Anger in IDF over surge in probes
Hanan Greenberg
Published: 16.07.10, 16:00
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20 Talkbacks for this article
1. Political correctness does not win wars.
Terry ,   Eilat - Israel   (07.16.10)
Rules of engagement must not become a hindrance in achieving a military mission. Lawyers will not win any victories on the battlefield. What has happened, and this is a deliberate campaign of propaganda, is that all these phoney human rights organizations have sensitized our military, the goal is to paralyze us into inaction & slander our military. America is doing the same thing in Afghanistan & they will lose because of it. War cannot be santitized, we cannot fight a war if every soldier has a lawyer behind him. There is an excellent article on this subject at SULTAN KNISH blogspot.
2. Israelis - We're putting OUR kids at risk!
A Jew ,   Israel   (07.16.10)
For everyone that has a child, or relative serving in the IDF, I ask you, what are we achieving? By making our soldiers have to think like courtroom lawyers, or ambassadors to the UN, whilst on the battlefield is total madness! By keeping quiet on this crucial issue YOU are putting YOUR loved one at risk. Is this what you really want? We should learn from history that appeasement does not work. This series of investigations is good for our enemies and bad for us because it makes our soldiers think twice before even making 'reasonable' acts of war. How do our enemies act on the field? How do our enemies treat our captured soldiers? Together, we should decide what's more important.
3. the officers are right
officer myself ,   idf   (07.16.10)
in gaza noone is being punished for war crimes, for terror attacks and for murder, etc. it's like the wild west over there and everyone has it's own law, and all this under the name of "resistance". resistance my anus! my brother got killed in gaza and i was almost brought before a judge because of something not even mentionable... i'm sick of it, one more incident like this and im out on Profil 21. no more...
4. none of them should be investigated beacause
avrom ,   bet shemesh   (07.16.10)
it appears that they are only investigated and convicted to appease western puplic opinion therefore it is impossible that they have a fair trial as the poor soldier who was unfairly convicted for the deatth of Tom Hurndall therefore any conviction is suspect When Hamas start prosecuting their terrorists for war crimes against Israeli civilians and the illegal kidnap of Gilad Shalit we should investigate Israeli soldiers otherwise it is not a level playing field
5. These investigations are meaningless
Palestinian ,   Refugee   (07.16.10)
"It is convenient to show them we are scrutinizing senior officers" They do this to pretend they care, as if they acknowledge that a crime has been commited but behind this fake facade there is no remorse and no real punishment to these war ciminals. Do they really think that their PR and propaganda plans are going to fool the world forever? Eventually people will notice that what you say is the opposite of your actions. The demolition of Palestinian homes to build further settlements while speaking of a desire for peace is a prime example of how what is said is followed through with actions which contradict it, and here, we see it again. It is becoming a tiresome story which in time will be revealed as nothing more then continuous lies and deception.
6. Don't tie the hands of our noble defenders
lily   (07.16.10)
NOT SO long ago, it would have been inconceivable for any sane Israeli to accuse our sons of war crimes. The public outcry would have been deafening and those defaming our soldiers would have been pariahs. There are laws in a democracy which protect an individual from defamation and punish those who besmirch the innocent. Israel is at war and the battle for minds is a key component. To besmirch a nation by falsely portraying its soldiers as wanton murderers is an act of infamy that would be treasonable in most countries. Allowing degenerate nihilists the right to promote outright lies not only undermines national morale, it also compromises our security. Legislation should be introduced enabling the prosecution of those knowingly disseminating slanders and defaming the nation whilst endeavoring not to curtail freedom of expression and also to oblige groups obtaining funds from foreign governments to register as foreign agents. Read more at:
7. JAG
Ricardo Macher ,   Karnei Shomron IL   (07.16.10)
I have been writing against JAG for a while. Seems to be that I am not alone!!! We need to gather firms against Mandelblit and Barak (his boss) to keep their hands out of our children!
8. Our soldiers
michael Pielet ,   boca raton, usa   (07.16.10)
when my sons were serving in the Israeli army in fighting units I told them when an arab threatens you, put a bullet in the arabs head. I do not care what your officer or commander tells you. Your job as a soldier is to protect the country to the best of your ability and come home to your parents, ALIVE. the worst that can happen is that you will sit in jail for a while and we will hire the best lawyer for you. This article is serious and very scary. Do not forge,t no soldiers, no army, no Israel.
9. # 5
Birdi ,   Israel   (07.16.10)
"The demolition of palestinian homes to build further settlements" huh? there are no settlements in Gaza. What are you talking about?
10. IDF not a separate entity
Ussishkin ,   Tel Aviv Israel   (07.16.10)
If the IDF malfunctions, if its senior officers make mistakes, if its lower ranks commit crimes, this agent of the state and its people must be accdountable for its actions and not above the law. we already have a settler state that is attached to and protected by the state and consistently floyts the laws of the land and answers only to its own version of God. We ca n't afford yet another entity that feels its above the laws of the land. So senior officers are angry What have they got to hide? They are the servants not the masters of the nation.
