MORE TO COME YOUR WAY. Excuse me! Our nucler inspections? who the blazesd do you think you are,a nuclear physicist?I bet yiou cannot even count to TEN. having said this much I wish you to bugger off into the stinky bottomless pit you crawled form under.
46. We are not going to give them anything!
Ali Gharaibeh ,   Wollongong Australia   (11.03.09)
"The Palestinians should come to their senses and enter negotiations as soon as possible".....becaue we are not going to give them anything.
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