Opinion
History lesson for Arab MKs
Assaf Wohl
Published: 06.01.10, 00:02
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61. #41, nathan Rai, Wohl is not wasting time.
AK   (01.06.10)
Tibi and people like him around have been poisoning public opinion against Israel unchallenged. As a result a vast majority, and that includes many Jews, have internalized Arab narrative. Your lofty and arrogant assumptions ignore the facts that unchallenged lies repeated long enough become accepted as common knowledge truth. Only by challenging lies with facts can Israel may its case. And if you believe that Israel does not need to make the case, look around Europe and the American campuses and see anti-Semitism raise its ugly head -- this time with deluded Leftist and self-hating Jews landing the hand.
62. Ben Alofs and Matty, best posts on this thread. Bravo!
BBSNews ,   Charlotte, NC   (01.06.10)
63. #6 Avi
EZ ,   US   (01.06.10)
Your post is incorrect. The evidence against it is strong and published in the best peer reviewed journals and readily available. (google Behar American Journal of Human Genetics) Ashkenazi Jews are closest genetically to other Jewish populations around the world (including Sepharadim and even Mizrachim). There are obviously some differences due to small population sizes of the diaspora communities and intermarriage. But the DNA doesn't lie and it says nearly all Jewish communities around the world are genetically from the same original population. If you don't know that you should. if you deny that you are denying truth. Interestingly, this attempt to distort the truth was originally popular in Nazi circles and has since passed - like so many lies - to the Arab Muslim world. As to whether Mr. Zahalka is genetically related to the early Hebrews: that is possible. Much less is known about the genetics of Palestinian Arabs than about Jews. However, it would be interesting to know. If it turns out he's the immigrant, is he willing to go back?? Not that he would be required to. He can stay on, like the whites of South Africa, a former colonist whose colonial rule has ended.
64. #63 Congratulating your own aliases again?
Tahl ,   Ashdod, Israel   (01.06.10)
Sure, why not... No one else will.
65. to 6 Im puzzled how could converts be levi or cohen?
ygalg ,   israel   (01.07.10)
66. Jania (#54) and Eddie (#56): suggestions for reading
Ben Alofs ,   Bangor, UK   (01.07.10)
In Greek and Roman times Judaism saw expansion on a great scale, but eventually lost out to Christianity. When the latter became the state religion in the Roman empire Judaism was forced to the perifery. In the Middle East and North Africa Later Christianity and Judaism were overshadowed by a very successful 3rd monotheistic religion: Islam. In the vast area conquered by the Arab armies Christians and Jews were allowed as 'people of the Book' to practice their own religion, but they had to pay a poll tax. In the long run it was of greater benefit for the majority of Jews and Christians to convert to Islam. Regarding Judaism as a proselytizing religion and the later conversion to Islam I strongly suggest you read Shlomo Sand's book "The Invention of the Jewish People" (2008). Jania, you asked why today's Palestinians did not have any memory of their ancient Hebrew/Judaic past. Muslims and religious Jews have certain elements in common, like not eating pork. They revere the same prophets. I am a Dutch citizen. I was raised as a Roman Catholic until I saw what was done in the name of christianity in the Dutch colonial empire. The point I am making is this: it is not so long ago (1100 years or so) before people in what later became the Netherlands were converted to Christianity. But we do not remember our pagan past. We still have a few festive occasions in the Netherlands that hark back to this pagan past, but most people do not even realize that. In fact it does not take many generations, a couple of hundred years to lose sight of what our forefathers were actually doing. Regarding surnames and place names in Palestine I urge you to read the work of Palestinian historian Walid Khalidi. His encyclopedic book "All That Remains. The Palestinian Villages Occupied and Depopulated by Israel in 1948" (1992; 636 pages), lists in a systematic way all the Palestinian towns and rural villages (more than 400), that were wiped off the face of this earth by Israel: geographical details, land ownership, population, history before 1948, occupation and depopulation, Israeli settlements on village lands and what is left of it today. Just a casual glance will show you that the vast majority of these villages are ancient or built on an ancient place. For a start just Google "Place names in Palestine" and you will see that it is thanks to those pesky Palestinian peasants that the ancient place names have been preserved. Assaf Wohl did not read Khalidi's essential book. So much is painfully clear. Let me end with a quote from Ilene Beatty's book "Arab and Jew in the Land of Canaan" (1956), when she is discussing the validity of claims to Palestine, the land on the crossroads between Africa and Asia: "...When any of the conquerors of the crossroads took prisoners in ancient times they took them from the cities they besieged and captured. They did not take the time and trouble to go out into the remote valleys and ferret out the inhabitants one by one. So we may be sure that from the beginning, the settled population in the rural districts and small villages remained the same. We may be equally sure that the original stock - the ancient Canaanites - remained where they were and their descendants did likewise. It is true that they received an admixture of blood from each of the invaders...., but all these were additions, sprigs grafted onto the parent tree to mingle its sap with theirs."
