they were always welcome to serve. many do serve in the idf and iaf especially the muslim beduins and druze citizens. many have high careers and posts in the iaf and idf. however, most arab palestinians are not allowed b y their parties in the knesset to belong to the army in israel. it is not that israel doesn't want. it is that the arabs refuse. they refuse to even do national service out of the army. hameed aboughaze, iranian

How dare anyone say that!

This people enjoy the freedom and everything this country got to offer but when it comes to give something in return they don'T give a crap. The numbers speak for themself: Los Angeles, Alta California - November 14, 2003 - (ACN) The Jewish Journal of Greater Los Angeles made a startling revelation today when writer Phil Shuman wrote, "Only some 3,000 out of 1.4 million active duty servicemen and women are Jewish, about two-tenths of one percent. When it comes to Marines, the numbers are even more startling. It’s one out of 1,000. One-tenth of one percent."

Your irrational hatred for the only Jewish state, your accusations of "divided loyalties" (an anti-Semitic canard that pre-dates Israel's existennce) demonstrates why Israel was created in the first place: to protect Jews from people like you. By the way, Israel's legality is enshrined in UN Res 181, and by the major powers that recognize Israel, and the scores of lesser powers that also extend recognition to Israel, including extensive trade and political ties. This entity is indeed legal.

Anyone who joins a foreign army should lose US citizenship. US has been a war with Germany twice in the last 100yrs and we put most of the Japanese in camp during WW2. Loyalty is important and joining an army is the greatest loyalty so they should become Israelis and give up US citizenship.

I also went to Mikveh Alon. I came to the country on my own and not part of any program. I have finished my 3 years (yes 3) in Gdud 50 (Nahal Paratroopers). If I hadn't gone through Mikveh Alon I wouldn't have had a sufficient level of Hebrew to finish my service and continue my life here in Israel. While you may think Mikveh Alon is a waste of time, there are many others that would swear by it. Because unlike regular ulpans which teach you fancy Hebrew, Mikveh Alon teaches you spoken Hebrew and slangs used in the army which is critical to the service.

Single raced army? Not the IDF which also has Muslim (mostly Beduin) and Druze soldiers. They are volunteers too. There are many Israeli Arabs in the police force (at least in the Galilee). No one is slaughtering their people. If the Arabs would have accepted the existence of the State of Israel, we would not be having this discussion.

Mikhvei Alon provides alot of benefit to alot of people, and yes some people go in with the wrong attitude, but they were going to be disillusioned with the army soon enough anyways. Too many Yanks come and think they'll be given a gun and a terrorist to shoot, but things are more complicated. Speaking Hebrew is an important base. And yes it will be 19 year old girls teaching it to you. When you work with field intelligence in the field (which it sounds like you never saw), you will also work with some highly impressive 19 year old girls. Anyways, each persons experience depends alot on the people they were with, sorry to hear you're so bitter.

Those numbers prove nothing because many Jews decline to declare their religion during service and there is no agreement on who is a Jew anyway. How does Mr. Shuman count soldiers who have one Jewish parent?

we need here in Israel. Not the elderly and sick. Not fake jews coming for the benefits. Not even middle aged ones that will not serve and maybe their children will also not serve. When I joined the I.D.F., I saw how many fellow soldiers younger than me served for six months,because they had a wife and baby. Those of us who were not married served much longer. Everyone should serve and do the same amount of service. No one who is ineligible to serve should be allowed to make alyah. Those that born here or came when they were young enough to serve and did not should go to prison.

their army service? There are many former members of the J.D.L. who have served and still live here. I served in a combat unit till age fifty as a combat soldier. I came from the states and have been here for 35 yrs. We need the J.D.L. types and not the leftist types that will sell out Israel. J.D.L. types love Israel and their fellow Jews. They do not take money from the enemies of Israel to help destroy us.

Basically, there is no contradiction. If you want to stay in the army for a few years, yes, there is some value to Michve Alon. The thing is that what they do is very inefficient and those specific 19-year-old mefakdot are not the brightest type. If you have enough self-discipline, you can learn many things on your own and much more efficiently. Many don't and perhaps the kindergarten atmosphere is appropriate for them. Now, the problem is that _MOST_ participants have no plans and do not want to sign up for 2-3 more years. They go through this kindergarten and then get sent to some low-level "jobnik" army work, where they waste what remains of their term in the army. For those people that have nothing to do with their lives, and there are many such people, this is OK. Now, the question is "What does it have to do with defending the country?"

