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Israel's talks with Vatican fail
Roni Sofer
Published: 10.12.09, 19:43
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1. roman empror Benedict XVI doesnt own jewish land
zionist forever   (12.10.09)
The Roman empire is gone & the jews control this land again and its time to take back the land which was stolen by the church. This land is in Israel and the government would be within its rights to confliscate all land belonging to all the various foreign churches especially considering that some of it is the most valuable real estate in Jerusalem. All church land needs to be annexed to the state any lands that the church wants to use then they can lease it back through a series of leases than maybe last around 50 years each. If they want to continue using the land then they pay the rent & if not well the state takes it back and they have to move on. Th church is supposed not supposed to be a business so they don't need all this JEWISH LAND but we will elt them use it for a fee so we cant be accused of persecuting chrisitans. The empror must accept that times have changed and the church can no longer bully the jews and Israel is an independent state and can decide who owns land in its territory. While he is at it he can return the menorah and other Temple objects in the Vatican vaults
2. To be honest with the history of the
Joe ,   Ohio, USA   (12.10.09)
church being responsible for so much hostility, death, destruction and confiscation of Jewish property. I'd say that the Pope can swallow his pride, be humble and display an act of contrition to the Jewish people and forgo all claims in Israel, and make an indemnity payment of some sort in effort to rectify past wrongs. But don't hold your breath waiting for it. Remember it took the church what 600 years to admit wrong with Galileo?
3. Vatican cannot accept stolen Jarusalem from Christians
Tayfun_Turkey ,   Istanbul   (12.10.09)
Jarusalem will never belong to Israel It is a piped dream Soon Jarusalem will be under muslim domination settlers will get unsettled back and packed pact to your countries
4. Then there should be a..
Crusader ,   USA   (12.10.09)
Then there should be a crusaders war to liberate the lands of Christians, wake up Jews your gaining only bthge hatred of the international communities with your polices.
5. The Vatican can pound rocks. Israel owes them nothing.
Raymond in DC ,   Washington, DC USA   (12.10.09)
It's long past time for Israel to insist on its historic and legal rights, and not knuckle under to every demand from outsiders.
6. no need - israel has been administering the site well
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (12.10.09)
if there were some problem that prevented access, then the papists would have grounds for a complaint. to make a religious claim over an alleged site is silly and frivolous, indicative of the corrupt nature of the roman sect. their greed shows their illegitimacy and they deserve to be ignored.
7. Tha "last supper room" is fake
Inquisitor   (12.10.09)
as Catholicism itself, "holy places" etc. Only "holy" wars are real. Killing of millions in the name of god.
8. #4 if you want to reverse the history
Jewish ,   Jerusalem   (12.10.09)
come back to Europe first. Then you can ask Carl Bild and Javier Solana to join Crusade. Afraid you cannot expect to find more idiots for this. And be careful, they will turn to Muslim side very fast passing Iran and Syria on the way to JEWISH Jerusalem.
9. how about some compensation for jewish persecution
zionist forever   (12.10.09)
The cathloic church has been responsible for persecution of the jews for thousands of years. The spanish inquisition was in the name of the catholic church During WW2 the pope who Benedict XVI wants to give sainthood colaberated with the Nazis Time to compensate the jews for this persecution. Nobody will force the Catholic church to leave Jerusalem or give up its main holy places but land being held simply as assets must be returned and a deal must be reached over what they call the last supper room.
10. vatican
sad ,   israel   (12.10.09)
danny ayalon is an IDIOT. he got be where he is as he was at the right spot at the right ime. the man is DUMB, lacks basic education. let hm stay home and take care of his 2 adopted children.
11. Jerusalem stolen treasures
Jerusalemite   (12.10.09)
After the destruction of the Second Temple, 50 tons of gold disappeared from the Temple. Among the treasures was the golden Menorah. Obviously, the Romans took everything to Rome. When one goes to Rome today you can still see the Arch of Titus which shows Roman soldiers coming back to their capital and carrying the Menorah. When Vatican is planning to start negotiations on returning Jewish treasures to Jerusalem?
12. Hold On, Vatican!
Danny Maccabee ,   Vancouver, Canada   (12.10.09)
If the Vatican thought that it had a rightful claim to any land in Israel, then the Vatican should've been established in Israel. Instead, they chose Italy. Too late, too bad, so sad, tough luck, and no way, Hosea!
13. Must be a slow news day. Who cares?
Andrew M ,   Leeds, UK   (12.10.09)
14. 3
zionist forever   (12.10.09)
Th day Jerusalem comes under muslim domination Mecca will come under jewish domination. Jerusalem belongs to the jews and the jews alone there is no place for the muslims and one day the eyesore golden dome on Temple Mount will come down.
15. Re Danny Ayalon:
Robert Haymond ,   Ashdod, Israel   (12.11.09)
I joined and volunteered for Yisrael Beiteinu during the last national election. I met with Danny Ayalon on several occasions both privately and in public and have also heard him speak before a crowd. My estimation is that Danny is an extremely personable man, well educated, speaks English exceedingly well, is modest but self-confident and represents our nation in a very positive manner. If Danny Ayalon was unable to convince the Vatican, then it's likely that the problem lies with the Vatican and not with us.
16. Vatican most reactionary entity in the World
Shamir Was Right ,   Chicago   (12.11.09)
They need money? Let them sell one of their paintings hanging in cathedrals across the globe. They can return Second Temple artifacts stolen in the Rape of Jerusalem in 70CE. Or we can take as long as they did to 'recognize' the State of Israel. Why the hurry? They'll be swallowed by Islam soon anyway, they'll wish they had befriended the Jews compared to what's coming at them.
