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Ministers to discuss fixing status of Citizenship Law
Aviad Glickman
Published: 17.12.09, 23:35
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20 Talkbacks for this article
1. Suicide Bombers Who Became Israeli Citizens Through Marriage
Wisconsin Marshall ,   USA   (12.18.09)
Here in the States it was reported in the mainstream media that approximately one-seventh of the nearly 250 suicide bombers launched against Israel during the second intifada had become Israeli citizens through marriage. Between 35-40. A strategy? We simply cannot have this. Nor can we have a demographic bomb strategy whereby Israel becomes Palestine, with all that is implied, through the voting booth. Israel with Judea and Samaria is still less than one-half of one % of what is considered the Islamic Arab Middle East. At this point in history, it is inconceivable if not downright illegal for non-Muslims to be citizens of most of these states. No one even complains. Israel already has 20% Muslim Arabs who are legal citizens. Thus there will be one small state in the region which will have a Jewish majority by law: Israel.
2. Apartheid and Racist
Shlomo Kamra   (12.18.09)
Pure and simple. Are you proud?
3. This is close to old US Jim Crow laws and S.Africa Apartheid
Bloodyscot ,   Dallas, Texas   (12.18.09)
I can understand Israel's need to stay Jewish but this is dangerous from view point of World opinion. The US and S. Africa used laws like this to keep blacks and other minorities as 2nd class citizens for years. With almost 40% of US population minorities and growing, it will be hard for Congress not to use this as a campaign issue at some point.
4. Building the apartheid state
Ben Alofs ,   Bangor, UK   (12.18.09)
One would think that after the demise of Apartheid South Africa, Israel would think hard before going down the same road, albeit more sophisticated, as the white South Africans did But here are the foolhardy racists like MK Rotem working hard to expand the Israeli apartheid system in law. The ideology of political and religious Zionism on which the "Jewish" state of Israel is built truly are anachronisms from the 19th century. In the end they will go the same way as South African apartheid and the old racist South of the USA. Palestinians will demand equality and they will not rest until they have it written in a constitution: ALL are equal before the law. MK Rotem makes a mockery of Israel's Declaration of Independence!
5. NOT GRANTING CITIZENSHIP IS NOT A BREACH OF HUMAN DIGNITY
zionist forever   (12.18.09)
This is a law that should have been introduced decades ago. Not giving automatic citizenship to somebody who marries a citizen of a foreign goes on in most western countries. You marry an American you might get the right to live with them but you don't get automatic US citizenship. Certainly the idea of family reunification shouldn't be a justification for granting citizenship. If you have a long lost relative who is a citizen one country and you want to move there to be with them then there is a possibility you will get a residency visa but your not going to get full citizenship just because you have a long lost relative living there. Israel might give automatic citizenship to jews but it also very lax laws for non jews especially arabs. If we had citizenship laws on the same level as countries like the US there would be tens of thousands of arabs wouldn't be here.
6. law and disorder
Shlomo ,   T/A Israel   (12.18.09)
If the MK is so concerned about who can and cannot obrain citizenship then lets also stop the Filipinos and the Thais and the rest of the Migrants knocking on the door. If we are going to make life hard for the Palestinians (who one day some day we will HAVE to make peace with wether we like it or not) then lets go the whole hog and bar everybody else. We apparently have few qualms about 2 or 3 thousand filipinos who have kids live here illegally and apparently believe they can do as they like - but a few hundred Palestinians are going to change the demography of the state?? Lets put our house in order and finally put a halt to those that are defying the law - the Palestinians will one day some day be our economic partners as we develop with them their state (or does nobody know it) Kick out the illegals but show some understanding to others Shlomo
7. NO ARAB CITIZEN SINCE JEWS PROHIBETED IN ARAB STATES
Minuteman ,   Calif --- USA   (12.18.09)
Israel must stop allowing any Palestinian Arab to become citizen of Israel. NO Jew allowed to become citizen in any on of the 23 Arab states. In most cases Arabs moving into Israel to destroy the Jewish state.
8. too6
hana ,   jerusalem   (12.18.09)
you are right as a logic and economic point but i think the social point is the most important .. ..as palastinians will not changed or change the israili sociaty .both know that it is differ but others nationalities will make the dtrange differance
9. #2-4 Apartheid for terrorists is bad?
Rehavam ,   Israel   (12.18.09)
Strange, racist antisemitic remarks go one after other 2,3,4 almost like written by SAME sad person. one who lacks time to mix it in regular talkbacks...
