If you question haredim about halacha, their response is: "this Rabbi says this, this Rabbi says that, this Rabbbi says this, this Rabbi says that". So what does G-d say? For them that is irrelevant. Ignoring the Torah is chilul hashem.

Seems the author was short of material, so dug up this "story". So, this one young man, was unfamiliar with one character in the entire Torah and you make a story out of it? Let me tell you - our young men (and women) learn Torah, Talmud, Shulkhan Aruch and Mussar continually. Their knowledge of biblical characters is generally excellent.

What are you talking about lady? Have you done a poll? Did you talk to how many peple before writing this article? I can say the same thing about seculars--have no IDEA about Judaism and Jewish culture. What they learn in schools amounts to a big fat 0 plus hatred for Judaism from the media, and I know it I was one of you. I heard students who have no idea who Ben Gurion, or Begin were, your own secular leaders.

One young man, and an entire article based on spurious evidence..shameful. Now we really need to teach you a lesson.

I think it's a good point to notify this problem, but I think it's only a first step. We have rather than exposing the problem, find a way to take advanrage of this situation, to create a common academic program with the haredi to lead to reconciliation to a common culture, that would be a common basis to Am Israel, not only Israelis, but to all Jews in the World !!

Christian evangelicals are very often more knowledgable in NaCH than many Jews, whether they are Haredi, Dati Leumi, Mesorti or Reform. I agree that more emphasis should be placed on NaCH in all Israeli schools. It is silly to point a finger at Haredim when most non-Haredi schools are deficient in this subject.

The time honored system used to be that children were taught TaNaCH and knew it well prior to Talmud. The modern Charedi concept is that Torah is (only) Talmud plus the Parsha. This creates a glaringly ignorant class of people who do not know prophecy, and who do not understand the importance of Eretz Israel, and their fellow Jews. It furthers the importation of the Galut into Eretz Israel in the form of Polish dress and corrupted Hebrew. It prevents the building of the Temple and holds off the coming of Moshiach.

I have often come to debate haredi (even rabbis) about the subject of King David (oh what a tzadik!) and his crimes which he did not commit like murdering Uriah and Amasa and others through the hands of Yoav. And what about Ma'acah? NO! she was not a convert! She was not a war bride! She was not married and David did not murder her husband then took her as a concubine. No! David as King of Israel sat on a rock and composed poetry! And his son Solomon another Tzadik! Tzadik tzadik who practiced idolatry after building the temple. But I guess these are minor characters in the "toyrah." And what about this? Rav Hun stated, whoever engages in torah study only is like one who has no god. Avodah Zarah 17b I would love to hear how the Haredi public that live a life of "study" interpret this... I bet its "you can;t just learn the toyrah you must also do the mizvoys." How convenient.

Instead of knowing Bible and Talmud, they read Bible only through the talmudic lense. The problem is that Orthodoxy created saints (namely, the posskim), who tell us what the KB"H meant - no one is allowed to judge by themselves. And this is why Orthodox Rabbis don't like Chilonim who study Thora. Just read Rav Sherlo last week in the Shabaton. A disgrace! Every Jew should study Thora!

and why did you not mention who the figure in your article was? Basically, what is your point?

it is difficult to teach both. The logic and evidence is sometimes not there and it is easier to just accept the talmud on faith (which is not acceptible to most jews). Only G-d and the Torah can be accepted on faith. Therefore, for the Haradim, it is understandable to just avoid the whole problem and just teach the talmud. Students really shpould have to read the Torah and make interpretations for themselves and argue about meanings. The talmud should be used in these arguments too. The Karaite Jews believe this and it is probably a better and more invigorative teaching method.

Doesn't sound like such a paradigm of Jewish culture to me.

Rabbi Yehuda Halevi. Rabbi Kook, Bialik, Alterman, Amihai, Leah Goldberg, Rachel the Poetess, Amos Kenan. I get you. Enough said.

Only AFTER one is first well-versed in Tanakh, is it then essential to be familiar with the discussions in Talmud and Rambam. Those who aren't well-versed in Tanakh can't discern between arguments of sages and silly fables. Torah is NOT difficult that you need anyone to go to the heavens or across the sea for you: Devarim 30.11-14 (12) Would that the entire kindred... Would prophesy, be prophets; ומי יתן כל-עם י--ה נביאים כי-יתן י--ה את-רוחו עליהם be-Midbar 11.(27-)29. New Covenant is NOT the Xn "New Testament." Yirmeyahu defined it as the TORAH written WITHIN them, written onto Yisrael's heart... Yisraeil will no longer teach... for all of Yisraeil will know Me... (Yirmeyahu 31.30-33) I will pour My Spirit upon all flesh, Yisrael's sons and daughters will prophesy, Yisrael's seniors will dream, and Yisrael's youths will see visions: Joel 3.1-2; 4.1. Paqid Yirmeyahu Paqid 16, The Netzarim, Ra'anana, Israel Israeli Torah-reverer (& Orthodox Jew) Advocate for Logic as Hermeneutic Halakhic Authority Welcoming All Torah-reverers (Jews & non-Jews)

Bible, Talmud Shulchan Aruch and Star Wars are all nonsense. Complete waste of time without any relationship to the real world. They are just brain numbing narcotics. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS GOD, IT IS HUMAN INVENTION IN MANY DIFFERENT FORMS AND EXPRESSIONS. Just stop that nonsense.