17. #1 just give it time. they will own it all.
socalmaverick ,   sunny so-cal   (12.11.09)
its not for the beauty of your eyes you've been getting help from Catholics all over the world. it your conversion or else. read and learn. cos
18. To: Joe at No. 2
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (12.11.09)
Yes. The Church forced Galileo to recant or suffer burning at the stake. Exactly the same with Copernicus. Talk about your basic feet of clay .... But the overarching crime is the deafening silence of the Vatican while Jews were being slaughtered during World War II, and the post-war ratline operated by the Vatican which allowed thousands of war criminals to flee Europe on Vatican passports.
19. Israel shouldn't arger 2B Christian, 1.5B Muslims is enough
Bloodyscot ,   Dallas, Texas   (12.11.09)
Some times history repeats itself. Making Rome angry 2000yrs ago cost Israel dearly, please try and make afew more friends and less enemies.
20. Israel and the Vatican
DT ,   TA Israel   (12.11.09)
Situation normal.
21. To 10 , Sad , you are DISGUSTING too
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (12.11.09)
In what are his children related ? Why mention "adopted children" ?
22. The vatican
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (12.11.09)
is the same as the arabs or our own religious ones . They ALL only want to take everything for themselve . They ALL only want rights for themselve , not for others .
23. While the seculars of Israel refuse...
Keren ,   IL-BR   (12.11.09)
...to get grip of its own precious heritage,fakes keep on their way to rob it. And to tell the truth,Religious in the Knesset don't do much to guarantee and secure it. The first subject to be taught in Israel should be its own ancient History, with a constant critical approuch. Israel has failed miserably in that but, hopefuly, will wake up in time.
24. Eusebius: Papacy "fabricated" AFTER 142CE by Hegesippus
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (12.11.09)
The primary church historian, Eusebius, documented that, subsequent to 142 C.E. (!!), Hegesippus Εποιησαμην (epoieisamein)--"fabricated"--the papal succession (see http://www.netzarim.co.il/Museum/Sukkah10/Sukkah10new.htm). Eusebius likewise documented that until 135 C.E. the original Jewish followers of Ribi Yehoshua were led from Yerushalayim by a succession of Peqidim: 15 of them, and Eusebius names them and notes that the first gentile episcopos (bishop=>pope), Mark, forcibly arrogated the office as a result of the expulsion of the Jews, and ouster of the 15th Jewish paqid, from Yerushalayim in 135 C.E. consequent to the Roman defeat of the Bar Kokhba Rebellion that year. All of the historical documentation is widely known in the history departments of prestigious universities around the world. Only the ignorant masses--Christian AND Jewish--don't know. Educate yourself. The "pope"--correctly Mr. Joseph Ratzinger--and the other Catholic offices of "father" and priest likewise are counterfeit arrogations, fake gentile knock-offs, of the succession of Netzarim peqidim--who were (and remain) Torah-keeping Pharisees like their Pharisee Ribi. No surprise that Christians and their misojudaic "born Jew" allies squeal "No, the Netzarim Paqid is fake!" What else can they do when they defy historical documentation? But you don't have to defy historical documentation OR remain ignorant. Educate yourself to the history and be aware. Paqid Yirmeyahu Paqid 16, The Netzarim, Ra'anana, Israel Israeli Torah-reverer (& Orthodox Jew) Advocate for Logic as Halakhic Authority Welcoming All Torah-reverers (Jews & non-Jews) www.netzarim.co.il
25. to #11
Susan ,   Kfar Saba   (12.11.09)
Do you really think the stuff from the Temple still exists? The Romans melted it down and sold the gold which they used to fund building the colliseum. However, the Vatican does have a lot of important old Jewish manuscripts and other things that they stole over hundreds of years of pogroms. I don't think we have anything to talk about until they agree to give us back our stuff.
26. Re #24 Eliminate ). from URL link
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   Ra'anana, Israel   (12.11.09)
The link should be: http://www.netzarim.co.il/Museum/Sukkah10/Sukkah10new.htm without the ")." on the end.
27. 24 , again this TRUE FAKE guy
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (12.11.09)
who is too coward to name those who rightfully say that he's NOT a Jew at all . Return to your church . there you can pray to your ribi as much you want without trying to deceive Jews with your "orthodox Jew" "blessing of the Head Rav' or "ministry of absorption" .
28. Ex-Catholic
Deborah ,   Midwest, USA   (12.11.09)
So, the "Whore of Babylon" is attempting to bully the Jews once again. Wasn't the shameful WWII stance of looking the other way, or actually assisting, while Hitler did his dirty work enough? The Vatican is a multi-million dollar business, nothing more, and should pay rent to use Israeli real estate or get out.
29. Self-Feeding Hate...WHY???
Mike ,   Washington, DC - USA   (12.11.09)
While I agree this particular set of agreements need to be put in place and the right solution arrived at, but I don't understand why almost all of you are spitting such hatred at us Catholics. Have there been issues in the past, yes. I doubt any of us can say that we are without sin, and are perfect? I know I can't. Considering we all pray to the same God, who is merciful, just, and right...why would you all want to keep spewing this hatred? Instead, why don't we pray that the Vatican and the Israeli State can reconcile the differences and come to a solution. We CAN come to an agreement that doesn't involve all of the name calling and slander that you've employed. I will pray for you.
30. 24speaking of documentation, educate us on your lack thereof
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (12.11.09)
so where's your documentation that you are the supposed "16th pakeed"? where is it written that you are israel's 16th pakeed? where are the endorsements that confirm your self-proclamation to this title? educate us on this matter. i expect no answer from you as is your custom when asked.
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