I lived and worked in Israel and totally disagree with those Americans who fight in the IDF. Marcus was SENT by the US to help Israel after fighting in WWII. I joined the Army and fought in Vietnam, not some foreign army because I am an AMERICAN. Had I been ordered to Israel, then fine, but I was sent to Vietnam. If you work and do something for Israel, like I did, then fine. You fight for that country instead of your own then stay.

Yeah, right ;) ,...

We don't need that kind here ....we never have... TATA

Except make it possible for you to live there... TATA

There's no such a thing like devided or dual loyalty, period - Either you pregnant or you not, pick one,...

You cite a 2003 article that alleges that only 2/10th of a percent of active-duty servicemen in the US armed forces are Jewish, as if that is proof of lack of patriotism among US Jews. What you omit is that Jews only constitute about 1% of the US population, and that in any case only about 1% of Americans of any religious or ethnic background serve in the all-volunteer US military (in contrast to Israel, where there is a mandatory draft for all citizens fit to serve). In total, there are probably a few hundred American-born Israeli citizens serving in the IDF doing their mandatory duty as they are required to do as Israeli citizens in the Israeli forces--there are still more US Jews in the US army doing volunteer service in the US.

So. If those American jews volunteered to fight with the Germans in the second World War, they'd be welcomed back home with open arms? Like hell they would! They're nothing other than traitorous scum! Oh, and there's no such place as israel unless you jews are planning on renaming the U.S.A. as israel.

Did you just cut & paste from the top of this anti-Semitic piece of drivel? http://www.aztlan.net/jewsusarmedforces.htm Got yah!!

You write that Israel doesn't need middle aged olim with no army experience--this is the kind of comment that discourages me from making aliyah--I am about to turn 40 and the profoundest regret I have in my life is that I missed my chance to serve in TSAHAL. I speak Hebrew fluently and love the country, but fear I can never be a real Israeli because of this--from bar mitzvah age I wanted to move to Israel (my family traveled there for my bar mitzva) and afterwards I concentrated on making sure my ivrit was near-perfect with aliyah in mind. I lived on a kibbutz after high school with the intent of making aliya and serving in TSAHAL, but guess what, I "postopned" my dream and gave in to my mother's nagging to come back to the USA and go to college. I thought I'd make aliya and serve in the army after college, but postponed it a bit more for law school--then I was 30 all of a sudden (the age where you are too old to be drafted) , then married, then divorced, now my parents are elderly and need my care. I will probably not make aliyah until my 50s, if ever. So what you are saying is Jews like me who really want to contribute to Israel but for personal reasons failed to serve in TSAHAL should just stay in America. Thanks for confirming my greatest fear,

The U.S. is at war, two wars. Why don't they join the U.S. Army? To me it shows where their loyalties lie. I am a Hispanic American, I did not join the Army of my former country, I joined the US Army for 29 years. That is why so many, question American Jews loyalty to the U.S., and with their actions, reasonable thinking men, really have no choice but to have those doubts. And let's face it, Jews have that problem of questionable loyalty not just in the U.S. but in every country in the world.

TO: Mikey ,SomeWhere OverHere Jews are 3% of U.S. population, and their number are underrepresented in the US Military. You said that any religion constitute only 1% of the US Military, and you are so wrong! 44% called themselves protestants, and 24% called themselves Catholics. Jews and Muslims are 0.3%. Muslims are a smaller population with many of them not eligible to join. Buddhist! Yes, Buddhists are 0.2%. That begs the question then, are American Buddhists more patriotic than American Jews? You answer that for me. I served for 29 years in the US Army and I have first hand knowledge of those numbers.

Serving with the IDF will automatically label them war criminals. Let's hope they stay in israel. Let's hope they refuse to kill anyone, including US citizens.

Here we have plain as day the fifth column in the United States. These individuals are all Israel firsters and don't give a damn about the USA. What do you expect though? The talmud teaches them that gentiles are nothing but goyim trash. What you are witnessing are the next Rosenbergs and Pollards that will be stalking American institutions and passing themselves off as "art students". They should be stripped of their US citizenships and barred from returning.

They constitute over 2% of the US population and a lion share of the enlisted are not in combat units.

You don'd expect to find those numbers in NY Times or WS Journal, do you?

Machal doesn't actively recruit.

As a religious jew the israeli army simply has everything i need and caters to me without my having to complain to the authority's about it. As a religious jew i can't even turn on a light on the sabbath. Tell me which would you choose in these circumstances. Not only that, we are not fighting exclusive wars we are both fighting to the same end, to do our part in ridding the world of terrororists, If it makes you feel any better pertend i am fighting in the american army based in israel, protecting the only democratic country, the only country with American Ideals in the middle east. Write back.