10. 4
zionist forever   (12.18.09)
1) Why should ANY palestinian have any rights in Israel. As long as we refuse to grant them citizenship they have no rights under Israeli law and they cannot simply demand citizenship ad equal rights in Israel anymore than they can demand those things in the UK. 2) There is nothing wrong with religious zionism or the concept of a jewish state as long as thats what the people want. Right now an overwhelming majority of Israelis even the seculars want the country to remain a jewish state. 3) Arabs & jews in Israel generally dislike each oher but the arabs still have equal rights. Sure jews have an automatic right of return whilst non jews do not but thats not discriminating against the arabs its discriminating against individuals who want Israeli citizenship but have not had it granted yet. 5) Most western countries have laws which ban automatic citizenship being granted because you marry a citzen of that state. My own sister married an American she was allowed to live there but she hasn't been granted citizenship. Also can you seriously say that just because you have a relative living in Israel then that entitles you to citizenship? Citizenship laws that say marriage is not an automatic right or that having a long lost relative in Israel are not grounds for citizenship and are reasonable & adopted in many countries around the western world but because its Israel it suddenly becomes a new concept and racist etc.
11. 2,3,4 I'm impressed as usual, no knowledge of history....
The Dude   (12.18.09)
2- Wow what a wonderfully thought out statement. I'm sure it took months of research to come up with some buzzwords... 3-Do you know what Jim Crow laws were? They had nothing to do with gaining citizenship of foreign born spouse. THESE LAWS ENACTED AGAINST FULL BORN AMERICAN CITIZENS. These the literally the "Separate but equal!" laws. The fact that people of certain color couldn't even use a water fountain!!!! If you cannot understand this then you fail an American history class completely. And to combine the next point with Ben Alofs, whom I see still hasn't learned from last time... 4- Apartheid?!?! Do you know what it meant?!? The fact that literally there were three levels of right, Black, Colored, and White and those literally would determine the number (yes number of rights) you have? This is beyond hyperbole, this is just disgusting. Especially from someone like YOU! Who lives in the UK, which SURPRISE has numerous requirements for bringing your spouse to the UK. http://www.workpermit.com/uk/marriage.htm Just one example of the many criteria required... "If you have been together for four years or more outside the UK and you have passed the Life in the UK test, you are eligible for indefinite leave to remain (permanent residence) in the UK without having to live in the UK for two years." Oh, you mean in your beloved Wales they also have rules about this? That you just can't get married tomorrow to any person and bring them into the country? Is this apartheid? Is this the Old American South? Is this Bloodyscot repeating himself? The fact is that equality in the law, does mean special cases just because someone demands. Also you should look at comment number 1 as he brings up a very important point about how suicide bombers have been brought into Israel based on "Family Reunification". Israel has a complete legal right to determine who can gain citizenship and who cannot. Just like the Netherlands, the UK, Australia, the US, and any other country. To deny Israel the rights of any other country and to make special requirements of it, is nothing less than Antisemitism.
12. # 4 You compare beans to oranges
Keren ,   IL-BR   (12.18.09)
Your comment is the "convenient"repetition of a monster created by some minds. There has no comparition between SA and Israel. It is another history,another context ,another everything. Only cynic minds holt yet the kind of arguments you are trying to hold.
13. i have been married to my palestinian wife
(12.18.09)
since 1998 , we have 3 children who are israeli citizens , anyone who dares to deny my wife a residency with full benefets ,is a nazi , and a kahanist . my wife deserves the legal residency status more than 3 quarters of the jews living here , since she and her parents and grandparents were born here , and add to that her husband and three children are citizens and add to that , law obident citizens . as much as i teach my children to be the best israeli citizens that they can be , my children are getting the wrong teachings from people like this idiot ( rotem ) and liberman and katz and unfortianatly ,many other zionists ,who are telling me and my children that we are not humans and dont deserve to live like normal humanbiengs . long live israel ,free of nazi zionists , and free of alqaeda like terrosts...
14. To Zionist forever:
Wildmandxb ,   M.E.   (12.18.09)
In response to your foolish TB at #10; 1- Your question why ANY palestinian should have any rights is as foolish as your arguement. They have the right because THEY ARE THE INDIGENOUS POPULATION..Get it smart boy? You, the zionists, kicked them out and stole their land, whatever other arguement you will try to make to counter mine will never ever have any affect on the facts, it wil only show how much of a lunatic you are. 2- Bla Bla Bla, and more Bla Bla Bla, that's what your point sounded like. 3- So it is ok for jews to have an automatic israeli citizenship as soon as they set foot on that land, but when a palestinian wants a citizenship by marrying an arab-israeli you immediately compare it to laws of other countries? what kind of a hypocrite are you? well now you showed us your true colors , foolish zionist, it's ok for jews but not ok for others! 5- it's weird you skipped number 4!! you just want laws to fit your needs, if laws suit you, then they're automatically great, if not, then hell breaks out! In summary, wacko, palestinians have rights, they have land taken away from them, and as long you deny them this fact, you will be guilty for a very long time!