There is no way to justify an article about "Jewish ignorance" aimed at the chareidi sector of society who are the only ones keeping real Jewish study alive. The secular people who study Torah often only do it to compete with the religious and claim that the religious do not have a monopoly on the matter. The real Jewish ignorance if you are concerned about it that is, lies with the secular who are so brainwashed they cannot even imagine thinking about what it means to be Jewish and what the Torah is. They hear the word torah and associate it with some political party and run. Jewish values and education including real halacha should be taught to all secular Jews as well to give them options. Currently every secular Jew has only the option of being secular since they have never learned the value of being observant. This is closed minded and in my opinion a form of brainwashing and secular coercion.

You want us to believe that you spoke to a chareidi yeshiva bachur? And he is from a top notch yeshiva? I assume you are a woman? So tell me - what are the odds that a top notch yeshiva bachur will speak to a woman? Either the kid was not top notch, or you simply made this all up.

Maybe he is refering to Prison culture as Shas and Prison seem to be such perfect bed fellows in fact 7 Shas MKs so far jailed for serious offences of mis trust , corruption and theft of public funds. All this from behind prison bars, while preaching to others " i am hollier than thou" well apparently not.

Take it another step, the bible is based upon the myths and legends of the ncient middle east, egypt, canaan,etc. You are accusing the religious for not knowing the bible which is just so much bube mayse.

The Charedim teach the talmud and some bible.. pray a lot.. and then when they realise they have zero skills and are unable to provide for their families.. they turn to the state for handouts... and become international beggars.. There was a time when i used to see a man with a beard travelling and i was curious to see where he was from and what his experiences are.. now i run a mile from this ignorant age old beggar breeders.

if it is not socialy or nationaly have no benifits of it .. i think you pray for yourselfe but religion as a knowledge must affect evry one benifite to evry one no need to people study religion forthemselves or to run from work or military services

Once when I was in the West Bank with Chareidi relatives I heard many idiotic remarks such as these two: Echh, they (the Arabs) keep their animals on the lower level of their houses and they (the Arab men) dress in long dresses and keffiyahs. I answered that this is how our forefathers also lived. My relatives shut up quickly. Maybe they thought that Avraham Avinu, Yitzchak, and Yaakov wore knickers and streimels. One thing for sure, if our forefathers had wanted to enroll their children in today's chareidi yeshivas, they would not have been accepted...since they weren't Ashkenazim, didn't know Yiddish, etc, etc.

LOL!!!!!!!!! & SOOOOOO RIGHT!!!!!!!

And of course, the Haredim have the free choice to study philosophy (like Rambam), medicine (for pikoua'h nefesh), and so on... The riots in Jerusalem, and moral's squad, protection of abusive Parents, is it not coercive?!!!

I teach them things.

you said something? you take people from different times and different bg, most secular and not among the living, your point?

part, consists of all component of Jewish life and the evolvement of those components throughout Jewish nearly 4,000 years of history. Those other components include first and foremost the Book of Books, the TaNakh, with which for the most part the Haredi community is not familiar. But it goes beyond that. It include Jewish languages and first and foremost among them is Hebrew. Listening, is embaressing for the lack of proper use, e.g. male vs. female, the use of time, e.g. past, present, future; the inability to hear the difference between singular vs. plural. indeed, they seem to have no respect to one of the very first building blocks of Jewish civilization. And of course, members of the Haredi community exhibit at times total ignorance of Jewish history, the developments of ideas, movements, Jew literature, diaspora communities and the their developments and nature and the contribution of Jews to other world civilization. And finally, their negative attitude towards Israel and Zionism cause them, it appears, to know next to nothing about the history of the non-violent national liberation movement of the Jewish people: Zionism and its most important outcome, the state of Israel. The little they do know about Israel is how to get more and more funds; money that was earned by other working Jews. In that sense they behave like extortionists, protectionists: Give me your money or else, since I don't work and don't sustain myself and you, being the ass of the Masssiah must sustain me.

When a cow births for the first time, the newborn falls under the rules of the firstborn (in the words of the Torah, "that which opened the womb"); it must be brought as a sacrifice in the Holy Temple and the priest eats of its flesh. Even in our times firstborn animals are forbidden for eating until they have become disfigured; then they are permitted. (The disfigurement can be as small as a wound to the ear.) But before the newborn is subject to the laws of the firstborn the sages required conformance to a great number of details. Thus, for example, a firstborn animal delivered by Cesarean section (in the words of the sages, "which comes out of the side") is not subject to the sanctity of the firstborn and is not considered a firstborn, because it did not come forth through the womb and the birth canal of its mother. The Talmudic sages indulged in polemics and debated a case in which a firstborn was covered with some sort of covering while still in its mother's womb and then removed. (The covering would separate him from the walls of the womb.) Is he to be considered a firstborn? They went on to ask about a case in which a rat swallows the fetus while it is still in the womb and removes it from there. Do the laws of a firstborn still apply? What is the rule if a rat swallowed the fetus while it is still in the womb, removed it from there, and then returned it to the animal's womb, from whence it made its way out on its own? Was this second exit considered a natural birthing, and so the calf is considered a firstborn? And what is the rule if the dairy farmer placed the wombs of two cows next to each other, so that one cow births its calf directly into the womb of a second cow, who then births the calf to the outside world? Is the calf considered a firstborn? (These questions are not answered in the Talmud.) (Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Chullin 70a)

that was so to the point. Very funny.