11. appeasement
alexi   (07.16.10)
idf officers are mostly right in their complaints. Yoiu have an enemy that fights dirty and arabs use the most primitive bestial tactics. And israeli soldiers are supposed to go into the ovens so they can say they upheld goldstone and the UN committee on human rights which consists of the worst regimes in the world??!! Of course idf has to use human shields, has to gas, use stink bombs, fuel air devices and whatever to counter hezbollah and hamas terror. Instead they kiss erdogan's ass. jews still have the servitude gene and they cannot expunge it. Always take the other side, believe in fairy tales, in beilin, olmert, barak, peres; even bibi is weak and capitulates. israel should beam 24/7 that ancient israel was stolen by the arab and that jordan sits on israeli land and israel wants it back.
12. # 6 - "Noble Defenders"?
Doug ,   Rochester, USA   (07.16.10)
Many Israeli soldiers are noble. But too many are war criminals that seem to enjoy terrorizing, humiliating and killing innocent civilians. The 43 years of occupation and colonization and land grabbing has slowly turned Israel from a humane country to a brutal country. And Israelis were not the defenders. Israel and Hamas had a truce that was working. Israel unilaterally broke the truce, which eventually resulted in Israel invading Gaza.
13. Beyond scrutiny,...
split ,   USA   (07.16.10)
Anyone remember the outcome of this case? This dude was found not guilty and got promotion shortly after.
14. Why should Israel protect Coward Officers who avoid fighting
Tayfun_Turkey ,   Istanbul   (07.16.10)
with hamas and instead killing civilians? Do not you send your soldier to clean out and settle accounts with "terrorists"? But most of your officers and soldiers hide in Gazzan houses, write long hate messages on the wall, looted houses and steal valuables and credit cards, kill civilians and then get out of their caches and pretended Heros? I am against Zionism in any way and any case but I distinguish this issue: To have an enemy is one thing and to have an emeny full of liars, thiefs, cowards espcaping from confrantation with fighters(in fact Hamas is not more brave than IDF at all) but kill civilians etc. NO BODY WILL ACCUSSE ISRAEL (INCLUDING ME) IF IDF KILLED 2 000 HAMAS ARMED FIGHTERS instead of 500 Children Can we reach to a common point?
15. Racist IDF operates with impunity
Steve Benassi ,   Silver Bay, MN USA   (07.16.10)
IDF has no native Palestinians in its ranks and can kill them with impunity.
16. #12 Doug - PROVE it!
CK Tan ,   Singapore, Singapore   (07.17.10)
(retry) "Israel and Hamas had a truce that was working. Israel unilaterally broke the truce.." Or so you CLAIM. Well, PROVE it! Show me ALL the news of events that happened between Jun and Dec 2008 that CLEARLY show it was Israel who broke the truce. BTW, here's a HINT for you : - Truce (noun) - a suspension of hostilities for a specified period of time by mutual agreement of the warring parties; cease-fire; armistice. 2nd hint - REGURGITATING lies is a HALLMARK of rabid Israel bashers.
17. #4 - None should be invetigated for War Crimes?
Doug ,   Rochester, USA   (07.17.10)
Because it is only to appease the Western Public? The same Western Public that supported you when your people were being executed by the Germans and prosecuted them? The same Western Public that supported you until your crimes against humanity became too numerous to ignore? So if the Western World should not investigate War Crimes, who should? The "neurtral" Israelis? Or the "neutral" Hamas? Or the "neutral" Iran?
18. Better the officers should resign as a
jason white ,   afula,israel   (07.17.10)
group. And the combat soldiers turn in their weapons. Why risk life,limb and liberty to defend Israel? Whatever a soldier or officer does in a dangerous situation, they should be backed by the state. They should refuse to cooperate with the jag and the m.p.s. The jag and m.p.s should be thrown out of any base they visit. They are not real soldiers and they are like poodles that want to please their masters, the u.n., eurabian union,the White House and c.n.n. Not to mention the anti Israel n.g.o.s. All areas that the military operate in should not have any news agencies present. All foreign agitators should be arrested, sent to prison for a year and then deported.
19. #16 - Proof, per your request
Doug ,   Rochester, USA   (07.17.10)
Here is one of numerous articles about Israel breaking the truce:
20. #19 Doug - as EXPECTED, it is SELECTIVE AMNESIA
CK Tan ,   Singapore, Singapore   (07.17.10)
"Here is one of numerous articles about Israel breaking the truce". NUMEROUS articles, Doug? And you can ONLY show me ONE that is well-loved by RABID Israel bashers as PROOF when I asked for ALL. My TOES are LAUGHING. Of course you would IGNORE that way BEFORE this incident, hamas and its affiliates BROKE the truce NUMEROUS times, e.g. from this Reuter's report dated 22 Oct : The truce has largely held, although Gaza militants occasionally fire rockets into Israel, which responds by temporarily closing its borders with the coastal territory. Now NOTE the DATE, Doug and tell me again that "Israel unilaterally broke the truce". Hint (repeated for your CONVENIENCE) : Truce (noun) - a suspension of hostilities for a specified period of time by mutual agreement of the warring parties; cease-fire; armistice. 2nd hint (repeated for your CONVENIENCE) - REGURGITATING lies is a HALLMARK of rabid Israel bashers.
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