15. Yes #13, that's the way!
Wildmandxb ,   M.E.   (12.18.09)
Now that's what i'm talking about, your wife, her parents, and grandparents where born there, accordingly they deserve the citizebship more than any of the immigrants who have other citizenships! Guess what, it's those immigrants who are changing the laws to their benefits,, what a disgrace!!!!!
16. #13
Keren ,   IL-BR   (12.18.09)
You are mistakenly living in Israel since you do not belong to Israel. Anyway,in my view,if you pay the same taxes Jews pay,if you swear loyalty to the JEWISH State of Israel,if you and your children go to our Army to fight faithfully at our side ,for the Jews and for our Jewish country,then,and only then I would think about your case ,as long as ALL other potencial new cases like yours are ,by law,put completely out of any possibility to happen again.CLOSED DOORS! Israel should not hear to your BIG WHINING MOUTH anymore,the same mouth who is speaking right now in a threatening way. GO SHOUT ELSEWHERE! Israel must not listen anymore to hyenna-like shouts! Enough is enough!
17. 14
zionist forever   (12.18.09)
Israel did not kick out all the arabs most of them left out of free will. At that time it was arab custom to leave the village when there was war and come back later when the fighting was over. This time it didn't go as planned but sometimes life isn't fair you just learn to live with it. UNRWA is one of the biggest problems they supported the idea that they are all refugees with a right of return. Every other refugee situation in the world is dealt with by the UNHCR and they rehouse the refugees elsewhere as soon as possible & stay out of politics. The youngest REAL refugee was a new born baby in 1948? The arab right of return fantasy is your born a refugee with a right of return. My grandparents were refugees from Nazi occupied Austria but you think I could say my grandparents were refuges so tha makes me one & I am entitled to a right of return? As for the law of return, Israel is one of many countries in the world that has a national religion & like every other country its entitled to choose its immgration policy. Israel choses to give automatic citizenship to jews as its a jewish state & that is its legal right In Israel neither palestinias or any other non citizens have rights only Israelis.
18. comparisons between Israel and Apartheid South Africa
zionist forever   (12.18.09)
In South Africa the white minority ruled over the blacks who were given no rights at all and their crime was having a different skin color. They were not allowed to live in the same naighborhoods. Travel on the same busses They were not allowed to vote or get good jobs even though they were the majority of the population. Own property. If you spoke up against white rule you went to jail. In Israel the arab minority they are allowed to vote, travel & live where they want, own property. If they don't like government policy they can speak up or demonstrate without fear of arrest. There are around 10 arabs in the Knesset & the Olmert government had an arab MK in the cabinet. The problem here is about land. The arab world believes there is no place for a jewish state in the arab dominated Middle East, especially the Holy Land. So they want the land that the jews now have and the jews want to hold onto it. The palestinians are not even an issue they are just a distraction from the real reason behind the arab / Israel conflict. There were no palestinans when the arabs rejected the Balfour Decleration which didn't even give the jews a state just the right to live in an arab majority binational one. They rejected partition in 1947 there were certainly no palestinains & not a single refugee wanting to return. If your looking for a comparison to apartheid in the Middle East then check out Syria and Lebanon where palestinians are not allowed to live outside the camp, there are around 50 jobs they are banned from doing outside everything from medicine - barbering. They are not allowed to own property or take part in the political system.
19. CITIZENSHIP LAW
BEAR ,   ZEFAT, ISRAEL   (12.18.09)
MK ROTEM SHOULD BE COMMENDED. THIS NEW LAW IS LONG OVERDUE.
20. # 16
(12.18.09)
please stay in BR ,thats were you belong , and stay out of our buisness , you are just another zionist , and you can keep on barking , but the world will help you shut your mouth and soon . iam a palestinian living in israel , and thats were i and my children and grand children be , and thats not were you will be , I promise .. israel the land of all its citizens including muslims and christians , and in your dreams ( only jewish ) . and if you have any doubts , come and pay a visit , and see for yourself what iam talking about , i will welcome you at the airport , since you are coming to visit my land ....
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