67. History lesson , well the Israeli version anyway
Avi ,   Israel   (01.07.10)
History lesson, they might find it easy to brain wash school kids but when it comes to thinking adults tehy might have a problem there unless your talking of vulnerable sheep like your average Shass voter.
68. the point?
Avi ,   Israel   (01.07.10)
Good point, that the guy doesn't know history and was making baseless comments. But that is a needle in the haystack point. The main point is that he is criticizing Israels (Barak specifically) actions - this guy sounds like he is Hamas himself. It was the most depressing interview I have seen in ages. How do they let someone like that be an MK? This country is crazy...
69. AK - point taken. you're right
Nathan Rai ,   Bangalore   (01.07.10)
On another note, I hear Israelis sympathising with those Palestinians who had to leave their homes in current Israel. Why do those same Israelis not sympathise with those Jews who had to leave the homes they were born in during the interregnum of Arab rule, those who had to leave their homes during the Arab wars, and those who had to leave their homes in Arab lands during and after the Arab Wars ? Mullah logic / Mullah truth ?
70. I meant #62 of course.
Tahl ,   Ashdod, Israel   (01.07.10)
71. You are not wrong, but...
Michael ,   Here   (01.07.10)
Mohammad, the whole basis for the Israeli- Palestinian issue is rooted in HISTORY.If Jews and Palestinians were living in some other country,I am sure they would have gotten along just fine without fights as we are after all cousins by history. As an Israeli Jew, I have no problems with the Palestinian people, I believe that most of them are good people, that just want to live in peace and get along with others.The main question is, as you have suggested, are we willing to acknoledge the present and accept each other as legitimate neighbors,or continue using History and the past battles as reason to go on fighting. History is being used here as a reasoning for each side to state " We are here and are not going away from here,this is our land" and until both sides understand that ONLY sharing and acceptance of each other's rights to exist here would work ,fighting will go on hopelessly. I consider myself as a Palestinian Jew,no different from Palestinian Arabs, I was born here, I'm not an immigrant, and I have no plans on leaving any time soon.We can and should live in peace with each other.Salam Alekum.
72. #13 berlonski, Fine, lets go there.
ben Ish   (01.07.10)
If you want to dispense with the fact that: - the Jews were granted the land BY LAW. - That not-so-great-Britain blocked Jews from returning to their own land, and invaded by proxy instead. - That there are no peoples extant that were there before. - If they -were- still there, they would have the same rights as any other citizen. - Jewish possession of the land is documented in numerous non-Jewish histories, even by their enemies. You want to ignore all that? FINE. Explain to me, how in all of your above-it-all-ness, that smacks of leftist-lobotomy masquerading as intellectuality, HOW do you justify the idea that Arabs can have their +7 MILLION sq. Km of land, but the Jews should not have even half the 20k sq. Km given to them? How do you reconcile that with all your equivocation and moral relativity? If you dream of peaceful happy world, WHY would you deny one single group, in all the world, of the right to their own land? EXPLAIN.
73. #72 answer
berlonski ,   berlin   (01.08.10)
Ben Ish, your fantasy is running wild. I did not say anything contrary to all the statements that you put on your list. With most of them I even completely agree.
74. Very right
dr.p.josef ,   köln   (01.09.10)
Great !Complitly right. Nobody speak about it,Why ?
75. Who was first?
Chris Horton ,   Worcester, MA, USA   (01.10.10)
The land of Israel/Palestine belonged to the Neandertals before we humans came and stole it from them and started inventing stupid reasons why some humans are better than other humans and have more rights to the land and to the fruits of the land. Zahalika is right about the only thing that really matters here: how do you want to live with each other? As free and equal citizens of a peaceful world building a future together, or like monkeys in a barrel fighting and clawing to be on top as it careens toward its final plunge into the abyss of war and destruction?
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